Ramsdale vs Henderson

[wizadry]

Forget Ramsdale, can we start comparing Hendo and Kelly now?

He’s a long way to go to get to the standard of Akan Kelly, he’s well on his way though at such a young age.

 

[Ranmoorblade]

He’s a long way to go to get to the standard of Akan Kelly, he’s well on his way though at such a young age.

Correct, Kelly was a class apart.

 

[GymClassHero]

We've generally had good keepers tbf. Tracey, Kelly, Kenny, Hendo to name a few. Also had our fair share if stinkers cough Simonsensen**cough Gerrard

 

[FriethBlade]

Article on The Sun website saying we are targeting Tamsdlas Hendos replacement. Says we sold.him for 1m and can expect to pay 15x that to get him back.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Article on The Sun website saying we are targeting Tamsdlas Hendos replacement. Says we sold.him for 1m and can expect to pay 15x that to get him back.

Is he afghan ?

 

[BettingBlade]

Article on The Sun website saying we are targeting Tamsdlas Hendos replacement. Says we sold.him for 1m and can expect to pay 15x that to get him back.

In that case, we can expect Bournemouth to have our pants down.

 

[Cheesebored]

Is he afghan ?

Stop hounding him.

 

[Bladezz]

For me Ramsdale is a lot better on the floor and with the option of him being out GK for 10 years it makes sense.
Deano distribution isn’t good enough for the PL but he makes exceptional saves. But occasionally lets an easy goal in. We all know DH destined for great things if he keeps working but I would rather the mistakes are to better our own young GK.

 

[ATL Recs]

For me Ramsdale is a lot better on the floor and with the option of him being out GK for 10 years it makes sense.
Deano distribution isn’t good enough for the PL but he makes exceptional saves. But occasionally lets an easy goal in. We all know DH destined for great things if he keeps working but I would rather the mistakes are to better our own young GK.

Not at 15 million quid rather pay Hendo’ s salary for another season even if that costs 4 m it’s worth it for the 10-15 points he’ll get us

 

[Bladezz]

Not at 15 million quid rather pay Hendo’ s salary for another season even if that costs 4 m it’s worth it for the 10-15 points he’ll get us

Can see where your coming from. But can you name me where he has won us 10-15 points this season. He does make great saves (Norwich Away) but he also lets some howlers in. The reason for so many clean sheets is the defence.

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

I think the issue here is that we've been spoilt with Henderson. Currently, he's the best of a generation, a class act and destined for big things. When he returns Manchester United this summer or the one after, whomever we sign next, there's a understandably good chance that they won't be quite as good as the prospective future England no.1.

That said, I've seen very little to suggest that Ramsdale is the answer. He's looked out of his depth at PL on more than one occasion this season, and we it's well known that he was promoted to first choice at Bournemouth through circumstance, rather than form. I don't mean to be harsh on the lad, but it all feels a bit George Long-y.

 

[BobblesBlade]

I hope we sign Ramsdale. Quality keeper!

 

[Killamarshblades]

Can see where your coming from. But can you name me where he has won us 10-15 points this season. He does make great saves (Norwich Away) but he also lets some howlers in. The reason for so many clean sheets is the defence.

My memory isnt the best but you mention Norwich...there was villa away, i think Burnley away he did well, i want to say Wolves away too (but might be wrong on that). Seem to remember a save late on at West Ham that saves us a point, Norwich at home. There will be more, for sure. Those alone (if my crap memory serves me right) is 8 points. You're right the defence is a major factor, but i dont think you can underestimate the impact Henderson has. Yes he lets a few shockers in but overall for me hes a fantastic keeper who will get better

 

[Bladezz]

My memory isnt the best but you mention Norwich...there was villa away, i think Burnley away he did well, i want to say Wolves away too (but might be wrong on that). Seem to remember a save late on at West Ham that saves us a point, Norwich at home. There will be more, for sure. Those alone (if my crap memory serves me right) is 8 points. You're right the defence is a major factor, but i dont think you can underestimate the impact Henderson has. Yes he lets a few shockers in but overall for me hes a fantastic keeper who will get better

But equally there are a few big goals he’s let in. Liverpool / Everton at home / Newcastle Away / Southampton Away there are games he has cost us equally that he’s got us some points.

