Lowton , pure class

[blade too long]

Watched the Villa destroy Sunderland last night 6-1 (now theres a club that had a long spell of not scoring this season too ) and got to say Lowton looks pure class , hes adapted brilliantly and is a shoe in for an England place in the near future.
Best of luck to the lad

 

[Bladesway]

Watched the Villa destroy Sunderland last night 6-1 (now theres a club that had a long spell of not scoring this season too ) and got to say Lowton looks pure class , hes adapted brilliantly and is a shoe in for an England place in the near future.
Best of luck to the lad

Yeah, suddenly the money we got for him doesn't look such a great deal for us does it? Now where have we heard that before?

 

[blade too long]

we are no worse than any other club in our plight, , we sell due to lack of investment , and dont quote its McCabe , he wanted out years ago , its the lack of fresh impetus that we , like 70 other odd clubs fail to attract

 

[Revolution]

Sheffield United - nursery club to the Big Clubs.

Purveyors of quality players since 1967, irrespective of the damage it does to ourselves!

Player under contract? No problem!
No money to give us up front? No problem!
Want 2 players at once? No problem!
Can't pay what they're worth? No problem!

No offer too small to consider!

 

[Balham]

If I remember correctly, the general feeling on here was that we had done well to get £3m (potentially) for Lowton and that his lack of defensive awareness would be found out in the Premier League.

I liked Lowton as a United player - he's everything that a modern fullback should be and is the one player from the play-off final side we've missed most.

Still, you have to remember that we are currently a third tier side and when a big club - Villa are a big club - offers a significant amount of money to the club and player there is little we can do.

How many League One sides have turned down serious offers for their star players? The only one I can think of is Huddersfield and Jordan Rhodes but that was £3m from Fulham for a player they eventually got £8m for.

United's problem seems to be that we don't ever put aspirational values on players (what would have happened if we'd said to Villa that we wanted £5m?); and the players we're selling for millions are defenders, not centre forwards.

 

[JohnDenver]

Watched the Villa destroy Sunderland last night 6-1 (now theres a club that had a long spell of not scoring this season too ) and got to say Lowton looks pure class , hes adapted brilliantly and is a shoe in for an England place in the near future.
Best of luck to the lad

He had a terrific game - looked a top player throughout.

Still think he's got work to do defensively, but he has improved year on year since breaking into senior football so who knows where he'll end up?

 

[Revolution]

If I remember correctly, the general feeling on here was that we had done well to get £3m (potentially) for Lowton and that his lack of defensive awareness would be found out in the Premier League.


Wasn't mine. My general feeling, and many others said the same, was that United were idiots for selling him and it would make promotion harder.

Still, you have to remember that we are currently a third tier side and when a big club - Villa are a big club - offers a significant amount of money to the club and player there is little we can do.

We can say "he's under contract - not for sale"

How many League One sides have turned down serious offers for their star players? The only one I can think of is Huddersfield and Jordan Rhodes but that was £3m from Fulham for a player they eventually got £8m for.

Yes, and they got promoted! You could add Leeds who didn't sell Beckford, but kept him and let him go for nothing at the end of the season...having got promoted!

You think Lowton's value would have gone down this year?

United's problem seems to be that we don't ever put aspirational values on players (what would have happened if we'd said to Villa that we wanted £5m?

I agree with this point, though.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

All good points Rev! Most Blades fans did think Lowton would struggle a bit in the PL and that he was a very good Championship player at best. We could say 'under contract' but...

Just one problem! You then have one player with the serious mardies cos he wanted to go play in the PL for triple the money we pay him. A player who wants to be elsewhere is as much use as a condom to a eunuch.

So, do you just sell, or hold and get a better deal, or hold and try and make him play? You used to be able to do the latter, but such is player-power now it has to be one of the former options. Unfortunately, we have a reputation for always opting for the first choice!

 

[Bladesman]

All good points Rev! Most Blades fans did think Lowton would struggle a bit in the PL and that he was a very good Championship player at best. We could say 'under contract' but...

Just one problem! You then have one player with the serious mardies cos he wanted to go play in the PL for triple the money we pay him. A player who wants to be elsewhere is as much use as a condom to a eunuch.

So, do you just sell, or hold and get a better deal, or hold and try and make him play? You used to be able to do the latter, but such is player-power now it has to be one of the former options. Unfortunately, we have a reputation for always opting for the first choice!

I think in Lowtons case he would have been happy to stay another season had we said no to Villa. In fact a number of players we have sold recently would have been happy to stay but McCabe just can't say no or wait for the the right price.

 

[Revolution]

So, do you just sell, or hold and get a better deal, or hold and try and make him play? You used to be able to do the latter, but such is player-power now it has to be one of the former options.

