Championship money

[Weasel]

Football in this country has something precious in its 92 clubs. I'd be happy if 6 of them fucked off to play Real Madrid and Milan every 4 weeks and left the rest of us to it.

I'm all for the 'sexy' big six going their separate way. I watched the Arsenal v Man Utd game the other day and i found it a very boring unexciting football match. Its all hype and usually very little substance. The sexy six can do one for me and take their legion of corporate fans with them also. Let the rest of us get on with things in our own way. I'm sure most wouldn't miss them.

 

[Harrisblade]

Alice?

What Weasel does in his (or her?) own time is no one's business but Weasel's (or Alice's)

 

[snootyfenooty]

I agree with the sentiments of Booker4 and Bladesway but they have missed one very salient point. It's not the nasty club bosses who are syphoning the megabucks out of the game, it's the players. For many of the owners it's nothing more than a hobby. The likes of Abrahmovic and the Citeh owners have ploughed a fortune in and are never getting their money back in a million years.

So, whilst I have zero sympathy with these owners, lets get this right, it's the players (or dare I say the workers) who are the greedy fuckers in this case and are the cause of the problems. Even in the lower leagues they're probably on a couple of grand a week. Only two grand a week ffs, I wish I was so poor.

In my opinion the EFL should separate from the premier league. To stop clubs breaking rank and accepting promotion to the premiership, the EFL should simply refuse to accept relegated clubs. Within a few years it would be the premier league shitting themselves, not the other way round.

 

[I should coco]

don't expect the EFL to stand up for your club and the the other 72 Football League Minos, the EFL are spineless

Leyton Orient got absolutely shafted when the CheatinAmmers moved into the White Elephant Stadium, despite League rules designed to prevent this. Well it was a 'big' Premier club and a little back street league club.....

Alice...Who the fuk is Alice.....

 

[Bladesway]

I agree with the sentiments of Booker4 and Bladesway but they have missed one very salient point. It's not the nasty club bosses who are syphoning the megabucks out of the game, it's the players. For many of the owners it's nothing more than a hobby. The likes of Abrahmovic and the Citeh owners have ploughed a fortune in and are never getting their money back in a million years.

So, whilst I have zero sympathy with these owners, lets get this right, it's the players (or dare I say the workers) who are the greedy fuckers in this case and are the cause of the problems. Even in the lower leagues they're probably on a couple of grand a week. Only two grand a week ffs, I wish I was so poor.

In my opinion the EFL should separate from the premier league. To stop clubs breaking rank and accepting promotion to the premiership, the EFL should simply refuse to accept relegated clubs. Within a few years it would be the premier league shitting themselves, not the other way round.

Don't you think it will lead to a breakaway league by the top 6? I don't think with global rights etc the Premier League would shit themselves because they are far too sharp to "let" the top 6 go without a golden set of handcuffs. I actually think it would end up like Scotland with the standard of the EFL degrading to shit as everyone followed the money to the top. I blame everyone associated with the Premier League on this matter. If you subscribe to it you are a part of it.

 

[snootyfenooty]

Don't you think it will lead to a breakaway league by the top 6? I don't think with global rights etc the Premier League would shit themselves because they are far too sharp to "let" the top 6 go without a golden set of handcuffs. I actually think it would end up like Scotland with the standard of the EFL degrading to shit as everyone followed the money to the top. I blame everyone associated with the Premier League on this matter. If you subscribe to it you are a part of it.

I think the EFL would thrive if it separated. Many clubs in the EFL have a richer tradition than many of those in the PL. Aside from the top 6 or 7 in the PL I don't think anyone gives a shit about the rest. If the top 6 wanted to split, they would. They are probably tied at present as you suggest but all contracts expire at some point.

I cancelled my Sky Sports a year ago, partly in protest against the PL, partly in protest against Sky forever jacking their prices up. I don't miss it one bit. I therefore haven't followed the Champions league, in fact I couldn't even tell you who's progressed, got knocked out or whatever. So if the top 6 joined a European super league I wouldn't follow their fortunes either, I wouldn't give a shit.

It's been mentioned before that the EFL don't realise what they've got. It wouldn't hurt their cause to play hardball with the PL and Sky.

 

[I should coco]

It's been mentioned before that the EFL don't realise what they've got.

