BLADES V WEDNESDAY

[8lade]

If either of us had something to be proud of then it may be a worthwhile venture but no.

 

[GrayBlade]

Wednesday clearly have the better history but many of the stats show it's remarkably similar.

Seasons in the top flight SU 63 SW 66
Seasons in the 2nd tier SU 46 SW 44
Season in the 3rd tier SU 11 SW 11 (if they're relegated then they'll have spent longer at that level than us
Season in the 4th tier SU 1 SW 0

FA cup wins SU 4 SW 3
Losing FA cup finalists SU 2 SW 3
Losing FA cup semi finalists SU 9 SW 10

Attendances are also surprisingly similar.....so what makes Wednesday fans think they are a massive club?
There are probably 2 factors that make Sheff Wed fans think they are comfortably the bigger club.

1: Period when either Sheffield team could claim to be one of the best in the league and genuine title contenders.

The SUFC heyday when we were a powerhouse club was 1897 to 1900 when for 3 years we were easily one of the best teams in the game.
SU have spent loads of seasons in the top flight but we've consistently been a mid table club, rarely looking like challenging for honours.

The SWFC heyday when they were a powerhouse club was 1929 to 1933, 1960 to 1964 and 1992 to 1994. These were all very short spells but there are still people living today who remember SWFC on a similar level (ability wise) to Man Utd and Liverpool.

2: Statistics (facts) regularly show that the Sheff Wed attendances are good but nothing special, very similar to SUFC.
However SWFC did have a spell from 1950 to 1953 when for 4 consecutive seasons their average attendance was around 41,000.
Also in 1985 they averaged 27K and in 1992 averaged 29K, neither seem anything special but during that time attendances were really low.
Anything over 20K was considered impressive. So again there are people still alive who will remember SWFC being one of the better supported teams in England during those years when experiencing success.

Our claim to fame regards on field performance is that we have a remarkably good record in the Championship.
We've spent 46 season in the 2nd tier and 66% of the time we've been involved in the promotion battle.
So no wonder Blades automatically expect us to be challenging for the play-offs at least....historically it's the norm.

Our claim to fame regards attendances that very few Blades are aware of happened on the evening of 30th March 1982.
Attendances were very low in 1982 and anything over 20K was considered a really big crowd.

That night top of league and reigning Europeans Champions Liverpool played a div 1 match against Birmingham City.
They had the lowest crowd of the season at Anfield of 24,224.

On the same night Sheffield United played a division 4 promotion clash at home to Bradford City, crowd at Bramall Lane was 24,593.
Hard to believe that any league 2 (div 4) match could attract a bigger crowd that at Anfield with Liverpool in their pomp winning everything.

Also in recent times we've consistently been better supported than SWFC. Last season we averaged 28,746 in the 2nd tier.
The last time Sheff Wed bettered that figure whilst outside the top flight was in 1952.
Even in the top flight over the last 50+ years they have only bettered last seasons 28,746 on 1 occasion (in 1992).
and then of course there's the stat that Sheff Wed haven't averaged more than 30,000 over the last 55 years.

And you try the tell them

 

[Blademan18891889]

Their play-off final match was up to 6 tickets per season ticket holder.
So many were bought making it a family day out, 1000's went that rarely go any matches.

Where as our Man City semi final was 1 ticket per season ticket holder....think even Man City allowed 3 tickets per ST holder.
So haven't a clue why our tickets were made difficult to buy.

I wanted to buy 5 tickets but was refused. I heard that about 2 days before kick-off they did relax the restriction and made them available for general sale, but it was too late to arrange anything.

So for the 1st time in 50 years I didn't attend one of our semi-finals.

Completely false, they could only buy 1 per number and 6 in a transaction, they sold the lot including the extra 6k without it actually ever reaching a general sale.

 

[alcoblade]

They have a bigger support. It’s simple really. But it’s from all over South Yorkshire. Ours is 80% from Sheffield areas They’ve probably got 60% Sheffield areas rest from all or shop. We have gapped the bridge between us over years partly becuse there shit and we are miles in front but you only really have to look at their away followings to see they do have a very loyal fanbase or brain dead fanbase whatever way you look at it

Unlike you to get drawn into this subject and favour them.

Whiff.

 

[Blademan18891889]

Unlike you to get drawn into this subject and favour them.