Well, no it doesn't. Jordan Rhodes is a good example.

Sure, we cannot keep players for ever, but the team will never improve when we sell out best players every six months, and after the last 5 years I am amazed that so many people think we have no choice but to behave like this.

 

[Balham]

If I remember correctly, the general feeling on here was that we had done well to get £3m (potentially) for Lowton and that his lack of defensive awareness would be found out in the Premier League.


Wasn't mine. My general feeling, and many others said the same, was that United were idiots for selling him and it would make promotion harder.

Still, you have to remember that we are currently a third tier side and when a big club - Villa are a big club - offers a significant amount of money to the club and player there is little we can do.

We can say "he's under contract - not for sale"

How many League One sides have turned down serious offers for their star players? The only one I can think of is Huddersfield and Jordan Rhodes but that was £3m from Fulham for a player they eventually got £8m for.

Yes, and they got promoted! You could add Leeds who didn't sell Beckford, but kept him and let him go for nothing at the end of the season...having got promoted!

You think Lowton's value would have gone down this year?

United's problem seems to be that we don't ever put aspirational values on players (what would have happened if we'd said to Villa that we wanted £5m?

I agree with this point, though.

http://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/lowton-to-villa-£3m.27428/

I haven't got the time to look through all 17 pages of this but from the first couple of pages it seems that the general impression is that we'd done extremely well to get £3m for Lowton.

You missed my point on Rhodes. Fulham was the only club to make an offer and it was well below Huddersfield's valuation. Now, had Villa come calling offering £200k rising to £1m for Lowton I would hope that United would have told them to take a running jump but as Villa evidently met our valuation off he went, just as Rhodes would have if Fulham had offered £6-£8m.

Saying that a player is under contract won't dissuade Premiership suitors. In addition, it's an open secret in football that our finances are particularly bad and so we were never going to turn down £3,000,000 - that's 30% of our turnover.

The only player we'd had and kept hold of akin to Rhodes and Beckford was Evans - although we all know the outside reasons for that. I think that we would have done with Evans what Leeds did with Beckford if he'd not been arrested - kept him for the season before losing him on a free.

Finally, playing in this team Lowton's value would probably not have increased. To be honest, only Long and perhaps Maguire will have come out of this year with their reputations enhanced.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

I think in Lowtons case he would have been happy to stay another season had we said no to Villa. In fact a number of players we have sold recently would have been happy to stay but McCabe just can't say no or wait for the the right price.

I'd quantify that significantly and say that Lowton may have been happy to stay had we beaten Huddersfield (and if he'd scored his pen we would have). Once we didn't he was never going to stay! As for the rest, conjecture, but I think most were moving up divisions and more importantly up the payscale so I doubt many would be happy to stay for too much longer after an approach like that.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

Well, no it doesn't. Jordan Rhodes is a good example.

Sure, we cannot keep players for ever, but the team will never improve when we sell out best players every six months, and after the last 5 years I am amazed that so many people think we have no choice but to behave like this.

Jordan Rhodes is a good example of holding out for what you think a player is worth. He wasn't ever going to stay beyond the end of the season once that bid was made. Which was my point! I think we got a decent deal for Lowton given the situation and him being a full-back.

 

[Revolution]

I think we got a decent deal for Lowton given the situation and him being a full-back. ink we got a decent deal for Lowton given the situation and him being a full-back.

Well, I look at the way our current right backs come forward and think differently.

And Balham, some good points, but if you think Lowton would not have played better, and increased his value, this season than last given the way he's played in the PL...well, I despair.

Look, what this comes down to is that the way we are doing things - selling the family silver at the earliest opportunity is not working. It is detrimental to the club. The league table is proof of this. We need to find another way, or it's hello league 2 sooner or later.

 

[Darren]

I think we got a decent deal for Lowton given the situation and him being a full-back. ink we got a decent deal for Lowton given the situation and him being a full-back.

Well, I look at the way our current right backs come forward and think differently.

And Balham, some good points, but if you think Lowton would not have played better, and increased his value, this season than last given the way he's played in the PL...well, I despair.

Look, what this comes down to is that the way we are doing things - selling the family silver at the earliest opportunity is not working. It is detrimental to the club. The league table is proof of this. We need to find another way, or it's hello league 2 sooner or later.

Again, I think not, as I worked out elsewhere, we can pay our players 2-4 times the wages virtually every other club in the division can. That means we will have better players that everyone else. Mismanagement can only bugger that up for so long and sooner or later (the experiennce of similar sized clubs in the 3rd tier says within 5 years at the outside) we will rise to our natural level as a middling 2nd tier team.

