Many football agents are scum

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Grizzly blade said:
And there are lots of players who say that. Even players who didn't earn millions and who are now regretting handing 100's of thousands away to agents that should have come their way instead.
Any players parents would take a keen interest I'm sure. And if it were me I wouldn't want some person who doesn't know him and who has no interest in my lads future or past dealing with any of his business.
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As mentioned above, would Dave the gas fitter be in any better position to negotiate a multi-million pound contract for his 18-year old son?
 



It's odd, usually we criticise agents for their role in engineering moves for players away from the club – they have a clear interest in a player sale, as they will get a cut of the deal. The involvement of agents in any of the deals we were trying to make should have been to our benefit as the purchasing club...
 
Rodders said:
As mentioned above, would Dave the gas fitter be in any better position to negotiate a multi-million pound contract for his 18-year old son?
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Maybe yes.
Dave the gas fitter gets a PFA rep for his son, reads the contract on offer and asks PFA rep to explain.
Then after having it all explained to him and son they talk over the contract and make a decision on whether it's right for the lad. Counter offer any areas they aren't happy with!

The alternative is an agent doing everything and saying "now you can sign here"

I know which option I would prefer.

But look at areas of the foreign market. Agents making millions and often defrauding players from countries who have had little education. Huge chunks of transfer fees going "missing"...clubs paying £x millions but selling club receiving much less!! And all because of agents
 
And what any agents outside the UK do is of no relevance to us given that, as is well documented, we do not currently sign players from outside the UK.
 
It's not fucking hard to negotiate regardless of how many 00's are on the end of the figures. In my eyes if a young player is too thick to negotiate a good deal for themselves without some parasite leaching off the top and from the club then do they really deserve to make millions for kicking a ball about?

They should've paid more attention at school.

No sorry, agents are not needed.
 
Silent Blade said:
I am not saying all agents are bad but don't you agree that some of them are bad? There are many who interfere too much!
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Surely then it's up to the players to step in?
This is another case which strengthen my opinion that the agent should be paid by whoever has engaged them not by who their negotiating with.
 
Presty said:
Is professional sport the only gig on earth where people - as a matter of routine - need a third party to negotiate a career move for them?
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No, actors have agents to get them work and negotiate vast sums of money on their behalf.
 
Grizzly blade said:
And there are lots of players who say that. Even players who didn't earn millions and who are now regretting handing 100's of thousands away to agents that should have come their way instead.
Any players parents would take a keen interest I'm sure. And if it were me I wouldn't want some person who doesn't know him and who has no interest in my lads future or past dealing with any of his business.
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The flipside to that is that I know a former player who earned good money for a while and played briefly in the PL. He started out using his Dad as his representative and soon realised it's not that straightforward. Moved to a big agency in Manchester.

The power was too much with the clubs. Now it's often too much with the player.
 
bladesmanluke said:
It's not fucking hard to negotiate regardless of how many 00's are on the end of the figures. In my eyes if a young player is too thick to negotiate a good deal for themselves without some parasite leaching off the top and from the club then do they really deserve to make millions for kicking a ball about?

They should've paid more attention at school.

No sorry, agents are not needed.
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Tell that to Petr Katchouro. Luckily for him Jan Aage stepped in and showed him how we had shafted him.
 
Agents can be scum, Players can be scum, Managers can be scum, Club Owners can be scum.

Agents can be great, Players can be great, Managers can be great, Club Owners can be great.

Thats the football industry as it stands. No one aspect can be blamed for a transfer going or not going through. Unless you know the exact ins and outs of negotiations in a transfer or loan then its difficult to comment.
 
larkymasher said:
Agents can be great
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really?

aren't they all just utterley unuseful and unneeded parasites after skimming 10% from the top of every deal

- who smell the money and hover round an impossibly rich sport much in the same way that bluebottles hover around shit?
 
bladesmanluke said:
It's not fucking hard to negotiate regardless of how many 00's are on the end of the figures. In my eyes if a young player is too thick to negotiate a good deal for themselves without some parasite leaching off the top and from the club then do they really deserve to make millions for kicking a ball about?

They should've paid more attention at school.

No sorry, agents are not needed.
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I generally think any arguments about what people "deserve" to earn go into messy territory fast. The answer to the question is that they deserve a good contract just as much as anyone else of a similar level does.

The thing is, players don't have agents just for fun. They have them because they provide a service that benefits the player financially (even if not in other ways). Maybe they scupper the odd deal, but generally they're hired to provide a personal service and they do just that.

Agents are "bad" for the game in that they drive up contracts and selfishness. But here's the thing, if people think that huge businesses owned by multi-millionaire businessmen aren't going to take advantage of players in negotiation and enforcing contracts then, to me, that's just as naive as anything anyone might say in favour of the agents.

We're talking about big business and big money. I'm trying not to go on a big leftist rant here, but I find it really hard to argue against the idea of workers getting representation to maximise their earnings. If you work for a big company then fuck the idea that the guy who wrote out your contract is looking out for your best interests. They aren't and they never have.

Agents are shit but they're only there because giant for-profit businesses like football clubs aren't going to ignore the huge imbalances of power they have over their employees. This is the capitalist model at work.
 



PokerBlade said:
I generally think any arguments about what people "deserve" to earn go into messy territory fast. The answer to the question is that they deserve a good contract just as much as anyone else of a similar level does.

The thing is, players don't have agents just for fun. They have them because they provide a service that benefits the player financially (even if not in other ways). Maybe they scupper the odd deal, but generally they're hired to provide a personal service and they do just that.

