Club not country

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I've never felt a true passion for the England national side in all honesty. Only ever had 1 England shirt. I guess it just doesn't flow through my blood...
 
Sirius said:
Well there was a time when it should have had Woodward and Currie on the back, except that they didn't put names on shirts and seldom picked decent players. Nothing much changes there then :)
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Too true. Criminal that Woody never played for England.
 
Mardiest players in the tournament. The majority of the games so far have been played with a real sense of camaraderie between players of opposing sides. lots of handshakes, smiles etc after fouls but not England players. Jumped up set of tossers. They just typify the Premier League.
 
My reasoning used to be that I hated the bunch of overpaid prima donnas, who usually got picked just because they played for Man U or Liverpool (still true to an extent).

I have realised in my old(er) age, that actually I just don't feel particularly 'English' in all honesty, especially when it comes to football. I support England at cricket, but football, I just aren't that bothered. I think it's a combination of people who don't watch football starting to offer their 'opinions' around the time of a major tournament (really grinds my gears) and that I don't believe International football is a true reflection on a teams ability. You get 7/8 games every 4 years to prove you are the world champions, well I'm not sure how much that really proves. So many variables make the outcome quite arbitrary, and the quality of football on show doesn't come close to what we're used to at the top of the PL or La Liga. I have enjoyed watching the world cup, but watching as a neutral as I realised I have absolutely don't like/dislike any team more than any other. How can you really support a team that plays once every 6 months (usually the reserves) against teams like Montenegro and Romania, if Blades played that infrequently I would lose passion for them also. For anyone else who isn't massively behind England, just sit back and enjoy the football on offer, it's actually very enjoyable as it has at least made me realise how much I love the game!
 
Bladesman said:
Being let down by one team is enough for most people.

So being let down by England I could do without.
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Bladesman, I felt exactly the same this morning when I read the result (9 hours ahead where I am). Couldn't be bothered to get up at 5am to watch it, partly because I knew exactly what would happen, and partly because I don't really care about watching a load of over paid prima donnas (to quote blader). It all had an air of tedious inevitability about it.
 

Not that I've noticed it here, but was anyone really surprised at the way we measured up?

All the hoo haa about Rooney mystifies me. A vastly overrated player, his overall influence on England's performance has never been that significant, and to listen to his team-mates (who are compromised if we're being honest) support him is risible. The fact that not one of them winked while supporting the party line is remarkable in itself. Of course he's not alone, the lack of guile, nous, and sheer tactical awareness is an indictment of home-grown talent when compared against some of the quality on view in Brazil.

Sorry if that rains on anyone's parade, but I saw, with a few exceptions, a level of mediocrity that I've come to expect.
 
itsinyerblood said:
Not that I've noticed it here, but was anyone really surprised at the way we measured up?

All the hoo haa about Rooney mystifies me. A vastly overrated player, his overall influence on England's performance has never been that significant, and to listen to his team-mates (who are compromised if we're being honest) support him is risible. The fact that not one of them winked while supporting the party line is remarkable in itself. Of course he's not alone, the lack of guile, nous, and sheer tactical awareness is an indictment of home-grown talent when compared against some of the quality on view in Brazil.

Sorry if that rains on anyone's parade, but I saw, with a few exceptions, a level of mediocrity that I've come to expect.
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I thought that for most of the match we looked like rabbits in the headlights and yet we did OK against Italy. If we'd carried on that style of playing and the spirit we played in, we'd have beaten Uruguay.
 
a) Before the tournament began the messaging was "don't expect much" - so why the suprise when it happens? I wanted England to win last night but we weren't exactly favorites to win the World Cup.

b) Move this thread
 
The last major competition I got patriotic up for was France '98, I was 13. Over time, I've found myself identifying less and less with the national team.

I could write a thesis on what the problems are with English national game because the problems are more deep rooted beyond players/management/tactics the fundemental problem is the Football Association. Between building the new Wembley, blocking investment into grass root facilities and coaching, throwing money at foreign coaches and stupid ventures they've contributed to the demise of the national game. Fifa has been exposed as corrupt recently but (without knowing) I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the likes of Scudamore, Dyke, Richards have all put their personal gain ahead of our nations number one sport.
 
I thought it was sad really, after 20yrs of the premier league we are finale seeing the death throes of English football.
The last English world class player was Beckham, the last two scrag ends Cpt.mardy and mini Shrek now wave good bye as the once proud SS Great Britain sinks slowly into the sea of what used to be....:tumbleweed:
 
Can't say I was surprised. Thought before it all began that defensively they would be inept.

Real football begins shortly, in the meantime sit back and enjoy this short production before the main presentation starts!
 
BornOnShoreham said:
I thought that for most of the match we looked like rabbits in the headlights and yet we did OK against Italy. If we'd carried on that style of playing and the spirit we played in, we'd have beaten Uruguay.
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Interesting observation BOSS. I'm not suggesting that positive change can't happen, but what we saw against Italy was just one more example of a possible false dawn. Not sure what the answer is. Possibly a manager with sufficient tactical awareness to instil ways of playing that we're capable of demonstrating? At the moment - and let's be honest, with all the investment in infrastructure we've heard about, we're still with one foot on the plane home - we are a cash rich footballing nation who struggle when we pull a chair up at the top table. Yes, the Prem can produce genuinely exciting games, so can the Championship. even Div 1 manages to create very watchable matches throughout a season. But we're expected to compete against the world's best every few years without making any serious inroads into the development of talent at our disposal. I've no idea what the answer is, but I do know that there are delusions at work if anyone thinks we can match the finest talent in the world.

