Kean Bryan is alive

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Really hope we never have to resort to playing him in a serious game. Thing is Ben Osborn looked equally as shite tonight.
 



I’ve seen Bryan 2 or 3 times and every time he’s looked at best, very average.
Obviously you can’t judge a player on 2 or 3 games, so prepared to give him time. Wilder obviously rates him.
 
I haven’t a problem with losing to a league 1 side with what was mainly a second string side but I was niggled tonight by the fact that Sunderland wanted it more. I can also accept that the back up squad aren’t as fluid as the first team but we seriously looked like a group of strangers asked if they fancied a kick about in the park. You have to question how much some of the players wanted it. On the basis of tonight just like Barnet last year quite a few have done themselves no favours tonight
 
JackSUFC said:
Really hope we never have to resort to playing him in a serious game. Thing is Ben Osborn looked equally as shite tonight.
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I thought Osborn were one of best out of very bad bunch.

He has also looked decent from the bench. I don’t think his performances will have Stevens worried but if JOC was to be out for a few games I’d much rather Osborn comes in at LWB with Stevens at LCB than Bryan playing. Can’t with just give Bryan to Rotherham or something.
 
Millhousesblade1889 said:
It would mean enda going to the left of the three and Osborn starting....who is also shite 😂
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I thought Osbourne improved immensely when Bryan went off Osbourne dropped back and Fleck came on. Thought he and Fleck looked much better going forward then. Prior there was no movement when Osbourne had the ball so no progress. My opinion is KB won't make a footballer while he has a hole in his ass!
Also thought Besic and Ravel were poor and passing backwards all the time, but the real fault seems to be little or no movement ahead of them.
Dissapointing night all round.
 
I'm pretty sure, from what I've seen of Bryan, my 13yr old step son could easily play in that position and do no worse!
 
JackSUFC said:
Really hope we never have to resort to playing him in a serious game. Thing is Ben Osborn looked equally as shite tonight.
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Osborn is a good player though. No one actually shone did they?
Seen Ben in 3 games at LWB for us, Barnsley, Blackburn and today. He’s only played poorly today. Also did well when he came on and helped us get a result at Chelsea and Everton.
 
Looks like a player with zero confidence in his ability. Passes either sideways, or a lot of the time if he tries to go forward he makes poor decisions and puts the player receiving the ball under pressure, or simply gives the ball away.

Enda, don’t get injured!
 
Old Programme seller said:
If I remember rightly the last time Chris did this we lost to Barnet, when you have a settled team that isn’t rotated too much then put 10 none first team players in to play chances are they’re not going to gel.
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Sunderland made 8 changes to their usual League 1 starting 11. It didn't seem to upset them too much.
 
derfblade.3 said:
Why do you "have a feeling" he will never play in our first team? Coming from Man City can't be a bad thing. Maybe u checked him out on Wikki or you tube, or maybe you went to watch him playing shit last season to come up with these negative views. Give the kid a chance to get fit and playing.
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I'm sticking with my opinion as posted on 28th December 2018. He'll never play in our first team. Some of us can spot a good player, or a bad player, when we see one.

Are you sticking with yours?
 
Akinbiyi said:
Osborn is a good player though. No one actually shone did they?
Seen Ben in 3 games at LWB for us, Barnsley, Blackburn and today. He’s only played poorly today. Also did well when he came on and helped us get a result at Chelsea and Everton.
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He was shite against Barnsley shite against Blackburn though he improved when he went off injured after about 20 minutes
 



Will the pictures he's got of Wilder get him another contract?
 
Seen him twice (Barnet and Sunderland). Awful in both games which also happen to be the 2 worst we have played in recent seasons. Poor commitment, little ability demonstrated, no improvement and no appetite. Still drawing a wage.
 
Akinbiyi said:
Look at how many shocks there has been over the past 2 days. All resting players. It’s not a coincidence is it?

nothing compares to real matches.
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Given they're probably on an average of 10k per week, this was a real match and those who played in it should be hanging their heads this morning.

We would have had Oxford away for a quarter final spot.

That said, without Basham and O'Connell I'm not sure it makes sense to be so married to our formation.

With the personal and wanting some familiarity we may as well just gone 4-4-2.
 
Champagneblade said:
Given they're probably on an average of 10k per week, this was a real match and those who played in it should be hanging their heads this morning.

We would have had Oxford away for a quarter final spot.

That said, without Basham and O'Connell I'm not sure it makes sense to be so married to our formation.

With the personal and wanting some familiarity we may as well just gone 4-4-2.
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I’m not saying I disagree with you. I’m saying just look at the rest the results from the past 2 days from Prem teams who’ve rested even half the team, not 10 players. West Ham, Bournemouth, even Spurs. Man United held at home to Rochdale. All to League One or worse.

