How do football bans work,anyone been banned before?

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In all seriousness, it's a shame there wasn't CCTV back in these days of fights/injuries/deaths occurring (regularly) for no reason whatsoever.

I've seen "coppers" getting a bad rep in this thread, but I'm in full support of them arresting and jailing people that attack people in and around football days out.

I'm a big boy, I understand violence happens - humans are fuckers/fucked, and I'm far from perfect myself. But those levels of violence should have disappeared hundreds of years ago thanks to evolution - not after an intense police crackdown in 80s/90s. We're not very low IQ cavemen.

Also see a lot of talk about self-preservation and protecting people as an excuse for being involved in violence, but it's obviously false to suggest it was always other people instigating violence. There were many Blades fans injuring people and smashing up other towns and cities. Fucking pathetic.

Agree the coked up folk are generally dickheads, but it's not cocaines fault, people make their own choices. I've known a lot of people doing coke and never getting in a fight. Stupid drug though, don't do it kids - it's absolutely awful for your heart as well.
 
brownblade said:
I'm a big boy, I understand violence happens - humans are fuckers/fucked, and I'm far from perfect myself. But those levels of violence should have disappeared hundreds of years ago thanks to evolution - not after an intense police crackdown in 80s/90s. We're not very low IQ cavemen
Click to expand...
Have we evolved or devolved?
 
brownblade said:
In all seriousness, it's a shame there wasn't CCTV back in these days of fights/injuries/deaths occurring (regularly) for no reason whatsoever.

I've seen "coppers" getting a bad rep in this thread, but I'm in full support of them arresting and jailing people that attack people in and around football days out.

I'm a big boy, I understand violence happens - humans are fuckers/fucked, and I'm far from perfect myself. But those levels of violence should have disappeared hundreds of years ago thanks to evolution - not after an intense police crackdown in 80s/90s. We're not very low IQ cavemen.

Also see a lot of talk about self-preservation and protecting people as an excuse for being involved in violence, but it's obviously false to suggest it was always other people instigating violence. There were many Blades fans injuring people and smashing up other towns and cities. Fucking pathetic.

Agree the coked up folk are generally dickheads, but it's not cocaines fault, people make their own choices. I've known a lot of people doing coke and never getting in a fight. Stupid drug though, don't do it kids - it's absolutely awful for your heart as well.
Click to expand...
Disagree regards coppers .
Had several asking my Mrs out on duty while I was at work in uniform.
Paid by tax payers to go pussy hunting whilst on duty rather than do the crime they attended.
Sneaky bastards. Never trust a copper.
 
Been lurking this thread with some interest. I was brought up on the proximity to hooliganism - enough to experience it up close but without ever being directly involved.

Growing up it was the model of how a strong man should be - willing to scrap, protect your pals, not be a snitch, hate coppers etc - I suppose you might call some of this 'the code'. I believe that football hooliganism does have roots that run deeper than just mindless violence. Most documentaries on the rise of football hooliganism in the UK points to the disenfranchised youth of the Thatcher era. I'd also couple it with a theory that upto the 70'/80's there were a generation of kids who were normalised to corporal punishment at home, at school or from a copper/neighbour/stranger.
When you condition infant kids to the notion that violence is an acceptable form of resolution, don't be surprised that they grew up to use violence as a 'go-to' for conflict resolution. This would be my best guess at why society could create something so organised yet barbaric.

As I've gotten older I've pondered on some of the individuals I've known that were involved. One in particular had a cruel childhood, in & out of borstal and became a well recognised member of the BBC. While he had many violent traits, he also had the capacity for kindness & sensitivity, he's gotten more emotional with time. So when I compare my own childhood (which was far from perfect) to his (which was much, much, much further from away from perfect) it's easy for me to turn my nose up at the whole thing and chalk it up to people being destructive nobheads. If we think of hooliganism as a virus, then Football was the perfect host; a working class sport that had/has masses of blokes, booze and a venue with rotation of opponents every week. If it wasn't football that was so ubiquitous, we'd be discussing cricket or rugby hooliganism.

I have zero appetite for the whole thing. I love football; I love the social aspect of matchdays, I love the camaraderie, I like bumping into old faces and above all I love going to see Utd play.
 
