Our current form

[Slim Man]

Wilder knows this, and we’ve just made 4 signings who are apparently all more direct in their thinking.

I know he does, I’m making the point to Wizardry and the other posters that keep saying it.

 

[super_pig]

I think we've just been sussed out. Teams know that if they defend deep we can't work a way through and then they have a chance on the break. The amount of times we have players out of position because we have 4 in the corner fannying about is concerning. Really hope Ricky Holmes offers something different in the final 3rd.

defend deep and park the bus and you can frustrate ‘any’ formation because formations become irrelevant in such a compacted space on the edge of the box

 

[Bladezz]

We were far from poor against Bristol City, Aston Villa, Sunderland, Derby and Ipswich. Yeah ok it's a disappointment from topping the league following the Burton game, but we just need to take stock and think back to less than 2 years ago, and the personnel we had under Adkins

<shudders>

Just going to post this again!

 

[Finn Keane o' Balmaqueen]

If we'd have any other manager, would we be calling for his sacking?

 

[Bladezz]

I wonder whether it’s time for a formation change to a 3-4-3. I think that could allow us to get two players in between the lines to support one striker, rather than relying on Duffy to do it all by myself.

We can’t keep saying that we’ve played well but not won. It’s gone on too long and think it may be time to freshen it up.

Lundstram our for Leonard. Maybe Basham our with Stearman playing on the right side and Wright in the middle.

Duffy and Holmes or Brooks playing off Clarke or Donaldson.

Yes let’s change our formation to score more goals we are only third highest goal scorers in the league.

I said it once and I’ll say it again. WILDER OUT

 

[Ricky]

Basham could probably do with a rest and there's a good opportunity for that with the Preston game coming up on a Saturday.

We do need Brooks back ASAP. Holmes will also add something similar. I'd like to see both start either side of Clarke.

Donaldson should nearly always start away from home.

4-2-3-1 should also be considered. We have the options for it now. But a lot of strikers on the books for only one to play.

Yes let’s change our formation to score more goals we are only third highest goal scorers in the league.

I said it once and I’ll say it again. WILDER OUT

Not sure anyone's saying Wilder out though are they? Maybe they've just realised that we're not scoring at the same rate as we were?

3-4-3 is hardly a formation change either.

 

[alcoblade]

I know he does, I’m making the point to Wizardry and the other posters that keep saying it.

Well I think most accept we were short of options to change anything dramatically until this point. There hasn’t been a lot of alternatives to discuss, other than repetition of the obvious line - that we are good in possession but lack the cutting edge against sides who sit back.

We will see some change from here on.

 

[super_pig]

If we'd have any other manager, would we be calling for his sacking?

i have a simple metric.. if we’re higher than when they took over then no manager deserves the boot
so theoretically CW could get relegated to L1 and i’d still give him more time

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

Wait for the new signings to bed in, Billy will get a goal or two too and watch us go.

 

[Slim Man]

If we'd have any other manager, would we be calling for his sacking?

Some would be asking more questions than they are currently probably, but those some fans can fuck off. To quote Mick McCarthy.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

3-4-3 with thomas, wilson & brooks as the 3 would be interesting. In this kind of styleeeeee:

 

[DronnieBlade]

3-4-3 with thomas, wilson & brooks as the 3 would be interesting.

Drop golden balls ?

Sacrilege

UTB

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Drop golden balls ?

Sacrilege

UTB

Well, it's a free hit against preston, innit. We should just go bat shit crazy, like. Could even play goalie wag

 

[thehet]

He did need to move back to RCB, but he’s been poor there since he has. He’s played a lot of games in a lot of different positions and he could do with a rest as I think his form is suffering. Leonard apparently can play there, he’s a similar player to Basham.

Freeman might be a right back but he’s played left back for us before... surely you can remember that? Full backs can swap wings, especially if they’re comfortable with both feet.
Duffy has been poor lately, dipped below his standards. Hence the thinking of giving someone else a try now we have a better alternative to Carruthers in waiting.

Have you even been watching us recently?

Despite that, I do agree with the gist of your last point

When did Freeman last play LWB, not last season. He's behind even Ched in returning to fitness. We need him to compete with Baldock, you know, instead of putting Bash there. We are not in a position to be putting square pegs in round holes. (Hence keeping Bash in one spot)
Let's bring in Southends best midfielder, poty for 3 seasons or whatever and stick him in defence?