Agents are "bad" for the game in that they drive up contracts and selfishness. But here's the thing, if people think that huge businesses owned by multi-millionaire businessmen aren't going to take advantage of players in negotiation and enforcing contracts then, to me, that's just as naive as anything anyone might say in favour of the agents.

We're talking about big business and big money. I'm trying not to go on a big leftist rant here, but I find it really hard to argue against the idea of workers getting representation to maximise their earnings. If you work for a big company then fuck the idea that the guy who wrote out your contract is looking out for your best interests. They aren't and they never have.

Agents are shit but they're only there because giant for-profit businesses like football clubs aren't going to ignore the huge imbalances of power they have over their employees. This is the capitalist model at work.
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A lot of clubs now pay more in wages to players than their annual turnover, so that's a bit of a naff statement that they'd take advantage of the players.

In no other industry could that ever happen. The players get obscene amounts. If they got slightly less by not having an agent fighting their corner in contract negotiations, no big loss really is it?
 
bladesmanluke said:
A lot of clubs now pay more in wages to players than their annual turnover, so that's a bit of a naff statement that they'd take advantage of the players.

In no other industry could that ever happen. The players get obscene amounts. If they got slightly less by not having an agent fighting their corner in contract negotiations, no big loss really is it?
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No big loss to me, no. Don't think it's good for the game either. But it's equally frustrating to me to be asked to feel bad for the big millionaire football clubs and their backers.

Agents are a symptom of big business, not the cause of it.
 
Silent Blade said:
I wish more players would get help from the PFA rather than use greedy football agents
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That's how the game should have gone, PFA representing players rather than agents. They would have had the good of the game at heart and wouldn't be concocting player moves to feather their own nest.

Would it be possible now for all the football governing bodies to ban agents and instruct players that they are to be represented by PFAs in each country???
 
Silent Blade said:
I wish more players would get help from the PFA rather than use greedy football agents
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Have you noticed the average intelligence of a footballer? It's probably below that of a poster on here. They aren't capable of looking after their best interests. That's why agents are needed.
 
Cerberus Blade said:
Have you noticed the average intelligence of a footballer? It's probably below that of a poster on here. They aren't capable of looking after their best interests. That's why agents are needed.
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That's why they should be using PFA, their own Association would look after their best interests. Think an agents first port of call is to feather their own nests which doesn't necessarily tally with what is best for the player involved.
 
vorpal blade said:
really?

aren't they all just utterley unuseful and unneeded parasites after skimming 10% from the top of every deal

- who smell the money and hover round an impossibly rich sport much in the same way that bluebottles hover around shit?
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I'm no fan of agents, but if they served literally no purpose the players and clubs wouldn't use them.

If Jerome Sinclair and Dominguez Quina are unhappy with with how events transpired, and think their careers have been harmed by losing out on the opportunity to play first team football for the Blades they can call their agent and inform them that their services are no longer required.

Nobody forces a player to use an agent; it is far too simplistic to blame the agent when the player could - like Paul Scholes, if I recall correctly - just use a solicitor to take care of the legal aspects of the contract.
 
vorpal blade said:
really?

aren't they all just utterley unuseful and unneeded parasites after skimming 10% from the top of every deal

- who smell the money and hover round an impossibly rich sport much in the same way that bluebottles hover around shit?
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Of course in the world of football an agent can be good.

Any young player who's club decides to get rid needs an agent and his contacts to find him another club. Any young player could not do that.. Mitchels contact list is far smaller dealing with agents who look after multiple players than individual players.

Make no mistake, no club has an issue paying an agent 10% if they get the player they want. Only when they don't get the player will a manager have a moan.
 
larkymasher said:
Of course in the world of football an agent can be good.

Any young player who's club decides to get rid needs an agent and his contacts to find him another club. Any young player could not do that.. Mitchels contact list is far smaller dealing with agents who look after multiple players than individual players.

Make no mistake, no club has an issue paying an agent 10% if they get the player they want. Only when they don't get the player will a manager have a moan.
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The PFA do provide agents. Why not use them instead?
 
snootyfenooty said:
It's because there are at least 4,000 professional footballers in the leagues and the PFA wouldn't be able to cope. The other reason is that the footballers themselves choose to have their own agent.
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Why wouldn't the PFA be able to cope? They have had agents available for years. Bob Hatton was one. Yes footballers have the right to choose their agent but many were badly advised
 
bladesmanluke said:
It's not fucking hard to negotiate regardless of how many 00's are on the end of the figures. In my eyes if a young player is too thick to negotiate a good deal for themselves without some parasite leaching off the top and from the club then do they really deserve to make millions for kicking a ball about?

They should've paid more attention at school.

No sorry, agents are not needed.
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Like I said to the other guy ,did you use an estate agent to buy or sell your house ? I don't remember being taught how to negotiate contracts at school ,or maybe I wasn't listening
 
Silent Blade said:
The PFA do provide agents. Why not use them instead?
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do you feel the same about agents even though every manager in the football league has one?
Do you think Charlton Athetic were chuffed with Wilders agent when he came to us late in the day......

As pointed out, you would not sell a house without an agent, it's all part of the game.
 



larkymasher said:
do you feel the same about agents even though every manager in the football league has one?
Do you think Charlton Athetic were chuffed with Wilders agent when he came to us late in the day......

As pointed out, you would not sell a house without an agent, it's all part of the game.
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You didn't answer my question "why do you think the PFA wouldn't be able to cope". There are players and agents who manage themselves.
Why are you talking about Estate Agents? They don't do the same as football agents?
 
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