Leon

[1889]

It was a superb ball from Fleck, all Leon had to do was let it hit his foot to divert it into the corner, but as others have said, VAR would have disallowed it anyway.

 

[super_pig]

It was a superb ball from Fleck, all Leon had to do was let it hit his foot to divert it into the corner, but as others have said, VAR would have disallowed it anyway.

all he had to do was volley in the bouncing ball whilst not been put in hospital by the collision sandwich with the keeper and defender behind him

 

[8lade]

Wrong substitution in my view.

Osborne for me, can help more in the build up and hit them from range.

 

[1889]

all he had to do was volley in the bouncing ball whilst not been put in hospital by the collision sandwich with the keeper and defender behind him

Really? If the thought of ‘hurting himself’ even entered his head, I think he’d have retired from the game, many, many years ago

 

[super_pig]

If the thought of ‘hurting himself’ even entered his head, I think he’d have retired from the game many years ago

sarcasm not your strong point? i was saying i didn’t think it was as straightforward as people are making out and he was brave to go in there .. ffs

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Osborne for me, can help more in the build up and hit them from range.

Osborn.

 

[TAMUS]

Think CW and Leon had an agreement,if he got one start in premier,then he would look for another club can't see any other reason he was the preferred option from the bench.

What a cracking first post , not .i get a early stench of pork

 

[1889]

sarcasm not your strong point? i was saying i didn’t think it was as straightforward as people are making out and he was brave to go in there .. ffs

Sarcasm is actually my specialised subject.

I apologise, on second reading, your post was not in the least bit ambiguous and you make an excellent point. You clearly played football to a decent standard yourself ?

 

[super_pig]

Sarcasm is actually my specialised subject.

I apologise, your post was not in the least ambiguous and you make an excellent point. You clearly played football to a decent standard yourself ?

heh good reposte .. for anyone else, the clue was in the big smiley at the end i once played for jordanthorpe cubs?

 

[John Street West Terrace]

Thought Leon did alright when he came on as part of a front 3 , we looked a lot more dangerous , think were gonna have to be a bit more adventurous in some games to come if we want some 3 point returns

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

I didn't want to see him in a United shirt again after he left for Wigan, that view was re-enforced after watching him v. Sunderland and was further re-enforced after watching him v. Liverpool. He looked like what he is/has been for the vast majority of his career (save for a golden spell with us at the back end of '17 that earned him a renewal & pay rise), a lower league, low scoring, slow, cumbersome, one dimensional CF, who plays on his heels, is slow to re-act, with an awful goals to chances ratio.

He had the best chance v. Sunderland in mid week and didn't hit the target from close in, and had the same again yesterday. Whether or not he was offside is a moot point; stick the ball in the back of the net and let the ref decide.

He was lucky to be at the club last year and 6 goals in 40 games for the season in the championship shows that his level is now L1. Him being still on our books is jaw dropping and now featuring is miraculous. We have David Parkhouse on our books who is being coveted by more established PL teams that us, and yet he's out on loan. Yesterday, with 13 minutes left, we needed exuberance, vim & vigor and we get Leon. I would rather have gone 4-3-3 and put Freeman out wide up top.

 

[snootyfenooty]

I didn't want to see him in a United shirt again after he left for Wigan, that view was re-enforced after watching him v. Sunderland and was further re-enforced after watching him v. Liverpool. He looked like what he is/has been for the vast majority of his career (save for a golden spell with us at the back end of '17 that earned him a renewal & pay rise), a lower league, low scoring, slow, cumbersome, one dimensional CF, who plays on his heels, is slow to re-act, with an awful goals to chances ratio.

He had the best chance v. Sunderland in mid week and didn't hit the target from close in, and had the same again yesterday. Whether or not he was offside is a moot point; stick the ball in the back of the net and let the ref decide.

He was lucky to be at the club last year and 6 goals in 40 games for the season in the championship shows that his level is now L1. Him being still on our books is jaw dropping and now featuring is miraculous. We have David Parkhouse on our books who is being coveted by more established PL teams that us, and yet he's out on loan. Yesterday, with 13 minutes left, we needed exuberance, vim & vigor and we get Leon. I would rather have gone 4-3-3 and put Freeman out wide up top.

You forgot to add that he's on the best part of £20k pw which is why no one took him off the books this summer and similarly why no one will be doing so in January. Better get used to him, he'll be around for the rest of the season. I don't think you'll find anyone at the club sidelining him or hanging him out to dry either as Leon's done nothing wrong to land himself in the situation he's in.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

You forgot to add that he's on the best part of £20k pw which is why no one took him off the books this summer and similarly why no one will be doing so in January. Better get used to him, he'll be around for the rest of the season. I don't think you'll find anyone at the club sidelining him or hanging him out to dry either as Leon's done nothing wrong to land himself in the situation he's in.