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derbysufc said:
Sneaky bastards. Never trust a copper
Click to expand...
You can't generalise like that.

It's like saying all black people are twats.
Or all women are slags.

I know a few current police officers and many ex-policemen. One of which is very close family and had to have months and months of counselling due to the trauma he witnessed at Hillsborough in 1989. Watching people die infront of his eyes and unable to really help.
Same guy broke down in tears whilst trying to deliver the news to the parents of a young girl raped and murdered in Rotherham.

All sneaky bastards though, that just wanna touch women up. 🙄
 
Deadly_D'Jaffo said:
Been lurking this thread with some interest. I was brought up on the proximity to hooliganism - enough to experience it up close but without ever being directly involved.

Growing up it was the model of how a strong man should be - willing to scrap, protect your pals, not be a snitch, hate coppers etc - I suppose you might call some of this 'the code'. I believe that football hooliganism does have roots that run deeper than just mindless violence. Most documentaries on the rise of football hooliganism in the UK points to the disenfranchised youth of the Thatcher era. I'd also couple it with a theory that upto the 70'/80's there were a generation of kids who were normalised to corporal punishment at home, at school or from a copper/neighbour/stranger.
When you condition infant kids to the notion that violence is an acceptable form of resolution, don't be surprised that they grew up to use violence as a 'go-to' for conflict resolution. This would be my best guess at why society could create something so organised yet barbaric.

As I've gotten older I've pondered on some of the individuals I've known that were involved. One in particular had a cruel childhood, in & out of borstal and became a well recognised member of the BBC. While he had many violent traits, he also had the capacity for kindness & sensitivity, he's gotten more emotional with time. So when I compare my own childhood (which was far from perfect) to his (which was much, much, much further from away from perfect) it's easy for me to turn my nose up at the whole thing and chalk it up to people being destructive nobheads. If we think of hooliganism as a virus, then Football was the perfect host; a working class sport that had/has masses of blokes, booze and a venue with rotation of opponents every week. If it wasn't football that was so ubiquitous, we'd be discussing cricket or rugby hooliganism.

I have zero appetite for the whole thing. I love football; I love the social aspect of matchdays, I love the camaraderie, I like bumping into old faces and above all I love going to see Utd play.
Click to expand...
Best post on the whole thread, explains everything and bits i was getting at in more detail. ☝🌟
 
Deadly_D'Jaffo said:
Been lurking this thread with some interest. I was brought up on the proximity to hooliganism - enough to experience it up close but without ever being directly involved.

Growing up it was the model of how a strong man should be - willing to scrap, protect your pals, not be a snitch, hate coppers etc - I suppose you might call some of this 'the code'. I believe that football hooliganism does have roots that run deeper than just mindless violence. Most documentaries on the rise of football hooliganism in the UK points to the disenfranchised youth of the Thatcher era. I'd also couple it with a theory that upto the 70'/80's there were a generation of kids who were normalised to corporal punishment at home, at school or from a copper/neighbour/stranger.
When you condition infant kids to the notion that violence is an acceptable form of resolution, don't be surprised that they grew up to use violence as a 'go-to' for conflict resolution. This would be my best guess at why society could create something so organised yet barbaric.

As I've gotten older I've pondered on some of the individuals I've known that were involved. One in particular had a cruel childhood, in & out of borstal and became a well recognised member of the BBC. While he had many violent traits, he also had the capacity for kindness & sensitivity, he's gotten more emotional with time. So when I compare my own childhood (which was far from perfect) to his (which was much, much, much further from away from perfect) it's easy for me to turn my nose up at the whole thing and chalk it up to people being destructive nobheads. If we think of hooliganism as a virus, then Football was the perfect host; a working class sport that had/has masses of blokes, booze and a venue with rotation of opponents every week. If it wasn't football that was so ubiquitous, we'd be discussing cricket or rugby hooliganism.

I have zero appetite for the whole thing. I love football; I love the social aspect of matchdays, I love the camaraderie, I like bumping into old faces and above all I love going to see Utd play.
Click to expand...
Great post, second paragraph especially. I used a good chunk of what brain cells I have trying to make a similar post but in a lot shitter way, you've managed to explain yourself so well.
 