Trotting out my own broken record again, they have already thrown away what they inherited. They cast aside 127 years of fantastic history and tradition to re-brand as the 'EFL' trying to be a mini-me EPL. Apparently it has more 'ring' and 'buzz' as a brand than the tired old 'The Football League'.

Headed up by an inept DirtyLeeds fan who has quite unbelievably managed to make a pathetic and derided cup competition (the paint pot trophy) even worse. His master plan of getting Arsenal, Manyoo and Chelski wonder youths showing their silky skills backfired when they told him to do one. We ended up with Leicester and West Brom U23 and unbelievably even fewer fans watching.

I am convinced the longer term agenda is to get the Premier B teams in as they do in Spain. This has of course been denied but in the world of football, when has that ever meant anything.

 

[snootyfenooty]

I am convinced the longer term agenda is to get the Premier B teams in as they do in Spain. This has of course been denied but in the world of football, when has that ever meant anything.

All the more reason to split from the PL completely. Then get the right people running it. Easier said than done, I know, but the way things are at the moment the EFL is just a sideshow to the PL. This cannot be right.

 

[BushBlade]

This is just pure, unregulated capitalism. It's how it works.

The PL money comes from the sale of TV rights, merchandising and sponsorship deals.

The EFL gets a lot less from the sale of TV rights, merchandising and sponsorship.

I've seen loads of small shops close over the last few years but no one suggests Tesco or Sainsbury should subsidise these shops, so people don't have to go to supermarkets and the high street remains vibrant.

If PL clubs are able to generate loads of money why should they have to give it to other clubs who can't generate much money?

 

[snootyfenooty]

This is just pure, unregulated capitalism. It's how it works.

The PL money comes from the sale of TV rights, merchandising and sponsorship deals.

The EFL gets a lot less from the sale of TV rights, merchandising and sponsorship.

I've seen loads of small shops close over the last few years but no one suggests Tesco or Sainsbury should subsidise these shops, so people don't have to go to supermarkets and the high street remains vibrant.

If PL clubs are able to generate loads of money why should they have to give it to other clubs who can't generate much money?

Agree with this entirely. However, why shouldn't the EFL be trying to raise their own profile instead of playing second fiddle to the PL and relying on a few crumbs being thrown their way. For example, why not negotiate a deal with the BBC for live football. The BBC will always get a higher audience than Sky, even for PL games, due to it being free to air. This in turn will lead to greater sponsorship and so on. I also suspect the EFL would get a load of support from UEFA and FIFA as these two outfits are jealous to fuck of the PL and have been waiting to stick the boot in for ages.

 

[BushBlade]

Agree with this entirely. However, why shouldn't the EFL be trying to raise their own profile instead of playing second fiddle to the PL and relying on a few crumbs being thrown their way. For example, why not negotiate a deal with the BBC for live football. The BBC will always get a higher audience than Sky, even for PL games, due to it being free to air. This in turn will lead to greater sponsorship and so on. I also suspect the EFL would get a load of support from UEFA and FIFA as these two outfits are jealous to fuck of the PL and have been waiting to stick the boot in for ages.

Because most of the owners of championship clubs can't even manage their own clubs properly, never mind carry out collective bargaining.

I guess non of the free to air channels can afford to even match Sky for the rights.

There's more chance of a PL2 than the championship clubs getting properly organised. All most owners care about is getting into the PL, raking in a load of cash and then giving most of it to players. There's no business sense in football at all. Clubs seem to be happy to run up debts to stay in the PL, even when they owe more than they can ever pay off, like Sunderland. What fucking use is £100m a year if you're paying out £110m every season? You're better off earning £20m a year and spending £19m.

 

[snootyfenooty]

Because most of the owners of championship clubs can't even manage their own clubs properly, never mind carry out collective bargaining.

I guess non of the free to air channels can afford to even match Sky for the rights.

There's more chance of a PL2 than the championship clubs getting properly organised. All most owners care about is getting into the PL, raking in a load of cash and then giving most of it to players. There's no business sense in football at all. Clubs seem to be happy to run up debts to stay in the PL, even when they owe more than they can ever pay off, like Sunderland. What fucking use is £100m a year if you're paying out £110m every season? You're better off earning £20m a year and spending £19m.