We don’t have the players for a 4-4-2, but I’d agree no point playing the 5 without both Basham and JOC. I’d go for a flat back 4, midfield diamond with 2 up top.
 
RMBlade said:
I thought Osborn were one of best out of very bad bunch.

He has also looked decent from the bench. I don’t think his performances will have Stevens worried but if JOC was to be out for a few games I’d much rather Osborn comes in at LWB with Stevens at LCB than Bryan playing. Can’t with just give Bryan to Rotherham or something.
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Akinbiyi said:
Osborn is a good player though. No one actually shone did they?
Seen Ben in 3 games at LWB for us, Barnsley, Blackburn and today. He’s only played poorly today. Also did well when he came on and helped us get a result at Chelsea and Everton.
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Yeah, maybe harsh to single Osborn out when it was a collectively poor performance for the team. He's a level or two above Bryan and will be useful this season in his role as cover for Enda and the midfield.
 
I can see why Wilder has tried to persist with Bryan. We all know what we ask of our defenders – particularly in the RCB and LCB slots – isn’t what’s normally asked of a defender. It means we’re in the tricky position of having to scout players for a position which will be entirely new to anyone who comes in. And we may think they have the traits but we then need to spend time getting them used to the system. I read George Baldock’s short piece in Danny Hall’s book and he said he was chucked into a full 11v11 training match in one of his very first sessions with us, and he and Enda Stevens looked at each other and basically said “what are we supposed to be doing here?!” And that’s two full backs essentially being asked to play wing back. Imagine a centre back or midfielder coming in and slotting into our defence.

I still think there’s time yet with Bryan. Playing in a second-string team with others who are unfamiliar with the system won’t help. I bet he’d look better if he slotted in at LCB with the first time and had Enda outside him, Egan next to him, and Norwood always offering for the ball.

But maybe that won’t be good enough. And we’ll need to try again. But Wilder can’t be blamed for trying with him. The good thing about playing in the Premier League – and having the resources of a Premier League team – means the calibre of player is better and we should find it a bit easier to find centre backs who are comfortable with the ball at their feet and roaming forward. Or midfielders who can shift back into defence (although I reckon normally the midfielders who shift backwards do so because they’re not so great at carrying the ball, but that’s a side point).
 
LondonBlade89 said:
I can see why Wilder has tried to persist with Bryan. We all know what we ask of our defenders – particularly in the RCB and LCB slots – isn’t what’s normally asked of a defender. It means we’re in the tricky position of having to scout players for a position which will be entirely new to anyone who comes in. And we may think they have the traits but we then need to spend time getting them used to the system. I read George Baldock’s short piece in Danny Hall’s book and he said he was chucked into a full 11v11 training match in one of his very first sessions with us, and he and Enda Stevens looked at each other and basically said “what are we supposed to be doing here?!” And that’s two full backs essentially being asked to play wing back. Imagine a centre back or midfielder coming in and slotting into our defence.

I still think there’s time yet with Bryan. Playing in a second-string team with others who are unfamiliar with the system won’t help. I bet he’d look better if he slotted in at LCB with the first time and had Enda outside him, Egan next to him, and Norwood always offering for the ball.

But maybe that won’t be good enough. And we’ll need to try again. But Wilder can’t be blamed for trying with him. The good thing about playing in the Premier League – and having the resources of a Premier League team – means the calibre of player is better and we should find it a bit easier to find centre backs who are comfortable with the ball at their feet and roaming forward. Or midfielders who can shift back into defence (although I reckon normally the midfielders who shift backwards do so because they’re not so great at carrying the ball, but that’s a side point).
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Nice to see a measured analysis, rather than just calling him shite.


I think that some people forget that in our system, the CB is arguably the most important player, and is being asked to do a lot more than a conventional CB.

I think it's also useful to remember that Bryan was bought to be cover for a newly promoted championship club, and the team as a whole has developed faster than he has.

I personally don't think Bryan will make the grade for us, but then again, I didn't think particularly much of Lundstram either.

Disappointing to see people call our own players shite though: if Wilder has kept them around, they're attitude is obviously good enough. Don't understand why people can't just say "I don't rate them" rather than resulting to vitriol - save that for people like Dean Hammond.
 
Akinbiyi said:
I’m not saying I disagree with you. I’m saying just look at the rest the results from the past 2 days from Prem teams who’ve rested even half the team, not 10 players. West Ham, Bournemouth, even Spurs. Man United held at home to Rochdale. All to League One or worse.

We don’t have the players for a 4-4-2, but I’d agree no point playing the 5 without both Basham and JOC. I’d go for a flat back 4, midfield diamond with 2 up top.
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Not a bad shout that last one. I'd say 4-2-3-1 would have been workable too with Besic and Osborn at the base.