Deadly_D'Jaffo said:
Most documentaries on the rise of football hooliganism in the UK points to the disenfranchised youth of the Thatcher era.
Click to expand...
Not something you can blame on Thatcher.

It really started in the late 1960's. Bert was around then and he can certainly remember dozens and dozens of incidents home and away.

Fortunately he wasn't on the Kop that day a Unitedite was chucking acid at people in the 60's.
 
Deadly_D'Jaffo said:
Been lurking this thread with some interest. I was brought up on the proximity to hooliganism - enough to experience it up close but without ever being directly involved.

Growing up it was the model of how a strong man should be - willing to scrap, protect your pals, not be a snitch, hate coppers etc - I suppose you might call some of this 'the code'. I believe that football hooliganism does have roots that run deeper than just mindless violence. Most documentaries on the rise of football hooliganism in the UK points to the disenfranchised youth of the Thatcher era. I'd also couple it with a theory that upto the 70'/80's there were a generation of kids who were normalised to corporal punishment at home, at school or from a copper/neighbour/stranger.
When you condition infant kids to the notion that violence is an acceptable form of resolution, don't be surprised that they grew up to use violence as a 'go-to' for conflict resolution. This would be my best guess at why society could create something so organised yet barbaric.

As I've gotten older I've pondered on some of the individuals I've known that were involved. One in particular had a cruel childhood, in & out of borstal and became a well recognised member of the BBC. While he had many violent traits, he also had the capacity for kindness & sensitivity, he's gotten more emotional with time. So when I compare my own childhood (which was far from perfect) to his (which was much, much, much further from away from perfect) it's easy for me to turn my nose up at the whole thing and chalk it up to people being destructive nobheads. If we think of hooliganism as a virus, then Football was the perfect host; a working class sport that had/has masses of blokes, booze and a venue with rotation of opponents every week. If it wasn't football that was so ubiquitous, we'd be discussing cricket or rugby hooliganism.

I have zero appetite for the whole thing. I love football; I love the social aspect of matchdays, I love the camaraderie, I like bumping into old faces and above all I love going to see Utd play.
Click to expand...
You've seen it in the way it is, absolutely respect what's written, and I think the strikes were my first real memory of violence, especially as I grew up in a pit village and my dad and most folk we knew were pit men.
 
Deadly_D'Jaffo said:
Been lurking this thread with some interest. I was brought up on the proximity to hooliganism - enough to experience it up close but without ever being directly involved.

Growing up it was the model of how a strong man should be - willing to scrap, protect your pals, not be a snitch, hate coppers etc - I suppose you might call some of this 'the code'. I believe that football hooliganism does have roots that run deeper than just mindless violence. Most documentaries on the rise of football hooliganism in the UK points to the disenfranchised youth of the Thatcher era. I'd also couple it with a theory that upto the 70'/80's there were a generation of kids who were normalised to corporal punishment at home, at school or from a copper/neighbour/stranger.
When you condition infant kids to the notion that violence is an acceptable form of resolution, don't be surprised that they grew up to use violence as a 'go-to' for conflict resolution. This would be my best guess at why society could create something so organised yet barbaric.

As I've gotten older I've pondered on some of the individuals I've known that were involved. One in particular had a cruel childhood, in & out of borstal and became a well recognised member of the BBC. While he had many violent traits, he also had the capacity for kindness & sensitivity, he's gotten more emotional with time. So when I compare my own childhood (which was far from perfect) to his (which was much, much, much further from away from perfect) it's easy for me to turn my nose up at the whole thing and chalk it up to people being destructive nobheads. If we think of hooliganism as a virus, then Football was the perfect host; a working class sport that had/has masses of blokes, booze and a venue with rotation of opponents every week. If it wasn't football that was so ubiquitous, we'd be discussing cricket or rugby hooliganism.

I have zero appetite for the whole thing. I love football; I love the social aspect of matchdays, I love the camaraderie, I like bumping into old faces and above all I love going to see Utd play.
Click to expand...
Some fantastic points, well made.

