Goalies make crap managers, apparently.

[shorehamview]

Everyone knows that former goalkeepers make crap managers, apparently. It was certainly used against Kevin Blackwell on here. So who would like our next manager to be Nigel Adkins? Former Tranmere, Wigan and Bangor City goalkeeper Nigel Adkins?

There's not a hell of a lot to this apart from pointing out that if you gave Blackwell grief because he was a former goalkeeper and stated that goalkeepers make shit managers you can't really call for Adkins to replace Wilson, can you?

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but Adkins has 4 promotions on his CV - three from the league we're currently in.

Blackwell has 0.

 

[Torrix1889]

Has Wilson been sacked?

 

[sheffielder]

Has Wilson been sacked?

If there is a god

 

[Hodgyman]

If I remember right, Dino Zoff didn't do too bad

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

I think Adkins will have many better offers than League one.

 

[Sirius]

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but Adkins has 4 promotions on his CV - three from the league we're currently in.

Blackwell has 0.

So Adkins had three lucky promotions, as in when a team loses by seven lucky goals. Stick with D,W. just the same thanks.

 

[StarBlade]

I'm not sure the players position has much to do with it, my beef with Blackwell was that he took us backwards, he could have been Messi in a previous life for all our care, he just did badly and was probably the negative turning point for our club.

 

[Grecian2000]

There's not a hell of a lot to this apart from pointing out that if you gave Blackwell grief because he was a former goalkeeper and stated that goalkeepers make shit managers you can't really call for Adkins to replace Wilson, can you?

How about if you gave him grief for being a gutless, bollockless, bullying, arrogant, negative bastard, who turned matchdays from the highlight of the week to a real drudge?

NB: Not that I'm actually calling for Adkins to replace Wilson.

 

[Darren]

I'm not sure the players position has much to do with it, my beef with Blackwell was that he took us backwards, he could have been Messi in a previous life for all our care, he just did badly and was probably the negative turning point for our club.

How I wish we were now doing as badly as the Blackwell - in and around the play offs and occasionally flirting with automatic promotion in the second tier - period.

 

[Grecian2000]

How I wish we were now doing as badly as the Blackwell - in and around the play offs and occasionally flirting with automatic promotion in the second tier - period.

How I wish we had the funds/players that Hoofy had at his disposal too, especially the multi million pound signing of Hendo. How I wish he hadn't fallen out with Sharp, Ward and Cotterill.
However, no point crying over spilled milk, so I'm just grateful the twat doesn't darken my door by appearing on RS anymore.

 

[Bladesway]

How I wish we had the funds/players that Hoofy had at his disposal too, especially the multi million pound signing of Hendo. How I wish he hadn't fallen out with Sharp, Ward and Cotterill.
However, no point crying over spilled milk, so I'm just grateful the twat doesn't darken my door by appearing on RS anymore.

Until we sack DW and need a Manager who is apparently a Blade that is............

 

[madeinsheffield]

Adkins started as the Scunny Physio didn't he?

 

[Pinchy]

I think it was the unique combination of the former semi-professional, non-league, reserve, shortarse goalie's qualities that made him so special.

An exquisite cocktail of arrogant ineptitude displayed in a man with so much to be modest about.

 

[StarBlade]

How I wish we were now doing as badly as the Blackwell - in and around the play offs and occasionally flirting with automatic promotion in the second tier - period.

Blackwell is a firefighter, he gets in there when there's a problem and sorts it out which is great for a short-term solution. Give him time and money and it's a different kettle of fish.

 

[Darren]

Blackwell is a firefighter, he gets in there when there's a problem and sorts it out which is great for a short-term solution. Give him time and money and it's a different kettle of fish.

With "time and money" (i.e. in the 2008-09 season) he took us to the verge of automatic promotion, the play off final and the longest unbeaten away game record in the club's history. That with having his best player and top scorer sold from under him. Compare and contrast how Blackwell coped with the loss of Beattie with almost half the season to go and Wilson with the loss of Evans with three games to go.

I know the football under Blackwell was often dire but I really can't understand the flack he gets from some people.

 

[sheffielder]

You can say Blackwell got everything sold from under his feet but when you bring in players like France on 8k per week. He's so good he works for Bury

 

[StarBlade]

I don't disagree that he took us close, or flirted with success, or trimmed a few verges. However, his honours are 0. He has won nothing, he has never managed a promotion of a single team, ever. And after the peak of nearly promoted, it soon went backward, which is what I originally said.

Nothing to do with the style, purely the result. Danny Wilson has taken us to verge of promotion too. Warnock, the man fans really love to hate did get us promoted.

 

[Darren]

You can say Blackwell got everything sold from under his feet but when you bring in players like France on 8k per week. He's so good he works for Bury

I didn't say he had everything sold from under his feet, I said Beattie was sold from under his feet. I also didn't say he was the best manager ever and never made mistakes, merely that his performance at United was reasonable to good, not the disaster that some seem to think.

Whats the source for France's 8K a week by the way?