What I’m trying to say is our clean sheets are down to the defence primarily. A decent keeper behind them will get a fair amount of clean sheets is my point im trying To make.

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

Hendo's a good keeper, particularly for his age but let's not give him all the credit, the defence have been hugely impressive and given him plenty of protection this season.
It's not quite like the lad at Newcastle who's been diving round like a Weeatabix goalie all season keeping the opposition out. I still think he's got a couple of seasons before he can make a claim on the Man Utd No1 jersey without it doing his career some serious damage, which is why I still honestly believe him signing for us with a buy back clause for Man Utd would have been the best option.
He's been great for us, no two ways about it, but it's not the end of the world if he decides he needs to move on, or if we decide we can't wait around for him or Salford Reds to make their minds up as to what they're doing.

 

[Sheffsteel]

Hendo's a good keeper, particularly for his age but let's not give him all the credit, the defence have been hugely impressive and given him plenty of protection this season.

Very much agree.....in some matches (especially away) we sit deep with the defence under constant pressure
BUT in many of these games we never look like conceding and Henderson hardly has anything to do.
Our defence as a unit is simply superb.....we defend as a team...with the strikers even helping out.
Its the reason for our success...even when we are below par we still have a good chance of gaining at least a draw.

 

[Tongeincheek]

If we look at this graph thingy here (technical term) you can see that when it comes to a goalie’s bread and butter, saving a lot of the shots that come at them Henderson is the 3rd best in the league, which is a bloody tough act to follow.

But Ramsdale has saved more than the likes of Kepa, Pickford, Foster and Patricio, whilst facing a shitload more shots.

So ideally I’d take another year of elite Henderson, please and thank you.

But if we can’t get him then Ramsdale seems a great prospect to me... as long as he doesn’t get bored sitting behind a far superior defence.

 

[CaptainMorgans]

View attachment 86829

If we look at this graph thingy here (technical term) you can see that when it comes to a goalie’s bread and butter, saving a lot of the shots that come at them Henderson is the 3rd best in the league, which is a bloody tough act to follow.

But Ramsdale has saved more than the likes of Kepa, Pickford, Foster and Patricio, whilst facing a shitload more shots.

So ideally I’d take another year of elite Henderson, please and thank you.

But if we can’t get him then Ramsdale seems a great prospect to me... as long as he doesn’t get bored sitting behind a far superior defence.

I don't suppose anyone has the stats for

From shots on target
xG vs actual goals conceded

I presume this would be the most scientific measure of who was the best shot stopper this season.
Obviously there is a lot more to goalkeeping than shot stopping, but would be interesting to see.

 

[8lade]

Whoever we get it looks like it's time to spend a decent wedge on a keeper.

 

[Bladeinleeds]

View attachment 86829

If we look at this graph thingy here (technical term) you can see that when it comes to a goalie’s bread and butter, saving a lot of the shots that come at them Henderson is the 3rd best in the league, which is a bloody tough act to follow.

But Ramsdale has saved more than the likes of Kepa, Pickford, Foster and Patricio, whilst facing a shitload more shots.

So ideally I’d take another year of elite Henderson, please and thank you.

But if we can’t get him then Ramsdale seems a great prospect to me... as long as he doesn’t get bored sitting behind a far superior defence.

From that graph we are going from a pretty elite keeper to a slightly below average one.

I know he’s young and I’ve not seen much of him but can’t help feeling it’s a risk. Needs to be able to command his box as well which is something hendo does well

 

[8lade]

Premier League Goalkeeper Stats | FBref.com

Check out Goalkeeper Stats for the 2024-2025 Premier League season.