The BBC pay £60m presently for MoD highlights. You'd probably be looking at 3x that amount if you gave them carte blanche with the EFL. For them it would be the centre piece of their sports programming. Advertising and sponsorship income would follow and there would be a knock-on effect in the growth in interest of the EFL vs the PL. But as you say the biggest stumbling block would be the EFL clubs themselves, especially the ones with delusions of grandeur.......

 

[BushBlade]

The BBC pay £60m presently for MoD highlights. You'd probably be looking at 3x that amount if you gave them carte blanche with the EFL. For them it would be the centre piece of their sports programming. Advertising and sponsorship income would follow and there would be a knock-on effect in the growth in interest of the EFL vs the PL. But as you say the biggest stumbling block would be the EFL clubs themselves, especially the ones with delusions of grandeur.......

I don't think they'd pay it. They wouldn't be able to justify it to all the other licence payers who don't like football, or don't like football below the PL. A lot of people would rather watch highlights of the PL than sit through a full game of Leeds v Forest. They're big clubs to us but for anyone under 30, they're nowt.

Remember ITV digital?

 

[northsomersetblade]

I don't know why everyone is so arsey about the PL as they do a great job in keeping alive all teams in the lower leagues .

Just consider the facts in all of this . With all the money that the PL gives every team in Leagues 1 and 2 , Man United could use that and pay Zlatan for another 1 year .

Just think about this before getting your ungrateful knickers in a twist .

So poor Zlatan has to retire a year early because all those greedy lower league teams want his wages for themselves? Shame on them

 

[snootyfenooty]

I don't think they'd pay it. They wouldn't be able to justify it to all the other licence payers who don't like football, or don't like football below the PL. A lot of people would rather watch highlights of the PL than sit through a full game of Leeds v Forest. They're big clubs to us but for anyone under 30, they're nowt.

Remember ITV digital?

Oh I don't know. The BBC are losing sports one by one. Rugby internationals next, Olympics gobbled up by Discovery Channel, there'll be nowt left soon. They won't be able to survive on snooker for the foreseeable future. David Attenborough's not got long left either and Fiona Bruce is getting wrinkly so there's even less reason to watch the channel.

 

[grafikhaus]

Oh I don't know. The BBC are losing sports one by one. Rugby internationals next, Olympics gobbled up by Discovery Channel, there'll be nowt left soon. They won't be able to survive on snooker for the foreseeable future. David Attenborough's not got long left either and Fiona Bruce is getting wrinkly so there's even less reason to watch the channel.

You've forgot tennis. And athletics. In other words, any sport that people really want to watch has gone to Sky because the BBC would rather spend licence-payers money on utter shite like 'Strictly' and Eurovision Song Contest.

But surely the PL is heading for a fall. For once is right. Wendy beware...

Middlesbrough's failure shows bad things can happen to good people in the Premier League... Brighton beware

That is the problem with football. Bad things happen to good people. It doesn't need Venky's in charge to end up in the Championship. With the best intentions, a good owner can go down.

Those now hailing Brighton as 'the perfect football club' — as one headline had it this weekend — need to remember this, as they step into the Premier League for the first time. Outside the elite, where 11 points currently separate eighth place from relegation, a lot can go wrong; or a little.

It doesn't take much to relegate a club of the stature of Brighton or Middlesbrough. A spate of injuries in the same position, two or three misjudgments in the transfer market, a raid on your best player, a manager who unexpectedly struggles with the pressure.

Link

Don't think Tunaman is a 'good man' and will shower the pigs with cash if they get into the PL. What he's spent so far is his 'stake' - his winnings will be the money available in the PL. That's why English football is so popular to foreign owners - it's a cross between a (rigged) gambling den and a money-laundering exercise.

 

[Yoonited]

More proof that the top flight is an elitist institution that doesn't care for "lesser" teams.

And a microcosm of our marvelous governmentalists.

 

[fuerstenberger]

I hate everything about the PL, overhyped, 'best league in the world'; my arse. Leicester winning the league last year was the best thing, commercially, to happen to the PL. where is the next fairytale going to come from? The problem is, when, if the PL goes under it will probably take the EFL with it. The only way, IMO, to combat the power of the money people is for the fans to join together. Here in Germany, they wanted to have, seating only stadia. The fans of every club, spent the first 12 minutes of every game, in silence. It was very effective. This was done until the idea was dropped. If fans boycotted games or sat in silence, (I couldn't do that if the Blades scored), then the PL would have to listen as it would be damaging the brand and the product. I accept this is about as likely as me becoming the Archbishop of Canterbury, so we might as well accept it as the way it is and stop complaining about it.