I've watched us all season, and we haven't got a player anything like Duffy, the downside now is other teams are ganging up on him. So we need to rethink the way we create, and I think that is to go Clarke up on his own with Duff/Brooks behind and 3 in the middle ala Swilsbro where we created chance after chance.

We need to sort the set pieces out and start being clinical around the box.

We do not need to start experimenting with players out of position.

If we were in midtable i would be inclined to start changing things up in the hope something worked out, but not now.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

defend deep and park the bus and you can frustrate ‘any’ formation because formations become irrelevant in such a compacted space on the edge of the box

So what do you do different? Drawing 0-0 after 65% possession suggests there are problems in the final 3rd.

 

[super_pig]

So what do you do different? Drawing 0-0 after 65% possession suggests there are problems in the final 3rd.

dunno mate i’m a software engineer i’ll leave it to Chris and Alan.. i suppose you have to get players that can unlock defences at the level you’re at.. hopefully that is what the new signings are for but we should not panic and change our formation/style

 

[Ricky]

Real fucking pain in the arse that Leonard, Evans and Holmes are all cup tied because we could have experimented nicely against Preston whilst still putting out a strong team.

 

[Fanny magnet]

We used to be a l23 to just switch formation seamlessly mid game when teams matched us up (Charlton at home being a good example ) without making substitutions
It was one of the things that impressed me the most about wilder management

Why can't we do that now ? What's changed is the personnel not the same

Hopefully these new additions means we can change up,because I'm confident that at this level if you can do that teams struggle to change up to stop you

 

[blade too long]

after 27 games we are 6th by rights

how many thought that was humanly possible on august 1st

Lets stop being huber critical of what we have achieved in our first seaon back after 6 years
we have a great chance of being there or threabouts

even 2nd is still within reach with a good run

lets just back the lads and see what happens

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

It's a common problem. I posted a video about brentford's new signing. rob scott (ex of this parish) who is brentford's chief scout, tells the player that he has been watched over 20 times by 6 different scouts and that:

"One of your best attributes is seeing opportunities in the box and getting into good scoring positions. In the championship a lot of teams sit quite deep against us, particularly here (at home) and it is important that you can receive the ball in tight areas. Your technique under pressure is good and that's good because you will be in very tight areas and you need to be able to find space to deal with the ball".

 

[wizadry]

How long do we keep saying that before actually thinking ‘right this isn’t working’ and change it up?

We don’t keep saying it without doing something about it, I agree, the time is now to freshen things up and I suspect as alcoblade as said Wilder knows this and that’s why he’s brought 3 possibly 4 players in to eradicate the problem. I’m not keen on Holmes coming for a few reasons but if he comes and wins us matches I really couldn’t give a shit.

We are still in with a terrific chance of promotion so we don’t want to sit on our laurels, in theory I’m agreeing with most of what you say but I disagree that we’re playing poorly most of the time.

 

[5tannington Blade]

I didn't think we were that great against sunderland to be honest, they were dire. We thankfully put them to bed though. I think a few teams have learnt how to set up against us at home - birmingham or norwich felt like the first and a few have followed suit since

 

[FredZeppelin]

Well, I wouldn't pretend to know as much about football, tactics and 'how the game works' as some on this forum.....but for me:
1. We are still dominating possession against most teams in the division, which can only be a good thing, but are definitely slower in our passing and have certainly lost some of the 'crispness' to our play. The movement is still there but we look laboured and our thinking is slower. Chris said in his after-match comments that we were having to "wait until players got into position in some phases of our play". Earlier in the season, this wasn't the case. It was just automatic and all the players looked much freer in their thought processes and decision making. We had fluidity all over the field.
2. During the first 15 or so games we were waxing lyrical about how Chris and Knilly had got so much creativity into our set-pieces and dead ball situations. O'Connell in-particular came in for some real praise as he seemed to be a target for these original, training ground routines. We seemed to be really surprising teams with 'something completely different' every match and the media started to recognise this. What's happened in recent weeks to al this?? We are predictable, slow and pedestrian. When was the last time we scored a goal that made you go 'wow, that was a brilliantly thought-out move'?
3. We are definitely more defence-minded - as someone else on this thread pointed out. This is bound to have an effect on out overall free-thinking approach. At the start of the season, there was no pressure on us. We were the new boys and would've been happy with a mid-table finish and another season of steady progress. We now have to play with that most difficult of pressures - expectation.
I'm not going to offer any answers. I don't know enough about the game and we have two guys running our fortunes at the moment who have the undivided trust and complete good faith of our entire fan base. But maybe we just need to slightly 're-invent' the team again? Do something different whilst keeping the same basic ethics that have got us this far?
The new players brought in have been acquired to do this, i'm sure.
20 games to go? It's a mini-season and we should go for it!
Let's enjoy it because we can. It's not like we're stuck down in 17th with a set of under-performing wasters and a cheap foreign, porn-star looking manager clutching at straws and praying for their next point.
UTB