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The stats basically say Ramsdale saves what is expected (maybe 1 less) whilst Henderson stopped 6 goals more than expected (best was Lloris who saved 10 more than expected).

 

[HeySethUTB]

Henderson has made 6 (PSxG +5.9) saves that should statistically have been goals Ramsdale as has conceded 1 (PSxG - 0.7)more goal than expected statistically. on the face of it it doesn’t seem to bad, it’s when you compare these stats you could loosely predict Ramsdale in a united jersey this season may have ended up with stats closer to PSxG -6/7. Imagine conceding 6/7 more goals this season how would that have effected our position, realistically changing wins into draws and draws in to losses.

Although I love the sentiment of bringing Ramsdale back, there is no close comparison to made between these two based on advanced goalkeeping stats. One is ranked 6th in the division the other being listed as 14th.

However, for the sake of balance of the 62 goals that Ramsdale has conceded 14 have come from set plays FK, CK or penalties an argument could be made that it was Bournemouths poor defensive structure at set plays/tackles in the area that has cost the young goalkeeper better stats. In comparison Henderson 3 of the 33 goals conceded are from set plays. Removal of set plays still leaves Ramsdale on 51 goals conceded in comparison to Hendersons 30 (+21). Finally the PSxG/SoT (post shot expected goals when shot is on target) Henderson has faced slightly easier expected goal shots at 30% in comparison to Ramsdale at 32%.

These stats also give you an idea of why David de gea is still seen as Man Utds No.1 when you consider Henderson has played two less game than him, stats are relatively close. Oh and the 1 million pound a month they currently pay him.

 

[BettingBlade]

View attachment 86829

If we look at this graph thingy here (technical term) you can see that when it comes to a goalie’s bread and butter, saving a lot of the shots that come at them Henderson is the 3rd best in the league, which is a bloody tough act to follow.

But Ramsdale has saved more than the likes of Kepa, Pickford, Foster and Patricio, whilst facing a shitload more shots.

So ideally I’d take another year of elite Henderson, please and thank you.

But if we can’t get him then Ramsdale seems a great prospect to me... as long as he doesn’t get bored sitting behind a far superior defence.

I would hardly say that graph should be used in support of signing him. He’s still in the bottom half of that graph behind keepers from Newcastle, Brighton and Crystal Palace.

I’m sorry, but for the money Bournemouth will want for Ramsdale we really need to be looking elsewhere.

 

[Killamarshblades]

But equally there are a few big goals he’s let in. Liverpool / Everton at home / Newcastle Away / Southampton Away there are games he has cost us equally that he’s got us some points.

What I’m trying to say is our clean sheets are down to the defence primarily. A decent keeper behind them will get a fair amount of clean sheets is my point im trying To make.

Dont necessarily disagree with you, i think sometimes its 6 of one...an amazing defence is no use if your keeper cant save anything, and a keeper can only do so much if a defence is shit..and i think the combination this season (and last) has meant its been good overall. There's been games we've lost (leicester away) that could have been a lot worse had it not been for a good keeper.

Its all opinions isnt it. Liverpool yes of course was down to him, everton id rather know why stevens left a lad to have a free header, Newcastle again see Stevens and southampton he probably should have done better with the first but the defending and attempt from Egan were woeful. The lad himself is probably disappointed at all of them.

I think we will notice the impact of Henderson more when he's gone than we realise

 

[Bladeinleeds]

Henderson has made 6 (PSxG +5.9) saves that should statistically have been goals Ramsdale as has conceded 1 (PSxG - 0.7)more goal than expected statistically. on the face of it it doesn’t seem to bad, it’s when you compare these stats you could loosely predict Ramsdale in a united jersey this season may have ended up with stats closer to PSxG -6/7. Imagine conceding 6/7 more goals this season how would that have effected our position, realistically changing wins into draws and draws in to losses.