Whiff.

Why when anyone says they have better support or are a bigger club do people on here instantly accuse people of being a Wednesday fan. It's a fact, end of, but since they've come down from the top division we have closed the gap by a considerable amount. Don't really see an issue admitting it. Rather be doing better on the pitch personally

 

[metalblade]

Historically the Sty has always had a larger capacity than the Lane, when doing well we are into the 90% plus full area, the pigs until a significant part of the sty became unsafe could always cram around 10,000 more spectators in be they home fans or away fans so in theory it should over the last 55 years or so have been much easier for them to average more than 30,000 tbf they should have been able to average around 36,000, another reason why we need more capacity at the lane the only barrier to us blowing them away is ground capacity as we are at our limit consistently. Another consideration is it is a lot easier to buy tickets on a one off basis at the sty while we mess around with previous purchasing history and a minimum amount of loyalty points even on general sale the less said about giving ST holders seats to away fans the better as happened in the last play off game at the lane. Ground capacity is holding us back that and the small minded mentality of a large number of fans who think we can't fill seats, put seats in with unrestricted views and we will fill them when only a limited number of crap seats are left a lot don't even try to get tickets.

 

[alcoblade]

Why when anyone says they have better support or are a bigger club do people on here instantly accuse people of being a Wednesday fan. It's a fact, end of, but since they've come down from the top division we have closed the gap by a considerable amount. Don't really see an issue admitting it. Rather be doing better on the pitch personally

Looking back at previous posts gives you a few hints.

 

[dingledog]

Makes me laugh that you mention away support... Thought fanbase was always based on home support.
Also their away support isn't anything special, check the data, it's similar to (very slightly better) than ours.

Agree about their have plenty of support all over South Yorkshire but it's more followers and not supporters.
These followers have no interest in normal matches but will only turn up for the big games.

What I find weird is that if we take 2,200 for an away match.
Our fans would say "we took 2000 to...where ever". Where as a Wednesday fan always says "we took 3000 to....where ever"

It's the same with home support. We might have a 28,721 crowd and Blades will say "we had a crowd of 28,000"....and none of our fans are bothered because having 30,000 gates every week is normal and natural. Where as Owls will alway say "we have a crowd of 30,000" and then rave about how incredible that level of support is.

They have a very insecure fanbase and are so desperate to be seen as a big club.
Tend to find Sheffielders are OK...it's the ones in Barnsley and Rotherham that come across as so desperate to support a big club.

This century since 2000, Sheff Wed have only broke an average of 25,000 on THREE occasions (2017,18 and 23).
Where as 25K would be one of our lowest attendances in years, after this season we'll have had 7 consecutive season averaging over 25K.
Will be interesting to see if we can keep this momentum swing regards support in the city.
History suggests we'll have a downer and they'll come good again because neither Sheffield team can seem to dominate the city for too long.

There is also the issue of crowd segregation, surely a better comparison might be 'selling out the away allocation', but really its all a load rubbish, we support the Blades, they dont.

 

[Frank the tank]

Why when anyone says they have better support or are a bigger club do people on here instantly accuse people of being a Wednesday fan. It's a fact, end of, but since they've come down from the top division we have closed the gap by a considerable amount. Don't really see an issue admitting it. Rather be doing better on the pitch personally

It's not a fact we have dwarfed their support for the last two decades

 

[Blademan18891889]

It's not a fact we have dwarfed their support for the last two decades

Oh dear, we really haven't, they've been utter shite the whole time, we've been pretty decent. Not even worth the argument.

 

[Frank the tank]

Oh dear, we really haven't, they've been utter shite the whole time, we've been pretty decent. Not even worth the argument.

For the last two decades we have had bigger crowds than them
End of

 

[Blademan18891889]

For the last two decades we have had bigger crowds than them
End of

For about 60% of seasons in the last 2 decades yes, i dontvknow the exact stats but we have however been in the premier league 4 seasons and done considerably better overall, we've grown as a fanbase. Do you think if they went up they wouldnt surpass us again quite convincingly ? Do you think they'd be getting 26/27k home fans at games with ridiculous amount of empty seats? I think you know the answer to that deep down.