Maybe it's that element of belonging that people hark back for when romanticising the violence? And that loss of comradeship that we all feel as we age.
 
Deadly_D'Jaffo said:
Been lurking this thread with some interest. I was brought up on the proximity to hooliganism - enough to experience it up close but without ever being directly involved.

Growing up it was the model of how a strong man should be - willing to scrap, protect your pals, not be a snitch, hate coppers etc - I suppose you might call some of this 'the code'. I believe that football hooliganism does have roots that run deeper than just mindless violence. Most documentaries on the rise of football hooliganism in the UK points to the disenfranchised youth of the Thatcher era. I'd also couple it with a theory that upto the 70'/80's there were a generation of kids who were normalised to corporal punishment at home, at school or from a copper/neighbour/stranger.
When you condition infant kids to the notion that violence is an acceptable form of resolution, don't be surprised that they grew up to use violence as a 'go-to' for conflict resolution. This would be my best guess at why society could create something so organised yet barbaric.

As I've gotten older I've pondered on some of the individuals I've known that were involved. One in particular had a cruel childhood, in & out of borstal and became a well recognised member of the BBC. While he had many violent traits, he also had the capacity for kindness & sensitivity, he's gotten more emotional with time. So when I compare my own childhood (which was far from perfect) to his (which was much, much, much further from away from perfect) it's easy for me to turn my nose up at the whole thing and chalk it up to people being destructive nobheads. If we think of hooliganism as a virus, then Football was the perfect host; a working class sport that had/has masses of blokes, booze and a venue with rotation of opponents every week. If it wasn't football that was so ubiquitous, we'd be discussing cricket or rugby hooliganism.

I have zero appetite for the whole thing. I love football; I love the social aspect of matchdays, I love the camaraderie, I like bumping into old faces and above all I love going to see Utd play.
Click to expand...
Agree in some parts , disagree in many others.
Firstly football trouble / rivalry, hooligans existed long before Maggie thatcher .
If you actually read my posts I was a blade who travelled early to every away game to avoid potential trouble coppers mobs etc .
My day out was searching for real ale boozers to tick off.
Fortunate or unfortunate I knew most lads or geezers going . I never went for trouble but times i was in places of trouble ) the ankles Liverpool been one during the semi final --' should I sit there with ashtrays bouncing off me head in the dark or should I fight back?
Read again fella , I never went for trouble.
My best days were with contacts made with other clubs for life .
I can go up to hearts next week and never buy a pint they all know me .
Not thru trouble but genuine football lover .
I prefer knowledge over trouble . I can blind anyone on any club because I love the game. I've decided lower leagues is my choice now and the reason is coke heads .
I was at Chesterfield v Barnet and the Barnet fans in the burlington pub in Chesterfield were brilliant, they had a good mix with Chesterfield fans but I also learned alot about their history their area support base and we all drank together.
 
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Carlton Blade said:
Some fantastic points, well made.

Maybe it's that element of belonging that people hark back for when romanticising the violence? And that loss of comradeship that we all feel as we age.
Click to expand...

Cheers CB. You brought up some excellent points to which are very valid.

There is an element of wanton violence to it, make no mistake. I know of a few who were just bullies that tried a bit too hard to be seen as a part of it and overstate their involvement. There are also ones who clung onto it for their own agendas.

I'd never romanticise the violence. Even though I wasn't around in the 70's and 80's, the picture of a bloke with a dart in his eye at Man City doesn't inspire a 'halcyon days' image.
 
Bert said:
Not something you can blame on Thatcher.

It really started in the late 1960's. Bert was around then and he can certainly remember dozens and dozens of incidents home and away.

Fortunately he wasn't on the Kop that day a Unitedite was chucking acid at people in the 60's.
Click to expand...

I'd personally apportion some of that to my other point of how kids were conditioned to violence. Kids were still subject to cruelty be it a sadistic teacher with a cane, an authoritarian copper or parents who just took out their life frustrations on their kids, emotionally and physically.
 
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derbysufc said:
Herman was a good friend , must be 20 years now since he passed .
Iron bar a legend sadly passed .
All what made me attend football all characters . It was the floodlights on a night game and characters I got to know.
Jowett and Bill brealy 2 mega characters.
These lot looked after me when I was young in the 70s and I've been round the world with these .
Click to expand...
Know them both although only Jowitt to talk too.