Although I love the sentiment of bringing Ramsdale back, there is no close comparison to made between these two based on advanced goalkeeping stats. One is ranked 6th in the division the other being listed as 14th.

However, for the sake of balance of the 62 goals that Ramsdale has conceded 14 have come from set plays FK, CK or penalties an argument could be made that it was Bournemouths poor defensive structure at set plays/tackles in the area that has cost the young goalkeeper better stats. In comparison Henderson 3 of the 33 goals conceded are from set plays. Removal of set plays still leaves Ramsdale on 51 goals conceded in comparison to Hendersons 30 (+21). Finally the PSxG/SoT (post shot expected goals when shot is on target) Henderson has faced slightly easier expected goal shots at 30% in comparison to Ramsdale at 32%.

These stats also give you an idea of why David de gea is still seen as Man Utds No.1 when you consider Henderson has played two less game than him, stats are relatively close. Oh and the 1 million pound a month they currently pay him.

View attachment 86831

Enjoy looking at stats like this - interesting way of viewing things. Though obviously have to confirm with an eye test also.

Hendo being near the top along with the arsenal, palace and Newcastle keepers - seems to back that up with the being acknowledged as having good seasons.

kepa and Pickford being dead last also stacks up.

 

[BigBed]

The pressing detail here is.....can we afford Henderson on a perm....No.
Can we afford Ramsdale.....Probably.
Will we get Henderson back on loan.........50/50.
Will we still be stuck for a good keeper next season or the season after whether or not we get Henderson back on loan......Yes.
Is buying Ramsdale, a tested prem keeper, a good idea.....I'd say Yes it is.

 

[kevreedy]

Henderson v Ramsdale we all know the answer to that one. I can,t see man utd dropping De Gea on massive wage . Solskjaer is backing De Gea..two things that might happen.Hendo comes back to us on season loan.or he goes to Chelsea.

 

[Yank]

As much as I love Henderson and how he has performed for the club,I personally don't see how we could afford him and tbh even though would be nice to have him back on a loan,I would get Ramsdale on a perm and hopefully have our main man for several years down the road

 

[HeySethUTB]

Despite the media lashings, De Gea and Hendersons data is very similar this season, De Gea was offered and signed a ridiculous contract because in the season prior, his PSxG was something crazy like +12.7 meaning he stopped almost 13 statistically certain goals, that’s worth a lots of points on the table. Therefore the money is paid and potential too have another barnstormer of a season will be ever present. I hope this then means Henderson will stay, leaving us no real need to go a re-sign Ramsdale.

If this isn’t the case then we need to look at a lad called Gautier Larsonneur ex No.1 French U21 international he been one of the best keepers in Ligue 1 despite his team being relegated (PSxG +8.1), uncanny similar stats to Henderson albeit in a different league. Would be cheaper than the 15 million figure that is being touted about for Ramsdale.

 

[Bladezz]

Dont necessarily disagree with you, i think sometimes its 6 of one...an amazing defence is no use if your keeper cant save anything, and a keeper can only do so much if a defence is shit..and i think the combination this season (and last) has meant its been good overall. There's been games we've lost (leicester away) that could have been a lot worse had it not been for a good keeper.

Its all opinions isnt it. Liverpool yes of course was down to him, everton id rather know why stevens left a lad to have a free header, Newcastle again see Stevens and southampton he probably should have done better with the first but the defending and attempt from Egan were woeful. The lad himself is probably disappointed at all of them.

I think we will notice the impact of Henderson more when he's gone than we realise

Agree just depends on either way. Like you say the defence has lapses but then it’s down to the GK as the last line of defence.

We are the team now who deal with the mistakes that will make DH better. I would rather invest in our goalkeeper so the mistakes that Ramsdale will hopefully make him better for us in due course.

I’m not against loaning DH but I would prefer our own GK.