Michael Doyle and Mr. Clough

ZoneManWilf · May 30, 2015

William Henry Foulkes said:
Again this contradicts Clough, well sort of...

I think it was Swindon when Freeman lost his man. The subject came up in an interview and he said something along the lines of "We talk about who's marking who, and if someone doesn't do their job then we're in trouble."

Reminds me of that Bassett clip which appears regularly. Do teams actually practise, or are they just given assigned players? Don't know.

Sorry I was being facetious on the evidence of the sheer number of goals we conceded to corners!

From the pig end · May 30, 2015

Ashtonsmashton said:
Clough sounds like an absolute twat.
Now I see why he could only get Derby players.

I feel that Doyle actually did well at this club and was a decent captain. If he was to come back with the new manager I wouldn't mind.

I'm also disgusted with his treatment of players of this report is true. Players deserve respect and I'm sure if they got this than they would have performed better.

Additionally has Diego left yet?

Surely you can't be a complete twat if it's all your old players who you resign

William Henry Foulkes · May 30, 2015

Davie Blade said:
Pretty conclusive to me or someone's gone to a ridiculous amount of shirt stirring to what effect, when NN has gone.

https://twitter.com/KatyHoggard/with_replies

I'm at the How can you not love olly murs though? tweet and feeling skeptical

memorable · May 30, 2015

Living In a Fantasy World said:
I don't think getting rid of Morgan is a drastic change, it would just be a unnecessary change to get rid of such a loyal guy that I think only benefits the club.

You see this is the biggest problem. We are becoming an insular club, a bit like America. We are effectively shouting USA,USA like we are still the biggest, bestest, greatest. But we aren't a superpower anymore and Morgan isn't a lynchpin. We want to be a superpower and unfortunately the loud arsewipes have shouted so much that the American director listened to them so we got rid of our non descript president in the hope of getting a Kennedy. Morgan is what he is, a thick footballer that the board don't want to get rid of because it will upset the fans.. They don't know what they're doing and the fact they continually keep Morgan on shows that.

William Henry Foulkes · May 30, 2015

From the pig end said:
Surely you can't be a complete twat if it's all your old players who you resign

Agreed. And this has been consistent. Didn't Derby fans say the same thing (about NC only signing from former clubs)? Holt said he'd like to work with him again too.

Ashtonsmashton · May 30, 2015

From the pig end said:
Surely you can't be a complete twat if it's all your old players who you resign

Well they must have been respected by Clough

Ashtonsmashton · May 30, 2015

William Henry Foulkes said:
Agreed. And this has been consistent. Didn't Derby fans say the same thing (about NC only signing from former clubs)? Holt said he'd like to work with him again too.

Seems h only likes and respects the players that he brought in

William Henry Foulkes · May 30, 2015

Davie Blade said:
Pretty conclusive to me or someone's gone to a ridiculous amount of shirt stirring to what effect, when NN has gone.

https://twitter.com/KatyHoggard/with_replies

So Doyle told her mate, her mate told her, and she's telling us - in tweets?

Interesting reading (genuinely) but "I wouldn't want to be hung on the basis of that evidence".

sheffielder · May 30, 2015

William Henry Foulkes said:
So Doyle told her mate, her mate told her, and she's telling us - in tweets?

Interesting reading (genuinely) but "I wouldn't want to be hung on the basis of that evidence".

To be fair, some of those stories have been available elsewhere and all season.

William Henry Foulkes · May 30, 2015

sheffielder said:
To be fair, some of those stories have been available elsewhere and all season.

To take one example the Collins story was about how he'd advised Maguire to leave, or fallen out with Doyle.

From the pig end · May 30, 2015

Ashtonsmashton said:
Seems h only likes and respects the players that he brought in

He brought Butler in, and from the outside it seems he treated him like shit. Did he bring Mcnulty in? Always disliked how he spoke to the media about him too. I bet Clough divided opinion with the players just as he did with the fans

sheffielder · May 30, 2015

William Henry Foulkes said:
To take one example the Collins story was about how he'd advised Maguire to leave, or fallen out with Doyle.

Can't both be true?

William Henry Foulkes · May 30, 2015

The one part that's not great is how Doyle found out he was being released but:

I always thought he was leaving - didn't everyone else?
Even if it did happen like that I can't imagine it was done on purpose - sounds more like someone putting his foot in it

No way to treat Doyle but sounds like cock up rather than conspiracy - if it happened at all.

memorable · May 30, 2015

Butler came in and in one of the first training sessions started a row with Doyle. This then escalated and Clough took Doyle's side. Butler was offloaded to maintain team spirit.Clough got shitloads of abuse for this and now apparently Doyle can't leave the house without slagging him off. Being manager of this club is like being in the twilight zone.

bartman · May 30, 2015

Davie Blade said:
Pretty conclusive to me or someone's gone to a ridiculous amount of shirt stirring to what effect, when NN has gone.

https://twitter.com/KatyHoggard/with_replies

I notice she does say she wasn't there which always makes me cynical about things like this but it doesn't take a genius to work out there were issues behind the scenes on occasions which makes it easier for rumours to be made up. I dread to think what the social media gossips would have made of Bassett ' s tenure

Living In a Fantasy World · May 30, 2015

memorable said:
You see this is the biggest problem. We are becoming an insular club, a bit like America. We are effectively shouting USA,USA like we are still the biggest, bestest, greatest. But we aren't a superpower anymore and Morgan isn't a lynchpin. We want to be a superpower and unfortunately the loud arsewipes have shouted so much that the American director listened to them so we got rid of our non descript president in the hope of getting a Kennedy. Morgan is what he is, a thick footballer that the board don't want to get rid of because it will upset the fans.. They don't know what they're doing and the fact they continually keep Morgan on shows that.