 

[Selly]

Again, I think not, as I worked out elsewhere, we can pay our players 2-4 times the wages virtually every other club in the division can. That means we should have better players that everyone else. Mismanagement can only bugger that up for so long and sooner or later (the experiennce of similar sized clubs in the 3rd tier says within 5 years at the outside) we will rise to our natural level as a middling 2nd tier team.

Fixed that for you...but I concur with your general point.

 

[Revolution]

Again, I think not, as I worked out elsewhere, we can pay our players 2-4 times the wages virtually every other club in the division can. That means we will have better players that everyone else. Mismanagement can only bugger that up for so long and sooner or later (the experiennce of similar sized clubs in the 3rd tier says within 5 years at the outside) we will rise to our natural level as a middling 2nd tier team.

You keep saying this, and I hope you are right, but there are outliers (parachute payment funded Wolves are providing a great example in the tier above), and the way this club is run makes me worry that this decline will get worse.

Further, we can pay our players more, but that does not mean we will do so.

I might add that many of the points you cite were also true at the start of 1980-1.

 

[broomhillblade]

Sheffield United - nursery club to the Big Clubs.

Purveyors of quality players since 1967, irrespective of the damage it does to ourselves!

Player under contract? No problem!
No money to give us up front? No problem!
Want 2 players at once? No problem!
Can't pay what they're worth? No problem!

No offer too small to consider!

Why stop at 1967? My dad used to go on about how we let Jock Dodds go to Blackpool in March 1939.

Mind you, the £10,000 we got for him was a record fee, and it did not stop the team being promoted that year.

 

[Darren]

You keep saying this, and I hope you are right, but there are outliers (parachute payment funded Wolves are providing a great example in the tier above), and the way this club is run makes me worry that this decline will get worse.

Further, we can pay our players more, but that does not mean we will do so.

I might add that many of the points you cite were also true at the start of 1980-1.

Indeed, but

(a) the gap between us the"lesser teams" was far less in 80-81 than it was now;
(b) Getting relegated in 80-81 was something of a freak occurence (the equivalent of 54 points and positive goal difference);
(c) We did indeed only spend 5 years in the lower divisions in that period (79-84):
(d) since the advent of Sky, I don't think any club one would reasoanbly called a big one has fallen to the depths of the 4th tier, apart from the sui generis example of Portsmouth - in the 70's and 80's it wasn't that uncommon - Portsmouth, United, Wolves and Burnley all managed it and Wednesday nearly did.

 

[Revolution]

Why stop at 1967? My dad used to go on about how we let Jock Dodds go to Blackpool in March 1939.

Mind you, the £10,000 we got for him was a record fee, and it did not stop the team being promoted that year.

It goes back to Jimmy Dunne in 1933 actually...

Dodds was my Grandad's favourite player at the time. That sale could have been a mistake...but the War broke out. Dodds was fantastic in Wartime football, but of course none of that counted for much, and Blackpool paid all that money for a third of a league season and a lot of goals in Wartime football.

 

[DazBlade88]

I didn't see him last night, but having watched Villa for much of the season he has improved dramatically since he left here. His development has obviously been helped by playing with and against better players, and he has adapted his game brilliantly. He still has a lot to learn but is determination to succeed should help him.

Had he stayed at the Lane, I don't think he would have developed nearly as much as he has. The price we got at the time was fair, because most of us never expected him to improve so quickly. Bearing in mind he was 23 when he left, we couldn't bump the price up too much for "potential", where we could with the Kyles.

 

[KenMcnaughtsNuts]

hes a little cracker intee.

if only we had players like that...

amazing the small club mentality we have, fed from decades of owners who couldnt find a fat bird in wilkinsons.

think about this...why are clubs like villa, sunderland, southampton, west brom such bigger clubs than us? its not fans is it...if we were in the top flight 20 seasons in a row like villa we'd be getting 30,000+ gates every game. even clubs like tottenham and man city we've had times where we had bigger gates than those. not to mentioned norwich, wigan etc who on paper we should be much bigger than.

im not saying were as big as any of these clubs, cos obviously we arent anywhere near most of them, but the only reason we arent is because weve not had one decent owner/chairman in the 30 years ive been following us and probably long beyond that too. when you think of the muppets who have run this club its frightening. most of them have been that big crooks they make the krays look like gandhi.

 

[blade too long]

We as a club have never had a board that invested, ever, the knocking down of the old John St stand showed how little all members put in as it took an embarrassing length of time to kick start it .
We had one 1 million pound buy who lasted 8 minutes or so that petrified the board so much we never bought another. Our previous big buy was Guthrie , who likewise lasted 8 minutes before we realised he was shit.
Mccabe HAD put up more than most, but has been sat in the departure lounge waiting for a flight out of here for some time, so we are a club treading water until , some russian or sheik gives us wheel barrows full of money to throw at players, and until then we will continue to put our players on ebay to keep us solvent.