Bill was known as nutty Billy when I became aware of him in the 80’s. I was only a kid he was an adult so guessing he must be well into his 60’s now and a whole lot more sensible.

Like you say great characters
 
Digs blade said:
Know them both although only Jowitt to talk too.

Bill was known as nutty Billy when I became aware of him in the 80’s. I was only a kid he was an adult so guessing he must be well into his 60’s now and a whole lot more sensible.

Like you say great characters
Click to expand...
Bill will never be normal but in a good way. He's a legend . Always down kelham island chasing the grannies.
Brilliant , funny bloke .
 
derbysufc said:
Herman / John Derbyshire mate died nearly 20 years ago. Brilliant bloke so friendly honest caring and kind .
Must have been 7 foot tall , hands like shovels but heart of gold.
A real legend .
Click to expand...
I knew him from the youth clubs around Lane top/Shiregreen he was a big fucker, can't say he was a fighter though. You couldn't miss him at the Lane in the 70'S stood there in his Crombie many a time I've seen mobs turn and run at the sight of him. It was different back in the 70's you had to stick together at away games otherwise you'd get picked off and take a beating, that's just how it was if you went away you had to expect trouble, you never had to go looking for it. Top blokes who would help any Blade in trouble.
 
metalblade said:
I knew him from the youth clubs around Lane top/Shiregreen he was a big fucker, can't say he was a fighter though. You couldn't miss him at the Lane in the 70'S stood there in his Crombie many a time I've seen mobs turn and run at the sight of him. It was different back in the 70's you had to stick together at away games otherwise you'd get picked off and take a beating, that's just how it was if you went away you had to expect trouble, you never had to go looking for it. Top blokes who would help any Blade in trouble.
Click to expand...
Exactly what I've been posting .
You stood together .
I thought chose to make my own way to the games and met so many people so many numbers exchanged. I didn't go mob handed I went for the day out watching my club.
Herman nearly killed a pig fan outside Bessemer, one punch oooh 20 year ago .
Gentle giant.
Away games back then we're different.
 
derbysufc said:
Agree in some parts , disagree in many others.
Firstly football trouble / rivalry, hooligans existed long before Maggie thatcher .
If you actually read my posts I was a blade who travelled early to every away game to avoid potential trouble coppers mobs etc .
My day out was searching for real ale boozers to tick off.
Fortunate or unfortunate I knew most lads or geezers going . I never went for trouble but times i was in places of trouble ) the ankles Liverpool been one during the semi final --' should I sit there with ashtrays bouncing off me head in the dark or should I fight back?
Read again fella , I never went for trouble.
My best days were with contacts made with other clubs for life .
I can go up to hearts next week and never buy a pint they all know me .
Not thru trouble but genuine football lover .
I prefer knowledge over trouble . I can blind anyone on any club because I love the game. I've decided lower leagues is my choice now and the reason is coke heads .
I was at Chesterfield v Barnet and the Barnet fans in the burlington pub in Chesterfield were brilliant, they had a good mix with Chesterfield fans but I also learned alot about their history their area support base and we all drank together.
Click to expand...

As you say, Football hooliganism was rife as far back as the 1880’s and throughout the following decades. The idea that it expanded in the Thatcher years derives from the middle class Talking Heads - who weren’t even around - looking for a scapegoat. It was a popular youth culture made up of young men and teens who felt part of something. Before that, Mods, Rockers, Teddy Boys etc. ie pre Thatcher. The idea of a disenfranchised youth without two half pennies to rub together, in dead end jobs having no future is again middle class agenda driven bollocks. Sadly perpetrated today by those who weren’t there and will never get it. You can watch as many Pete Postlethwaite Eee by gum grim up North films as you want but it’s generally bollocks. (If it were true with today’s society then there would be thousands more disaffected youths battling it out every Saturday nationwide.
The younger members will remember the Casual Culture but won’t know anything about the late sixties early seventies fashions outside of quadrophenia or those two shit Northern Soul films. The reality in those years was that you stuck together because it was often far safer to do so away. I can’t do away games any more but when l did three years ago plus - for many years - had the opinion that most of the coked up cunts in the away end were far happier trying to intimidate their own supporters than wanting to mix it with “real” firms from the home side. The genuine hooligans always seemed to stay well clear of the wannabes, in the ground early, throwing beer around.
 