 

[Darren]

I don't disagree that he took us close, or flirted with success, or trimmed a few verges. However, his honours are 0. He has won nothing, he has never managed a promotion of a single team, ever. And after the peak of nearly promoted, it soon went backward, which is what I originally said.

Nothing to do with the style, purely the result. Danny Wilson has taken us to verge of promotion too. Warnock, the man fans really love to hate did get us promoted.

Yep, he took us from 3rd in 2009 to 8th in 2010, just missing out on the play offs with a much worse team, in the first season that we didn't have parachute payments. As I said above, how nice it would be to have that level of failure now.

 

[sheffielder]

I didn't say he had everything sold from under his feet, I said Beattie was sold from under his feet. I also didn't say he was the best manager ever and never made mistakes, merely that his performance at United was reasonable to good, not the disaster that some seem to think.

Whats the source for France's 8K a week by the way?

If you think he is so good can you explain why he is only working for Bury?

I will have to check on my source but it was common knowledge back in the day when France was sitting on his fat one injured. If you had to the the signing of France that he loaned Halford in as a right back and Sun Jai from City all to play right back when you had Naughton and Walker in the youth you would have to call him a living leg end

 

[Darren]

If you think he is so good can you explain why he is only working for Bury?

I will have to check on my source but it was common knowledge back in the day when France was sitting on his fat one injured. If you had to the the signing of France that he loaned Halford in as a right back and Sun Jai from City all to play right back when you had Naughton and Walker in the youth you would have to call him a living leg end

I didn't say he was good per se, I said he was good during his spell at United. Maybe that was the peak of his career.

 

[StarBlade]

Totally agree, I'd give anything to have that kind of failure right now, but I think fans always want more no matter what position you're in and he couldn't give us that.

 

[sheffielder]

So he was good when he had good players, now there is a shock.

Unfortunately Blackwell brought in dire players and some all in the same position weirdly enough. Let us not forget his brilliant hoof ball tactics for the play off final only a week after playing good football in the 2 semi final games.

I think Danny has done better with the players he has brought in but I am not sure where the belief has gone in the last few weeks. Weird that we are now 8 points off auto yet we were top at Christmas. The only way I can see him getting through this is by making his players accountable by dropping them. Doyle, McDonald, Kitson, Flynn etc; otherwise they will continue with the same performances.

What makes a good manager for me is someone who will make changes as and when they are needed regardless of reputation. That's not happening.

 

[sheffielder]

Totally agree, I'd give anything to have that kind of failure right now, but I think fans always want more no matter what position you're in and he couldn't give us that.

So we had play off defeat followed by the loss of some star players. Isn't that what we had this season

 

[Grecian2000]

With "time and money" (i.e. in the 2008-09 season) he took us to the verge of automatic promotion, the play off final and the longest unbeaten away game record in the club's history. That with having his best player and top scorer sold from under him. Compare and contrast how Blackwell coped with the loss of Beattie with almost half the season to go and Wilson with the loss of Evans with three games to go.

I know the football under Blackwell was often dire but I really can't understand the flack he gets from some people.

I have a feeling we don't agree on this Dazzler.

He took us to the "verge" when he should have won the league. We had as good a team (and the highest paid according to McCabe) in the division and he chose to be so negative. Every away game in the league was approached with a "musn't lose" attitude rather than a "let's win it" one. As a result we drew far too many games which were winnable (see QPR away in League and cup where differing attitudes got different outcomes). The first game of the season was a classic and season defining example. Away at a newly relegated side which is always good, there for the taking? Oh, yes. Did we try and take them? Hell no. The result? A last minute sickener and a result that cost us promotion in the final outcome.
If he had utilised his players to go for it (like he did when he first arrived) then we would have gone up and he would be lauded a hero. However, heroes aren't made by incipid, gutless attitudes, the ones that pervaded every aspect of our play when he was appointed full time.

He drove me from away games that season as I couldn't justify the cost of watching a team going out without the intention of winning the game. He drove me from the home games (i.e. not renewing my season ticket) with his utter dross during his last full season in charge. I've supported this team for 50 years this year. We've had worse teams than he put out, we've had far worse players BUT they've always given me more pleasure (yes even Denis Longhorn, Derek Richardson and the big haired centre half) than watching HIS players try and not lose to teams we should be trying to beat. I will never forgive his attitude and ineptitude and the very mention of his name makes my blood boil.

As you can't understand why people feel this way I feel exactly the same in reverse. I can't get my head around people watching what he put out week after week, the gradual drip, drip, of destruction he was feeding to the team and not absolutely despise the man. As I said earlier in this thread he turned my match day experience from a weekly highlight to a none event in perhaps 18 months, a fine acheivement.

 

[Darren]

So we had play off defeat followed by the loss of some star players. Isn't that what we had this season

Indeed, the only difference is that we were a division higher.

 

[metalblade]

I have a feeling we don't agree on this Dazzler.