 

[mattbianco1]

Watched the Villa destroy Sunderland last night 6-1 (now theres a club that had a long spell of not scoring this season too ) and got to say Lowton looks pure class , hes adapted brilliantly and is a shoe in for an England place in the near future.
Best of luck to the lad

The interception and ball through for (one of) the goals was great.

There's an art to playing a ball over the top. That was a precise pass, whereas Collins & Maguire hoof it !

 

[blade too long]

There's an art to playing a ball over the top. That was a precise pass, whereas Collins & Maguire hoof it !

How very dare you ,they are waiting with several inch perfect through balls for a special occasion , or 3

 

[Bladesway]

Whatever the reason you can always justify a sale when you are McCabe. See the following possible answers:-

His Agent was pushing for the move
We couldn't turn the money down
The Player wants to go
We funded the purchase of X with Y

And those are just to start with.

What gets my goat (leave it Dazzler) is that we talk the talk but we have never walked the walk in getting continuity through our transfer policy. When someone like Derby comes flashing £3m for Lee Morris, of course you have to let him go, it would be madness not to. But time and time again our version of bluff is seemingly to sit there and accept whatever offer is made.

These fuckers are under contract. If it doesn't mean anything and we can't stop them then lets stop giving contracts out. Its exactly what a contract is for. If a player doesn't like it half way through then tough shit, we will wait until someone meets the proper valuation (and £3m is beans in todays game).

Secondly other clubs are so much better than we are at getting players loaned back to them, or getting favorable terms that help them. I can only assume we send sooty and sweep into negotiations because no one of any compotence seems to attend. Perhaps McCabe should pay good money for a negotiator rather than some swanky Chief Exec or such bollocks.

Next up (and most infuriating) we don't have to be this club dropping its draws after the first taste of alcopops passes its lips. Just because Tottenham, Villa, or anyone else is interested doesn't mean we have to do it. So Sheffield United have been a soft touch previously well you can stop that in an instant. Say no whenever clubs come knocking. If your player is that good then they will pay whatever you tell them to. The two Kyles for instance, why the fuck didn't we get them loaned back to us for a season? Why didn't we say no to one of them going? Perhaps kept Walker for another season where his valuation could go through the roof. If it doesn't then you have kept a bloody good player.

Lastly for me, stop telling us its going to be about youth and then changing course half way through a season. I am utterly convinced that without the meddling from McCabe this season we would have got promoted automatically. Selling first Quinn, then Blackman (probably more significant the second one) has absolutley banjaxed us. Its a false economy. Had we not sold Beattie and Tonge etc mid season then we would have had the best possible chance of going into the Premiership (even under Blackwell that looked a decent bet). FFS that day out against Burnley would have been so much better had Kilgallon, Beattie (the good one) and Tonge all been options for us. Thats assuming we didn't get promoted automatically.

Look at it and look at us.

Inside 5 years James Beattie & Rob Hulse have become Darius Henderson , Richard Cresswell, Nick Blackman, Jonathan Forte, Chris Porter, Dave Kitson and Jamie Murphy.

We haven't traded up and every time we have had a good one they have been sold. I'm sorry but McCabe has to stick his neck on the block and believe for one last time we can and will get promoted. Give it a season rather than getting all nervous half way through. Give a manager a budget and tell him when its gone, its gone. Tell him you will invest into him for one season and if he doesn't get you up he is history.

It doesn't have to be complicated because promotion out of this shithole has to be achieved or we are bust. If we are bust and thats where we are put the lot up for sale and lets accept what comes. What I have always liked about Blades fans is we accept honesty no matter how crap the situation may be. What none of us like is deception. Stop lying to us McCabe and you'll get an easier ride.

 

[OllyBlade]

Kilgallon did play vs Burnley? Apart from that, I agree.

 

[ZoneManWilf]

(b) Getting relegated in 80-81 was something of a freak occurence (the equivalent of 54 points and positive goal difference);

And it's not like any freak occurrences happen to us is it?

 

[Sheff de party]

Yeah, suddenly the money we got for him doesn't look such a great deal for us does it? Now where have we heard that before?

I think it's a shame that, on a page congratulating one of our own for a scintillating performance at full back, where he skinned someone every time he got the ball and set up a goal, could be future England and has almost capped a very good season, the first post in reply to OP criticises United.

I expect it from metalblade or Micalijo but must we all do the same?

 

[Bladesway]

Kilgallon did play vs Burnley? Apart from that, I agree.

I apologise your right. Shouldn't go picking names out of a hat really should I?