It's gone now, but it's a pity for those that just didn't turn up because their next game might not be until December now. And that's their own doing.
 
Kanye said:
Nice to see a measured analysis, rather than just calling him shite.


I think that some people forget that in our system, the CB is arguably the most important player, and is being asked to do a lot more than a conventional CB.

I think it's also useful to remember that Bryan was bought to be cover for a newly promoted championship club, and the team as a whole has developed faster than he has.

I personally don't think Bryan will make the grade for us, but then again, I didn't think particularly much of Lundstram either.

Disappointing to see people call our own players shite though: if Wilder has kept them around, they're attitude is obviously good enough. Don't understand why people can't just say "I don't rate them" rather than resulting to vitriol - save that for people like Dean Hammond.
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Unfortunately, at the moment he looks poor in every aspect of his game; positionally poor, technically poor, physically poor and seems to lack a wider understanding of what is happening around him. He's struggling to do the simple stuff.

If this was occurring with him playing on the right hand side of defence, against premier league opposition after a long injury lay off, I think people would cut him more slack. He's managing to look poor on his strongest side, in roughly his supposed best position, against opposition that should be viewed as sub standard, having now been at the club for over a year, having been 'worked' on.

Obviously, I don't see him on a day-to-day basis and so my sample size of his performances is very small, and he might be pulling trees out in training and get overcome by nerves on match days. I don't know. He's also approaching his 23 birthday, so it's not like he's 17 and fresh into the game. How much longer to we persevere with him? As a comparison JOC was 22 when he joined us.

It's rightly been pointed out that he came through the Man City set up, but John Cofie came through the Man Utd set up to much fanfare. From what I have seen of Bryan, he currently looks like a competent young L2 level defender, making his way in the game; which is surely not the level of player that we should have at the club?

What I find somewhat concerning is that we currently don't have anyone else on our books 'coming through' who is viewed by CWAK as being better (or at least comparable) than him, and who would have benefited from either playing or been on the bench last night.
 
Nicolaus_Copernicus said:
Unfortunately, at the moment he looks poor in every aspect of his game; positionally poor, technically poor, physically poor and seems to lack a wider understanding of what is happening around him. He's struggling to do the simple stuff.

If this was occurring with him playing on the right hand side of defence, against premier league opposition after a long injury lay off, I think people would cut him more slack. He's managing to look poor on his strongest side, in roughly his supposed best position, against opposition that should be viewed as sub standard, having now been at the club for over a year, having been 'worked' on.

Obviously, I don't see him on a day-to-day basis and so my sample size of his performances is very small, and he might be pulling trees out in training and get overcome by nerves on match days. I don't know. He's also approaching his 23 birthday, so it's not like he's 17 and fresh into the game. How much longer to we persevere with him? As a comparison JOC was 22 when he joined us.

It's rightly been pointed out that he came through the Man City set up, but John Cofie came through the Man Utd set up to much fanfare. From what I have seen of Bryan, he currently looks like a competent young L2 level defender, making his way in the game; which is surely not the level of player that we should have at the club?

What I find somewhat concerning is that we currently don't have anyone else on our books 'coming through' who is viewed by CWAK as being better (or at least comparable) than him, and who would have benefited from either playing or been on the bench last night.
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I'd agree he looks underwhelming, I said myself in the post you replied to that I don't think he's going to make the grade.

He isn't the first player to get a move based on the prestige of his academy either, as far as I'm concerned, him coming from City doesn't have any bearing on my perception of him as a player.

And I'm not saying he's going to be a successful player, if that's what you're getting at? All I'm saying is calling him shite is unnecessary. It's childish.

And as for your last sentence: I'm personally not concerned about the young players coming through. Most of the accounts I've heard about Norrington-Davies are encouraging, and I feel his development is better served by having a full season of league football, rather than playing 5 cup games a season for us.
I think Wilder and his team have forsaken recruiting too many young players in order to use funds to get us to where we are now - it's hard to argue their approach hasn't worked: we're in the premier league and I'm sure if we stay here, we'll be able to both afford and attract a better calibre of young player.
 



Champagneblade said:
Not a bad shout that last one. I'd say 4-2-3-1 would have been workable too with Besic and Osborn at the base.

It's gone now, but it's a pity for those that just didn't turn up because their next game might not be until December now. And that's their own doing.
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Yep, agreed. Shame for them, but even if the team isn't functioning well it doesn't stop you doing the basics well yourself.

I think the only ones I can see starting in the near future barring an injury/suspension catastrophe of those who started yesterday are Luke Freeman, Jags and the front 2. But don't get me wrong none of them did themselves any favours. Potentially Ravel too as he's still an unknown quantity, he'd be much better IMO next to Norwood and Baldock than Besic and K Freeman. He's got all the natural talent in the world, but had an off night last night.
 
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