 

[I should coco]

I've seen loads of small shops close over the last few years but no one suggests Tesco or Sainsbury should subsidise these shops, so people don't have to go to supermarkets and the high street remains vibrant.

If PL clubs are able to generate loads of money why should they have to give it to other clubs who can't generate much money?

That's not quite the same though.

The PL clubs have an interest in the 'lower' clubs prospering. They act as feeder clubs for the big boys and also provide 3 new entrants every year into the competition to help keep if fresh.

Sainsburys and Tescos have no interest in small shops and ideally would nick all their trade.

 

[snootyfenooty]

The fans of every club, spent the first 12 minutes of every game, in silence. It was very effective. This was done until the idea was dropped.

I spent 9 months sitting in silence last season.

Edit: season before last that is

 

[BushBlade]

That's not quite the same though.

The PL clubs have an interest in the 'lower' clubs prospering. They act as feeder clubs for the big boys and also provide 3 new entrants every year into the competition to help keep if fresh.

Sainsburys and Tescos have no interest in small shops and ideally would nick all their trade.

I think PL clubs would be quite happy to do away with relegation and just buy players from abroad or develop their own. They don't need the EFL clubs at all and would be more than happy to nick their fans. That's what the u21s shit was all about. They're not content with their own support, they want to steal fans from the EFL clubs by fielding their own teams in it.

 

[BushBlade]

I spent 9 months sitting in silence last season.

Edit: season before last that is

Me too then it turned out it wasn't even mine.

 

[fuerstenberger]

I spent 9 months sitting in silence last season.

That made me blow tea through my nose.

 

[Jonboy60]

Really appreciate your response. I don't agree politically but your point on the Premier League is on the money. The money from TV is off the scale and while market forces can be a good thing, in sport I'm afraid it really isn't. Football in this country has something precious in its 92 clubs. I'd be happy if 6 of them fucked off to play Real Madrid and Milan every 4 weeks and left the rest of us to it.

Also appreciate your reasoned response to my somewhat firey kick off. As I say, politics and football shouldn't mix. Ever

Politics & football shouldn't mix Bladesway, but unfortunately it does, all be it very tenuously associated. Cannot remember how many time in discussions with colleagues regarding someone's promotion/ or non promotion wage/s disputes, working conditions etc, that the final consensus is "its all down to politics"

 

[grafikhaus]

I think PL clubs would be quite happy to do away with relegation and just buy players from abroad or develop their own. They don't need the EFL clubs at all and would be more than happy to nick their fans. That's what the u21s shit was all about. They're not content with their own support, they want to steal fans from the EFL clubs by fielding their own teams in it.

Ah, but would they? Again, I think is right:

Sunderland paying the price

Like at most Premier League clubs, the first-team squad at Sunderland is evidence of the cosmopolitan nature of English football. It includes players from Italy, Costa Rica, Belgium, Senegal, Sweden, Tunisia, Portugal, Gabon, South Africa, Spain, Ivory Coast, Germany, Nigeria and the United States.

How ironic, then, that Sunderland having been relegated, the only two players who are considered attractive in the transfer market are both English: goalkeeper Jordan Pickford and striker Jermain Defoe.

For all of Sunderland's investment abroad, few of their imports have maintained the value the club needs as a hedge against relegation.

The reputation and worth of most — £8million central defender Papy Djilobodji, for instance — have suffered.

Defoe's value is limited due to his age, but Sunderland are optimistically talking of attracting £30m for Pickford, at 23, rated one of the best young goalkeepers in the country. Everton intend to bid £10m, which may be closer to reality.

Pickford is a local lad, from Washington. Would Sunderland not have been better off working harder to develop youth in a fertile area, rather than follow the route of so many rivals?

Who is the most sought-after player at Middlesbrough? Ben Gibson. At Hull? Harry Maguire. There are too many journeymen in the Premier League's failing clubs. Too many players brought in at considerable expense to do a job that could be adequately covered from within their ranks, with a little more trust and instruction.

While I can see why most PL teams don't go for British managers (most are crap and Pulis', Hughes' etc. teams could send a glass eye to sleep), I agree with most of what Fatboy Sam writes.