Deadly_D'Jaffo said:
Cheers CB. You brought up some excellent points to which are very valid.

There is an element of wanton violence to it, make no mistake. I know of a few who were just bullies that tried a bit too hard to be seen as a part of it and overstate their involvement. There are also ones who clung onto it for their own agendas.

I'd never romanticise the violence. Even though I wasn't around in the 70's and 80's, the picture of a bloke with a dart in his eye at Man City doesn't inspire a 'halcyon days' image.
Click to expand...

It wasn’t in his eye. The side of his nose. Not to trivialise though, acid thrown at a Sheffield Derby shows the level some went too.
 
Sean Thornton said:
As you say, Football hooliganism was rife as far back as the 1880’s and throughout the following decades. The idea that it expanded in the Thatcher years derives from the middle class Talking Heads - who weren’t even around - looking for a scapegoat. It was a popular youth culture made up of young men and teens who felt part of something. Before that, Mods, Rockers, Teddy Boys etc. ie pre Thatcher. The idea of a disenfranchised youth without two half pennies to rub together, in dead end jobs having no future is again middle class agenda driven bollocks. Sadly perpetrated today by those who weren’t there and will never get it. You can watch as many Pete Postlethwaite Eee by gum grim up North films as you want but it’s generally bollocks. (If it were true with today’s society then there would be thousands more disaffected youths battling it out every Saturday nationwide.
The younger members will remember the Casual Culture but won’t know anything about the late sixties early seventies fashions outside of quadrophenia or those two shit Northern Soul films. The reality in those years was that you stuck together because it was often far safer to do so away. I can’t do away games any more but when l did three years ago plus - for many years - had the opinion that most of the coked up cunts in the away end were far happier trying to intimidate their own supporters than wanting to mix it with “real” firms from the home side. The genuine hooligans always seemed to stay well clear of the wannabes, in the ground early, throwing beer around.
Click to expand...
National service ended in the 1960s and then there was a big rise in football hooliganism
 

Sean Thornton said:
As you say, Football hooliganism was rife as far back as the 1880’s and throughout the following decades. The idea that it expanded in the Thatcher years derives from the middle class Talking Heads - who weren’t even around - looking for a scapegoat. It was a popular youth culture made up of young men and teens who felt part of something. Before that, Mods, Rockers, Teddy Boys etc. ie pre Thatcher. The idea of a disenfranchised youth without two half pennies to rub together, in dead end jobs having no future is again middle class agenda driven bollocks. Sadly perpetrated today by those who weren’t there and will never get it. You can watch as many Pete Postlethwaite Eee by gum grim up North films as you want but it’s generally bollocks. (If it were true with today’s society then there would be thousands more disaffected youths battling it out every Saturday nationwide.
The younger members will remember the Casual Culture but won’t know anything about the late sixties early seventies fashions outside of quadrophenia or those two shit Northern Soul films. The reality in those years was that you stuck together because it was often far safer to do so away. I can’t do away games any more but when l did three years ago plus - for many years - had the opinion that most of the coked up cunts in the away end were far happier trying to intimidate their own supporters than wanting to mix it with “real” firms from the home side. The genuine hooligans always seemed to stay well clear of the wannabes, in the ground early, throwing beer around.
Click to expand...
I left school 83
I got a yts scheme job on 25 quid a week but was also doing 3 paper rounds in the week to fund . Studied at college and did blades news.
It paid for every blades game and my clothes.
Back then Chapel walk ,
Fila , taccinhi , ellese , lacoste farah .
I could afford 2 nights a week at the roxy aswell if not Cairo jax .
Brilliant days all grafted for and spent thousands of hours coming back from away night games...
Never missed .
No fan back then was a watch it tv premier league mug fan, Colchester away in 81/2 we got trashed 5-2, we didn't cry .
 
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