Norwood and Coutts Together?

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Pinchy said:
Couttsy is our best midfielder.
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Fleck has to be our best midfielder, and after watching Norwood since he arrived, I think he has to be in the team, therefore making him better at present, than Coutts.
 
bromtom said:
Personally I think Norwood could play in the Duffy role, or something like it, quite easily.
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I would suggest Fleck for the advanced role. Well, right now I would suggest Duffy.

I don’t agree with ‘Fleck must start every game’ by the way, any more than I did with Brooks (that went well, didn’t it?) or do with Sharp. It’s a nonsensical proposition.
 
We could do lots of things but what CW will be doing is picking the best team and best formation to beat the opposition. Most of the time he’ll stick to 3421 but sometimes a flat midfield or a diamond will expose weaknesses in the opponents, often he’ll change it part way through a game, to capitalise on something him and Knill have seen, or in response to changes made by the opposition manager.

That’s how football has gone, like a chess match; where you hope your first formation will force the other manager to make a change, then you make a change to counter it. That’s why you need quality and variety on the bench. We didn’t always have that last season which is why some of Wilder’s substitutions didn’t work. In L1 we tended to have better options than the opponents so the subs worked more often.
 
BigBed said:
Fleck has to be our best midfielder, and after watching Norwood since he arrived, I think he has to be in the team, therefore making him better at present, than Coutts.
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That’s an entirely circular and self-fulfilling argument. It falls, in my view, at the first hurdle.
 
To be honest, all opinions of who is better in our excellent midfield, are worthless. Like all good teams, the best combination will evolve, either by accident or design, and probably sooner rather than later. One thing is sure though, NONE of the 'golden 4' are undroppable.
 
I’ll be frank. Unusual I know !!

I doubt Wilder will be able to accommodate them both.

Norwood quite rightly keeps the shirt for now while Coutts builds up to full match fitness with U23 games and minutes off the bench.

Norwood had better maintain his standards though, as the slightest of drops will see him benched.

UTB
 
DronnieBlade said:
I’ll be frank. Unusual I know !!

I doubt Wilder will be able to accommodate them both.

Norwood quite rightly keeps the shirt for now while Coutts builds up to full match fitness with U23 games and minutes off the bench.

Norwood had better maintain his standards though, as the slightest of drops will see him benched.

UTB
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Same applies to everyone with a shirt, and exactly how it should be !
 
blademark said:
Not at the moment he isn't ! He's got a job on getting in the team just now.
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Another very strong point to shore up my belief that Fleck must be our best Midfielder at the moment. Cheers.
 
We will struggle to fit all 3 in and keep our 5 at the back system.

But if we keep things as they are no way can we drop Norwood with the set piece edge he’s giving us at the moment.
Fleck gives you the perfect left sided balance, he can’t be dropped for either. It’s a shoot out between Norwood and Coutts in the current formation, and right now there’s one winner.
 
In my opinion the most inconsistent of the golden 4 would be Duffy, and therefore possibly the most likely to sit out first. Then it becomes a very interesting question of formation and shape.
 
BigBed said:
That's a surprise.
So can you explain, how you've come to the conclusion, that "Coutts is our best midfielder" then??
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Control, vision, accuracy, strength, organisation, consistency, inspiration. The hub of everything we do. Top of the Championship when he last kicked a ball,
 



The trinity is what the team understands so don't change. However, Flecks recent goal remindered me of his "Scottish Rooney" days, when we were first in for him at Rangers. So upfront as a 10 may be still possible
 
Pinchy said:
Control, vision, accuracy, strength, organisation, consistency, inspiration. The hub of everything we do. Top of the Championship when he last kicked a ball,
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So, basically, your describing, Fleck and Norwood perfectly, unfortunately for your argument, "consistency" doesn't always describe Coutts.
Although Coutts has been and is a great player for us, at present he isn't playing due to injury, whereas Fleck has "Consistently" been playing very well.
No argument that Coutts is a brilliant player, but so are Fleck and Norwood(So far), and Fleck has to be first choice for me.
 
However good Coutts is, you simply don’t disrupt a winning team. Couttsy will get his chance soon enough........But not now.
 
Topplayersleave said:
All good teams have at least two players for each position, not a first teamer and a cover squad player.

Play one of them who is in form and let the other fight for his place.

It's going to be a while before Coutts is fit enough, so a slow introduction replacing Norwood in the 85th minute after hes destroyed the opposition would be best.

That way there's no pressure on him

89th minute against Villa would have been a great time to put him on if it was possible
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Dont forget we have average players
 
It's another thread debating who's better... They're all our players, just enjoy everything they bring. They will all be equally important to us this season.
 
For the last two seasons we’ve desperately needed someone of the same calibre as Coutts to deputise if he got suspended or injured. Well our Chrissie has probably “over shot” a little bit on that one and actually got an upgrade on Mr Coutts.
 
Wilder has leaned more towards 3 in the middle up until Duffy's return to form. I reckon throughout the season we'll see 3 in the middle more often than not, more so when Coutts is fully fit. But with Johnson signing and Bash being able to be released in midfield I can see a change in shape happening more often, probably during the game though.

Can even go 4-3-3 with Norwood in the middle, Fleck and Coutts either side, with 3 attackers up top.
 
They’re not the same type of player. They have certain strengths in common but their general style is quite different. There will be games where playing both of them alongside Fleck will give us more defensive solidity and an ability to play a very controlled game in the middle third. This will be handy for tight games against very strong opposition.

Duffy then gives us added flair and guile in the final third which again, we will need in certain games. All four of them have a big part to play and there will be occasional moments where all of them are on the field at once I expect.
 
What a fantastic position to be in and hopefully in time they can adapt to be a midfield 3. For now, Coutts is still maybe 2 months away from being a number 1 pick, however bladey bladey you are.
 



Patrick Suffaux said:
They’re not the same type of player. They have certain strengths in common but their general style is quite different. There will be games where playing both of them alongside Fleck will give us more defensive solidity and an ability to play a very controlled game in the middle third. This will be handy for tight games against very strong opposition.

Duffy then gives us added flair and guile in the final third which again, we will need in certain games. All four of them have a big part to play and there will be occasional moments where all of them are on the field at once I expect.
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This hits the nail on the head. We’ll need to play different players/ systems for different opposition.

Also there’s no such thing as “best” midfielder.
They ALL have a vital part in Wilders system, he generally sets up like this.

1: Defensive midfielder
2: Box to box midfielder
3: Creative advanced midfielder

1: The defensive midfield role has been the secret of our success.
Normally a DM would be a great tackler and help protect the defence but in league 1 we rarely needed to defend.
So CW wanted a DM to take the ball off the defense and set/ control the tempo.
Coutts just happened to play this vital role superbly, now Norwood is playing in and also looks superb.
Basham is occasionally used as more of a traditional DM to protect leads.

2: The box to box midfielder is a jack of all trades mid with energy. We’ve discovered that Fleck plays this role really well.
Lundstrum also has the style to be a great box to box midfielder but needs to make better decision and be more consistent.
However Lunny is still young and it wouldn’t surprise if he ends up being a top player for us.

3: Creative midfielders is the glamour role and players tend to cost more.
Again we’ve discovered someone who is fantastic in this role.
Think what makes Duffy so effective is his intelligence but especially his dribbling skills (comes from his days playing as a winger).
Duffy isn’t the quickest but seems to glide past other players like they’re not there.
Brooks appeared to have the style to play this role but now he’s gone so I suspect Woodburn might be used to freshen things up.
 
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