 

[BushBlade]

Ah, but would they? Again, I think is right:

Sunderland paying the price

Like at most Premier League clubs, the first-team squad at Sunderland is evidence of the cosmopolitan nature of English football. It includes players from Italy, Costa Rica, Belgium, Senegal, Sweden, Tunisia, Portugal, Gabon, South Africa, Spain, Ivory Coast, Germany, Nigeria and the United States.

How ironic, then, that Sunderland having been relegated, the only two players who are considered attractive in the transfer market are both English: goalkeeper Jordan Pickford and striker Jermain Defoe.

For all of Sunderland's investment abroad, few of their imports have maintained the value the club needs as a hedge against relegation.

The reputation and worth of most — £8million central defender Papy Djilobodji, for instance — have suffered.

Defoe's value is limited due to his age, but Sunderland are optimistically talking of attracting £30m for Pickford, at 23, rated one of the best young goalkeepers in the country. Everton intend to bid £10m, which may be closer to reality.

Pickford is a local lad, from Washington. Would Sunderland not have been better off working harder to develop youth in a fertile area, rather than follow the route of so many rivals?

Who is the most sought-after player at Middlesbrough? Ben Gibson. At Hull? Harry Maguire. There are too many journeymen in the Premier League's failing clubs. Too many players brought in at considerable expense to do a job that could be adequately covered from within their ranks, with a little more trust and instruction.

While I can see why most PL teams don't go for British managers (most are crap and Pulis', Hughes' etc. teams could send a glass eye to sleep), I agree with most of what Fatboy Sam writes.

Right about what? It's just rambling nonsense from Fatty. Last season Newcastle sold three players for a total of around £70m. Only one of those was English and he was the cheapest.

The reason the PL is the most watched league on the world is because it contains most of the world's best players. If it was full of English players it would be more like the championship in terms of quality. There are barely enough English players to form a decent national side.

Why would an owner from Asia or the U.S. care about where the players come from? Why pay a large fee for an English player when you can get a better one for less money from abroad?

 

[Pinchy]

I spent 9 months sitting in silence last season.

Those nerves....

 

[itsinyerblood]

I don't know why everyone is so arsey about the PL as they do a great job in keeping alive all teams in the lower leagues .

Just consider the facts in all of this . With all the money that the PL gives every team in Leagues 1 and 2 , Man United could use that and pay Zlatan for another 1 year .

Just think about this before getting your ungrateful knickers in a twist .

Luke, perhaps you could explain in detail exactly what this "great job" is that the Premier League does for those in LG1 and LG2? I also fail to understand your point about Man Utd and how it relates to the pittance received by clubs in the lower rung of the football league. The way debt ridden Man Utd spend money, they'd hardly notice Zlatan's wages twice over.

It's not about twisted knickers, but it does question whose interests are being served and at what expense.

 

[Sharrow Snuff Mill]

I wonder whether some of these views will be tucked away in a drawer when we return to the Premier League.

 

[Booker4]

Really appreciate your response. I don't agree politically but your point on the Premier League is on the money. The money from TV is off the scale and while market forces can be a good thing, in sport I'm afraid it really isn't. Football in this country has something precious in its 92 clubs. I'd be happy if 6 of them fucked off to play Real Madrid and Milan every 4 weeks and left the rest of us to it.

Also appreciate your reasoned response to my somewhat firey kick off. As I say, politics and football shouldn't mix. Ever

No worries mate, I enjoy'd your message and I do hope you're right re good business. I did think as I sent the message that I should have steered away from politics but I can't help myself occasionally! I can't say I encounter many big businesses who do reward the smaller guys. and I remember all to well when the Tories said that the minimum wage was going to be counter productive and would lead to job cuts. We still have a real imbalance in my view illustrated through football as much as anything else. Yes players wage demands don't help but the Premier League and Sky have no interest in the lower leagues and equality because they want the Premier League to be the richest league in the world so its the best product and therefore attracts the best players and therefore makes the Premier League easier to market. Ensuring the lower leagues in this country get a fairer share of the spoils would mean Premier League clubs get less and that's never going to happen so we have this Oliver Twist situation that the chairman of Accrington Stanley talked about, almost having to beg for money.

P.S Bladesway, when I got into work this morning it was ironic because I've received overtime at least for the extra work so I did feel slightly humbled!