 

[Deadbat]

Be interested to see what the new formation or line up could be when everyone is fit. Stevens is badly off form and needs to shape up or will be taken out. Bash has also been poor recently and Lundstram is too inconsistent. The one thing is the team will change in the next few games...we have won 1 in 10 and signed 4 new players.

There are lots of options now.....

----------------------------------Moore-------------------------------------------------------
Baldock/Freeman----Leanord/Basham----Stearman----O'Connell---Stevens
--------------------------Evans/Lundstram---Fleck---------------------------------------------
------------------------------Duffy / Holmes / Brooks---------------------------------------------
-------------------------Sharp/Wilson/Donaldon----Clarke--------------------------------------

Or how about something a bit different allowing us to keep same shape at the back

I am not sure we are getting enough chances with Donaldson and Clarke up top and Billy has been bang off form. Wilson will need time to get used to full fitness- been out ages.

I love the idea of playing Duffy and Brooks or Duffy and Holmes maybe off Clarke....think this could mean teams set up with 3 centre backs and they will be gaps in front of the midfield.

If Stevens does not improve would we consider playing our best 2 wing backs in Baldock and Freeman or is that a ridiculous suggestion (Freeman has played there before)


----------------------------------Moore-------------------------------------------------------
Baldock--------Leanard/Bash----Stearman---O'Connell---Freeman
-------------------Evans/Lundstram/Leonard---Fleck---------------------------------------------
2 from-------------------Duffy / Holmes/ Brooks---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------Clarke--------------------------------------

 

[wavy-blade]

Looking at this our next 4 games will be hard , the Norwich match is so important for us if we don't win that it could be mid table for us ! current from is terrible as this table shows .

Pos Team P Pts F A GD Sequence
1 Wolves 10 26 21 5 16 W W W W D W W D W W
2 Derby 10 23 17 3 14 W W L W W W W D W D
3 Fulham 10 20 21 15 6 D W W L W L W W D W
4 Leeds 10 20 13 9 4 W L W D W W W W L D
5 Preston 10 19 11 7 4 D W D W W W D D W L
6 Aston Villa 10 18 16 9 7 W W W D D L D L W W
7 Bristol City 10 17 14 15 -1 D L W W W W D W L L
8 Cardiff 10 16 14 12 2 W W W W D W L L L L
9 Middlesbrough 10 15 14 13 1 L W L L W L W W L W
10 Brentford 10 15 14 14 0 L D D W L D W W W L
11 Bolton 10 14 12 14 -2 D D L W L L W L W W
12 Millwall 10 13 11 12 -1 D D L W D W L D W L
13 Norwich 10 12 11 11 0 D L D L W L L W D W
14 Sunderland 10 12 9 12 -3 D L W L D W D L W L
15 Burton 10 11 10 12 -2 L D L L L W W L D W
16 Birmingham 10 11 7 10 -3 W L D L L L D L W W
17 Ipswich 10 11 11 15 -4 D L W W L W L D L L
18 Reading 10 10 12 14 -2 D D W W D L L L D L
19 Sheffield United 10 9 16 17 -1 W L D L L L D W L D
20 QPR 10 9 9 14 -5 L L D L L W D D L W
21 Hull 10 8 11 14 -3 D D L D W L L D D L
22 Nott'm Forest 10 8 8 16 -8 L W L L W L D L L D
23 Sheffield Weds 10 7 9 15 -6 D D D D L L L W L L
24 Barnsley 10 6 4 15 -11 L L L L L D L D D W

 

[Tommoblade66]

Form suffered a little but beginning to improve again. Still doing far better than I expected

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

after 27 games we are 6th by rights

how many thought that was humanly possible on august 1st

I did.