He took us to the "verge" when he should have won the league. We had as good a team (and the highest paid according to McCabe) in the division and he chose to be so negative. Every away game in the league was approached with a "musn't lose" attitude rather than a "let's win it" one. As a result we drew far too many games which were winnable (see QPR away in League and cup where differing attitudes got different outcomes). The first game of the season was a classic and season defining example. Away at a newly relegated side which is always good, there for the taking? Oh, yes. Did we try and take them? Hell no. The result? A last minute sickener and a result that cost us promotion in the final outcome.
If he had utilised his players to go for it (like he did when he first arrived) then we would have gone up and he would be lauded a hero. However, heroes aren't made by incipid, gutless attitudes, the ones that pervaded every aspect of our play when he was appointed full time.

He drove me from away games that season as I couldn't justify the cost of watching a team going out without the intention of winning the game. He drove me from the home games (i.e. not renewing my season ticket) with his utter dross during his last full season in charge. I've supported this team for 50 years this year. We've had worse teams than he put out, we've had far worse players BUT they've always given me more pleasure (yes even Denis Longhorn, Derek Richardson and the big haired centre half) than watching HIS players try and not lose to teams we should be trying to beat. I will never forgive his attitude and ineptitude and the very mention of his name makes my blood boil.

As you can't understand why people feel this way I feel exactly the same in reverse. I can't get my head around people watching what he put out week after week, the gradual drip, drip, of destruction he was feeding to the team and not absolutely despise the man. As I said earlier in this thread he turned my match day experience from a weekly highlight to a none event in perhaps 18 months, a fine acheivement.

That is a cracking post.
I too have never renewed my season ticket after Blackwell's last season in charge (which is something having hardly missed a home game in the previous ten years), having said that I do believe Blackwell was hired to dismantle the team for a cheaper version and to take the resulting flak.

 

[Darren]

I have a feeling we don't agree on this Dazzler.

He took us to the "verge" when he should have won the league. We had as good a team (and the highest paid according to McCabe) in the division and he chose to be so negative. Every away game in the league was approached with a "musn't lose" attitude rather than a "let's win it" one. As a result we drew far too many games which were winnable (see QPR away in League and cup where differing attitudes got different outcomes). The first game of the season was a classic and season defining example. Away at a newly relegated side which is always good, there for the taking? Oh, yes. Did we try and take them? Hell no. The result? A last minute sickener and a result that cost us promotion in the final outcome.
If he had utilised his players to go for it (like he did when he first arrived) then we would have gone up and he would be lauded a hero. However, heroes aren't made by incipid, gutless attitudes, the ones that pervaded every aspect of our play when he was appointed full time.

He drove me from away games that season as I couldn't justify the cost of watching a team going out without the intention of winning the game. He drove me from the home games (i.e. not renewing my season ticket) with his utter dross during his last full season in charge. I've supported this team for 50 years this year. We've had worse teams than he put out, we've had far worse players BUT they've always given me more pleasure (yes even Denis Longhorn, Derek Richardson and the big haired centre half) than watching HIS players try and not lose to teams we should be trying to beat. I will never forgive his attitude and ineptitude and the very mention of his name makes my blood boil.

As you can't understand why people feel this way I feel exactly the same in reverse. I can't get my head around people watching what he put out week after week, the gradual drip, drip, of destruction he was feeding to the team and not absolutely despise the man. As I said earlier in this thread he turned my match day experience from a weekly highlight to a none event in perhaps 18 months, a fine acheivement.

Fair enough and all that, but, just to take the example of the Birmingham game, which I watched on TV and remember quite well, I recall it as a dire game between two teams, neither of whom looked liked scoring and where a draw would have been a fair result until that 96th minute sickener from Kevin bleeding Phillips. I think most United fans would have thought an away draw was a good result against a newly relegated teams with some decent players. I certainly don't recall any expectation that Birmingham were "there for the taking" and that we should win easily.

I also recall that there was certainly no expectation at the start of that season that we would get so close to automatic promotion and absolutely no expectation that this would happen after Beattie was sold. Frankly, in the league season (if not the play offs) United performed beyond fans' expectations that season and I think Blackwell deserves some credit for this.

We also won quite a number of away games in 08-09 and certainly didn't always go to get draws - see Forest, Charlton (5-2!), Watford, Reading, Cardiff (3-0) etc etc

 

[Revolution]

I think most United fans would have thought an away draw was a good result against a newly relegated teams with some decent players. I certainly don't recall any expectation that Birmingham were "there for the taking" and that we should win easily.
United played 4-5-1 with Henderson up front on his own and Cotterill on the bench. We spent most of the afternoon lumping the ball towards Henderson, who had a bad game. We only showed ambition when we went one down, at which point I think Stead came on and managed to hit the post in the little time there was left.

This pattern was repeated in many away games: grind and hope for a breakaway. In fact, one of the reasons why we improved was that after we fell out of the top 6 in February Cotterill was given his place back, and more of a free reign, and for the first time that season we attacked a bit more away from home, and played some good football (Reading away, Preston in playoffs). Of course, he was dropped for the Burnley away game and we reverted to type, and lost 1-0, and Blackwell showed about a month later that he had no answer to the might of Burnley.

There were some good things - the defence was great, for example. But that was a missed opportunity, again.

Like 1985-6, that season looks a lot better statistically than if you experienced it live, so to speak.