The same could be said for jake wright and he seemed to get it.

LC's basically contracted to us for another 9 months, that's about £780,000 on your figures. For the money that is at stake in keeping in the PL, either pay LC up or part fund his salary to move him on. We need better, we need a goal threat on the pitch & off the bench and unfortunately LC isn't the player tp provide either. We are 9 games into this season in all comps, and we've scored 9 goals, that's a worry.

 

[snootyfenooty]

The same could be said for jake wright and he seemed to get it.

LC's basically contracted to us for another 9 months, that's about £780,000 on your figures. For the money that is at stake in keeping in the PL, either pay LC up or part fund his salary to move him on. We need better, we need a goal threat on the pitch & off the bench and unfortunately LC isn't the player tp provide either. We are 9 games into this season in all comps, and we've scored 9 goals, that's a worry.

Jake Wright would have been on peanuts compared to Leon, there's nothing to compare here. Regardless of this, I was simply explaining why we are where we are with respect to Leon, not his ability and future prospects as a premiership striker. Slagging him off isn't going to change anything.

 

[Maidenhead]

I thought we lacked a bit up front, we haven't quite got that finisher on the pitch when we need one

I think it's ok to look a bit light up front against the European champions.

Let's judge when we're playing the teams that we realistically need to be beating

 

[Kevincarterversion2.0]

As much as Leon has a cult status with us after his goals against the Pigs, in reality, we need to be doing better than bringing him on in the PL. I doubt he will be on the bench once Billy is available again.

 

[SwissBlade]

I think it's ok to look a bit light up front against the European champions.

Let's judge when we're playing the teams that we realistically need to be beating

So this is part of the issue that i have. We're excusing ourselves when we really shouldn't be.

We proved ourselves to be just short of a match for Liverpool. If we had a Keeper that concentrated on a soft shot and we had strikers that could tuck the ball away (we have a £500k striker that would've taken at least two of the chances. McBurnie would've hit the target with the Robbo header etc)

We were good enough in so many aspects and what i loved with Wilders comments is that he was spot on. We should've been talking about a famous win. We were so close to it, like Norwich did against City.

Yes we will and should be beating sides around where we sit in the league. But we can also be looking at Liverpool and Man City and believing that we can take points off them too.

 

[Maidenhead]

So this is part of the issue that i have. We're excusing ourselves when we really shouldn't be.

We proved ourselves to be just short of a match for Liverpool. If we had a Keeper that concentrated on a soft shot and we had strikers that could tuck the ball away (we have a £500k striker that would've taken at least two of the chances. McBurnie would've hit the target with the Robbo header etc)

We were good enough in so many aspects and what i loved with Wilders comments is that he was spot on. We should've been talking about a famous win. We were so close to it, like Norwich did against City.

Yes we will and should be beating sides around where we sit in the league. But we can also be looking at Liverpool and Man City and believing that we can take points off them too.

I believe we can but I also think that it's unrealistic to castigate our players when we don't.

 

[SwissBlade]

I believe we can but I also think that it's unrealistic to castigate our players when we don't.

Its not castigating to state the truth. We lacked the finishing of Billy or even Mousset when we need it.

I'd reckon that Robbo or Mousset would've bagged that Leon chance, McBurnie would've taken the Robbo header.

Its a case of analysing things to see where we can improve. How can we get Robbo or Mousset in the position of Leon?

 

[cc1]

I didn't want to see him in a United shirt again after he left for Wigan, that view was re-enforced after watching him v. Sunderland and was further re-enforced after watching him v. Liverpool. He looked like what he is/has been for the vast majority of his career (save for a golden spell with us at the back end of '17 that earned him a renewal & pay rise), a lower league, low scoring, slow, cumbersome, one dimensional CF, who plays on his heels, is slow to re-act, with an awful goals to chances ratio.

He had the best chance v. Sunderland in mid week and didn't hit the target from close in, and had the same again yesterday. Whether or not he was offside is a moot point; stick the ball in the back of the net and let the ref decide.

He was lucky to be at the club last year and 6 goals in 40 games for the season in the championship shows that his level is now L1. Him being still on our books is jaw dropping and now featuring is miraculous. We have David Parkhouse on our books who is being coveted by more established PL teams that us, and yet he's out on loan. Yesterday, with 13 minutes left, we needed exuberance, vim & vigor and we get Leon. I would rather have gone 4-3-3 and put Freeman out wide up top.

Whilst I agree with some of that, the first paragraph is frustration boiling over into almost personal hatred, it's bullshit. How is he one dimensional? What is the dimension?? It's not his fault he got rewarded with a good contract and it's not his fault he came off the bench yesterday and missed a very tough chance.