He's been with us for 12 years, I'm glad the board as respect for his loyalty. Football teams don't normally acquire a person who sticks by a club through thick and thin, he was a great captain, a solid player we have not yet replaced in the team, and I think he is a gem personally.

William Henry Foulkes · May 30, 2015

sheffielder said:
Can't both be true?

Or all three? Clough fell out with Collins bc:

Collins advised Maguire to leave
Collins had a bust up with Doyle in training - the same Doyle who Clough later "betrays" for want of a better word
Collins advised DDG to leave
Some permutation
None of the above

Hard to pick a definitive answer from that lot.

Bladesway · May 30, 2015

Living In a Fantasy World said:
I disagree, I don't think its a big ask to accommodate a long serving player like Morgan. He is a true bladesman who knows the club inside out, why wouldn't you want some one like that in your team.

That's the managers choice.

bartman · May 30, 2015

William Henry Foulkes said:
The one part that's not great is how Doyle found out he was being released but:

I always thought he was leaving - didn't everyone else?

Even if it did happen like that I can't imagine it was done on purpose - sounds more like someone putting his foot in it

No way to treat Doyle but sounds like cock up rather than conspiracy - if it happened at all.

I think Doyle knew a few weeks before the end of the season from what I have been told

memorable · May 30, 2015

Living In a Fantasy World said:
He's been with us for 12 years, I'm glad the board as respect for his loyalty. Football teams don't normally acquire a person who sticks by a club through thick and thin, he was a great captain, a solid player we have not yet replaced in the team, and I think he is a gem personally.

Grappler · May 30, 2015

memorable said:
Butler came in and in one of the first training sessions started a row with Doyle. This then escalated and Clough took Doyle's side. Butler was offloaded to maintain team spirit.Clough got shitloads of abuse for this and now apparently Doyle can't leave the house without slagging him off. Being manager of this club is like being in the twilight zone.

I heard that when Butler and Doyle had words, Clough was playing it down the middle, not siding with either, but players were backing Doyle, and it might have all blown over but (apparently) Butler shouted to Clough, and pointing to Doyle, said "who runs this team, you or him?", in front of the team.

memorable · May 30, 2015

God knows what happened there! I respect your view and loyalty is a plus point. But I have a bit of a problem with him, because I wonder how much he is a back stabbing spy who undermines the manger.

From the pig end · May 30, 2015

Owwwwww the plot thickens, I didn't know any of this.

metalblade · May 30, 2015

Fuck me there will soon have been as many spectators at the training ground bust ups as there was on the night we played Port Vale before Heath was sacked. Negative Nigel has gone get over it, I couldn't give a fuck about him any more.

bartman · May 30, 2015

memorable said:
Butler came in and in one of the first training sessions started a row with Doyle. This then escalated and Clough took Doyle's side. Butler was offloaded to maintain team spirit.Clough got shitloads of abuse for this and now apparently Doyle can't leave the house without slagging him off. Being manager of this club is like being in the twilight zone.

That is not the reason Butler left. He left because of a major disagreement with Clough about his role and tactics. Nothing to do with Doyle - source is a squad player from last season

Bladesince59 · May 30, 2015

Clough was a [email protected] riddance

Living In a Fantasy World · May 30, 2015

Bladesway said:
That's the managers choice.

So do you think it's honestly "right" in allowing a new manager to come in and having the choice to get rid of someone who's been there for over 10 years. That in my opinion is madness.

Bladepicker · May 30, 2015

Living In a Fantasy World said:
So do you think it's honestly "right" in allowing a new manager to come in and having the choice to get rid of someone who's been there for over 10 years. That in my opinion is madness.

Of course it is in the industry that is football.

Should a manager be forced to play a player becuase they have been at a club for say 8 years?

Grappler · May 30, 2015

bartman said:
That is not the reason Butler left. He left because of a major disagreement with Clough about his role and tactics. Nothing to do with Doyle - source is a squad player from last season

Something about him being promised the Captain's position?

Living In a Fantasy World · May 30, 2015

Bladepicker said:
Of course it is in the industry that is football.

Should a manager be forced to play a player because they have been at a club for say 8 years?

I think he should be able to accommodate the player in the squad, like a Gerard for example

. I would be outraged if a manager came in a got rid of all the loyal players

Michael Doyle and Mr. Clough

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