If Rooney is meant to be our talisman, we are well and truly rogered.
 
itsinyerblood said:
Interesting observation BOSS. I'm not suggesting that positive change can't happen, but what we saw against Italy was just one more example of a possible false dawn. Not sure what the answer is. Possibly a manager with sufficient tactical awareness to instil ways of playing that we're capable of demonstrating? At the moment - and let's be honest, with all the investment in infrastructure we've heard about, we're still with one foot on the plane home - we are a cash rich footballing nation who struggle when we pull a chair up at the top table. Yes, the Prem can produce genuinely exciting games, so can the Championship. even Div 1 manages to create very watchable matches throughout a season. But we're expected to compete against the world's best every few years without making any serious inroads into the development of talent at our disposal. I've no idea what the answer is, but I do know that there are delusions at work if anyone thinks we can match the finest talent in the world.

If Rooney is meant to be our talisman, we are well and truly rogered.
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I also think they looked at the Uruguay team and thought, "Oooooh they look ugly and hard, possibly even ugly and brutal!" :D
 
I was quite a big England fan as a kid and I loved Italia 90. But it bothered me that they picked Chris Woods over Simon Tracey and David Hirst over Brian Deane. My dad said it had always been like that and he'd not given a shit about England since 1962 when Springett got picked over Hodgkinson. Plus, week in week out at club level I was watching a team with people like Bob Booker and Paul Rodgers give everything they had to produce a team that was almost always more than the sum of its parts. With England, by contrast, I saw a bunch of supposed world beaters play like mugs.

I remember watching England play San Marino in 1993 when Sam Marino took the least after a few seconds. I thought it was hilarious and I realised I actually enjoyed watching them get turned over by underdogs. That seemed more English to me than shouting "Ing er lund!" at Geoff Thomas and Carlton fucking Palmer. So I ended up supporting whichever home nation had a United player in the team. Thin pickings the last couple of years.
 
WalthamstowBlade said:
I was quite a big England fan as a kid and I loved Italia 90. But it bothered me that they picked Chris Woods over Simon Tracey and David Hirst over Brian Deane. My dad said it had always been like that and he'd not given a shit about England since 1962 when Springett got picked over Hodgkinson. Plus, week in week out at club level I was watching a team with people like Bob Booker and Paul Rodgers give everything they had to produce a team that was almost always more than the sum of its parts. With England, by contrast, I saw a bunch of supposed world beaters play like mugs.

I remember watching England play San Marino in 1993 when Sam Marino took the least after a few seconds. I thought it was hilarious and I realised I actually enjoyed watching them get turned over by underdogs. That seemed more English to me than shouting "Ing er lund!" at Geoff Thomas and Carlton fucking Palmer. So I ended up supporting whichever home nation had a United player in the team. Thin pickings the last couple of years.
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^^ Same ^^

Putting some meat on the "Prima-Donna" bones: when was the last time you got the impression that any of the players (I'm mostly speaking of the seniors but I get similar impressions from the lads) "respected" anybody but themselves and/or other players that they consider to be #decent or a #baller or on #flames? Whether it's that the media has killed their personalities or that they believe their own hype, I just don't feel that they can be managed or led by anybody above club level because they're not the ones lining their pockets. It's as though, despite the clichés that they trot out, England is beneath them. Since fucking when does a player "retire from International football"??! How fucking arrogant is that shit?
 
How many of the starting 11 last night would be the first name on the team sheet for their clubs? Hart at Man City? Nah - Aguero, Wellback at Man U? - Nah - van Persie. The only possib;e one might be Gerrard but that's due to his "icon" status - he's not a touch on Suarez (as we saw!)

And there lies the problem. The English Premier League has invested heavily in bringing in overseas talent at the expence of developing English talent. If England ever want to make the quarter finals of a world Cup again they need to insist on a quota of 5-7 homegrown (ie eligable for England) players in every matchday squad.
 
I think they basically need to stop being dicks. As impossible as that might seem, I reckon there's not much dickery at Bramall Lane now compared with 12 months ago. Things can change. But they won't for England.
 

SheepdipBlade said:
How many of the starting 11 last night would be the first name on the team sheet for their clubs? Hart at Man City? Nah - Aguero, Wellback at Man U? - Nah - van Persie. The only possib;e one might be Gerrard but that's due to his "icon" status - he's not a touch on Suarez (as we saw!)

And there lies the problem. The English Premier League has invested heavily in bringing in overseas talent at the expence of developing English talent. If England ever want to make the quarter finals of a world Cup again they need to insist on a quota of 5-7 homegrown (ie eligable for England) players in every matchday squad.
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Hart would be the first pick as a keeper...you can't compare to a striker.

Unfortunately,they are nearly all in their respective starting line ups for their respective teams.

We need to now start planning for Euro 16 and the next World Cup

Players like Johnson, Jags, Welbeck Lambert ,Lampard Gerrard, Milner and Baines should be left out of future squads and Shaw, Barklay,The Ox(if fit),Jones and Wiltshire should be given a chance. Rooney was OK last night and may get us to France but he shouldn't be around for Russia so a replacement should be found(if it isn't Barklay). Use a solid group of 16-17 players and work with them on various formations and tactics. If we lose in friendlies early on it doesn't matter as long as there are improvements

Unfortunately, the art of defending has been lost. Until this is resolved, we will continue to struggle
 
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