It's a forum, I get it, but ffs

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Whilst I agree with some of that, the first paragraph is frustration boiling over into almost personal hatred, it's bullshit. How is he one dimensional? What is the dimension?? It's not his fault he got rewarded with a good contract and it's not his fault he came off the bench yesterday and missed a very tough chance.

It's a forum, I get it, but ffs

My post is far from 'personal hatred'. It's a comment on his capabilities as a PL footballer. A personal view and it's certainly not 'boiling over' in any sense or form. You call it 'bullshit', that's your right.

Although grateful for his efforts in our last season in L1 and first season back in the champ, I thought that we could do better than him in our second. That was shown by CW bringing in Madine and Hogan, and sending LC out on loan to Wigan, where he struggled. As I said, once we got promoted I didn't really want to see him feature again for us (not in a F off kind of way, just that we'd moved out quality bar upwards). I thought both loanees were better players than LC, yet both were apparently deemed not good enough for us this season and we brought in McB, Moose & CR to compliment BS & McG.

I thought that we could do better than him in the Champ, and that view hasn't changed as we've gone up a level and he's got a year older. I'm not blaming him for having a good contract, he recived it on the back of his great goal scoring during November & December in 2017, but he's not been as prolific since. He cost us very little, has given very good service, but going forward he isn't what we need. I thought that he was poor against Sunderland and looked off the pace, again that's simply my opinion and people are quite free to disagree. He has scored 6 goals in 40 games at the level below, and didn't impress Wigan enough to take him back this season.

What I mean by 'one dimensional' is that I think he lacks depth of skill, nuance and overall quality to his play. Or at least sufficient depth and nuance to compete against PL defenders. He works hard, is relatively mobile, but is a straight up & down centre forward, who also seems to lack awareness/speed of reaction of what's around him.

If you think that the chance he missed yesterday (offside or not) was a 'very tough chance', then our views differ on levels of difficulty. I would also suggest that he shuould've at least forced the keeper into making a save agaisnt Sunderland, from the position and time he was in.

 

[cc1]

Fair enough and fair points, but your initial post said he's slow and cumbersome but the above says he's relatively mobile, not sure he can be both.
Anyway, I think the above is a diet version of your initial post NC and like I said initially I agree with a lot of what you write; I also think we need better quality to survive at this level but if that doesn't come my frustration won't be directed toward a bloke who's given us good service, and at the end of the day was doing his best irrespective of whether the ball ended up in the net.

Woodwardfan said in the shout box that it's simplistic to say 'sharpE plays sharpE scores' regarding the chance at the end yesterday. I know it's possibly (and probably) utter crap but i would have preferred us to go with what we had than punt 20 million on McB. Not seeing what additional hes giving us, nothing against him and of course he doesn't set his own price tag

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Fair enough and fair points, but your initial post said he's slow and cumbersome but the above says he's relatively mobile, not sure he can be both.
Anyway, I think the above is a diet version of your initial post NC and like I said initially I agree with a lot of what you write; I also think we need better quality to survive at this level but if that doesn't come my frustration won't be directed toward a bloke who's given us good service, and at the end of the day was doing his best irrespective of whether the ball ended up in the net.

Woodwardfan said in the shout box that it's simplistic to say 'sharpE plays sharpE scores' regarding the chance at the end yesterday. I know it's possibly (and probably) utter crap but i would have preferred us to go with what we had than punt 20 million on McB. Not seeing what additional hes giving us, motjing sgainst him and of course he diesnt set his own price tag

A diet version? There was a bit of a backtrack I think in retrospect; the truth lies a fair bit closer to your view of LC, than mine.

 

[cc1]

A diet version? There was a bit of a backtrack I think in retrospect; the truth lies a fair bit closer to your view of LC, than mine.

I wouldn't trust owt i wrote to be honest, I have to edit it about 8 times, first attempt looks like I'm slaughtered!

 

[PokerBlade]

I can't say I expected to see Leon play in the Prem. I thought some of the things Wilder said about players moving on were aimed at him and with three strikers signed for decent money that seemed like an end to it. And it's taken an early suspension and a few players carrying injuries to get him near the team, and I still thought Wilder would be more likely to bring Ravel or Freeman on ahead of him. Can't say it's the move I'd have made.

What I liked about the sub though is what it says about Wilder and what it says to the squad players: he isn't bullshitting when he says players will get their chances if they earn them. I think most managers would be annoyed at Leon not leaving in the Summer and warehouse him out of spite. I think most managers would think, well, I've signed a big name like Ravel Morrison, of course I'm going to put him in. Wilder refuses to pick the side based on reputation and in doing so let's the whole squad know what's expected.

How many sides will dare to go three up top for any length of time vs Liverpool this season?