 

[itsinyerblood]

Well, I wouldn't pretend to know as much about football, tactics and 'how the game works' as some on this forum.....but for me:
1. We are still dominating possession against most teams in the division, which can only be a good thing, but are definitely slower in our passing and have certainly lost some of the 'crispness' to our play. The movement is still there but we look laboured and our thinking is slower. Chris said in his after-match comments that we were having to "wait until players got into position in some phases of our play". Earlier in the season, this wasn't the case. It was just automatic and all the players looked much freer in their thought processes and decision making. We had fluidity all over the field.
2. During the first 15 or so games we were waxing lyrical about how Chris and Knilly had got so much creativity into our set-pieces and dead ball situations. O'Connell in-particular came in for some real praise as he seemed to be a target for these original, training ground routines. We seemed to be really surprising teams with 'something completely different' every match and the media started to recognise this. What's happened in recent weeks to al this?? We are predictable, slow and pedestrian. When was the last time we scored a goal that made you go 'wow, that was a brilliantly thought-out move'?
3. We are definitely more defence-minded - as someone else on this thread pointed out. This is bound to have an effect on out overall free-thinking approach. At the start of the season, there was no pressure on us. We were the new boys and would've been happy with a mid-table finish and another season of steady progress. We now have to play with that most difficult of pressures - expectation.
I'm not going to offer any answers. I don't know enough about the game and we have two guys running our fortunes at the moment who have the undivided trust and complete good faith of our entire fan base. But maybe we just need to slightly 're-invent' the team again? Do something different whilst keeping the same basic ethics that have got us this far?
The new players brought in have been acquired to do this, i'm sure.
20 games to go? It's a mini-season and we should go for it!
Let's enjoy it because we can. It's not like we're stuck down in 17th with a set of under-performing wasters and a cheap foreign, porn-star looking manager clutching at straws and praying for their next point.
UTB

I like that Fred, good points throughout your post mate.

I've just watched Wilder's post match interview, and as he said, we need to learn to do certain things better in key areas of the pitch. Like you, Wilder has earned the right to our trust in his ability to take care of this club. Both Chris and Alan will have discussed Friday and our overall performance, and they'll know what we need to do, which players we've needed to bring in, and how vital it is that they, the players, learn and learn quickly. There's about half a season left, so much can happen between now and when that last game is played. Wilder's clearly focused on us doing everything possible to get us in the play-offs.....you don't believe me? Watch Wilder's interview, and tell yourself that he's not committed to taking us further than merely finishing in 7th or 8th position.

 

[GrayBlade]

I think we are starting to come back a bit although the form isn’t where is was. The last six games all competitions shows us with 2 wins, 3 draws and 1 defeat with a couple of good performances included so we’ve something to build on.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

He did need to move back to RCB, but he’s been poor there since he has. He’s played a lot of games in a lot of different positions and he could do with a rest as I think his form is suffering. Leonard apparently can play there, he’s a similar player to Basham.

Freeman might be a right back but he’s played left back for us before... surely you can remember that? Full backs can swap wings, especially if they’re comfortable with both feet.
Duffy has been poor lately, dipped below his standards. Hence the thinking of giving someone else a try now we have a better alternative to Carruthers in waiting.

Have you even been watching us recently?

Despite that, I do agree with the gist of your last point

I'm conflicted when it comes to Basham, because he has great heart, terrific energy and can provide adequate cover in a number of positions. Unfortunately, the higher we rise the more cut-throat it becomes to maintain momentum. With the ball, Basham strikes a line between average and slightly below average, and you have to say that when he is utilised either as a midfield player, or in the unique way we deploy our centre halves, being average on the ball costs us. Half a dozen situations came to nothing against Wednesday, as a result of a dependency on that 'extra bit of quality' needing to come from Basham's boot which, through no fault of his own, he just doesn't quite have. If this formation is a mainstay, then we either need to tweak the drill to place our technically gifted players at the sharp end of overloading the wide areas, or expand the required arsenal of potential suitors for the centre half role, similar to Guardiola's requirement of a goalkeeper needing be able to play the sweeper role.