 

[Frank the tank]

For about 60% of seasons in the last 2 decades yes, i dontvknow the exact stats but we have however been in the premier league 4 seasons and done considerably better overall, we've grown as a fanbase. Do you think if they went up they wouldnt surpass us again quite convincingly ? Do you think they'd be getting 26/27k home fans at games with ridiculous amount of empty seats? I think you know the answer to that deep down.

It's more like 95 % and no I don't
They have never averaged 30k in my lifetime and I'm 50
They haven't since the 60's and never will
Your argument about how shit they are doing doesn't hold weight either

Even when they were in finals and winning a trophy they didn't average as many as we regularly do now

 

[Sheffsteel]

Why when anyone says they have better support or are a bigger club do people on here instantly accuse people of being a Wednesday fan. It's a fact, end of, but since they've come down from the top division we have closed the gap by a considerable amount. Don't really see an issue admitting it. Rather be doing better on the pitch personally

We haven't just closed the gap we are now the better supported club.

and that is a FACT.....don't you agree?

Since 2000 (this century) Sheff Wed have averaged over 25K on THREE occasions.
where as Sheff United have averaged over 25K on NINE occasions (and would have bee TEN if there wasn't the covid season).

 

[Blademan18891889]

It's more like 95 % and no I don't
They have never averaged 30k in my lifetime and I'm 50
They haven't since the 60's and never will
Your argument about how shit they are doing doesn't hold weight either

Even when they were in finals and winning a trophy they didn't average as many as we regularly do now

95%, so the 6 years we were in league one we obviously averaged more did we? Plus there's been the odd few other season we haven't as well. Crowds have gone up enormously across the country since they went down, if you don't think they would ill leave you to think that, for a 50 year old I'd expect you to know a bit more , especially the crowds they got in the 80s and early 90s which were very high, but anyway. Good night mate.

 

[Frank the tank]

95%, so the 6 years we were in league one we obviously averaged more did we? Plus there's been the odd few other season we haven't as well. Crowds have gone up enormously across the country since they went down, if you don't think they would ill leave you to think that, for a 50 year old I'd expect you to know a bit more , especially the crowds they got in the 80s and early 90s which were very high, but anyway. Good night mate.

They never averaged 30k in the 80's or. Nineties
Only truly big clubs do that
They are in the next category down with the likes of Luton and Coventry who also won a trophy at the height of their powers but couldn't match the attendances of the top tier clubs such as us

 

[Blademan18891889]

We haven't just closed the gap we are now the better supported club.

and that is a FACT.....don't you agree?

Since 2000 (this century) Sheff Wed have averaged over 25K on THREE occasions.
where as Sheff United have averaged over 25K on NINE occasions (and would have bee TEN if there wasn't the covid season).

No I don't. Going up to the premiership builds a fanbase. We also consistently have minor success and way cheaper prices but I suppose we can judge if they ever go up, could be a while though. It doesn't matter anyway. Although we aren't very good we are still better on the pitch, do you think a man city fan cares that there rivals are literally 10x bigger than them, not one bit.

 

[Blademan18891889]

They never averaged 30k in the 80's or. Nineties
Only truly big clubs do that
They are in the next category down with the likes of Luton and Coventry who also won a trophy at the height of their powers but couldn't match the attendances of the top tier clubs such as us

Deary me. Good night again.

 

[Frank the tank]

Deary me. Good night again.

Piss off back to owlstalk Alan

 

[Sheffsteel]

For about 60% of seasons in the last 2 decades yes, i dontvknow the exact stats but we have however been in the premier league 4 seasons and done considerably better overall, we've grown as a fanbase. Do you think if they went up they wouldnt surpass us again quite convincingly ? Do you think they'd be getting 26/27k home fans at games with ridiculous amount of empty seats? I think you know the answer to that deep down.

You seem to be falling into the trap of Wednesday delusion.
I can understand a Wendesday fan trying to propagate the myth but surely a Blade would look at the actual facts.

I could easily say if we won a trophy and had a few spells challenging at the top of the PL then we'd be better supported than them.
Their latent fanbase of based on the early 30's, early 60's, early 90's success.

We've not had anywhere near that success in living memory, so it's pretty amazing we have the support we do.
In fact of all the clubs in Europe that have never been in a single cup final we have by far the biggest fanbase and best support.
So one could argue we are the longest suffering fans not only in England but in Europe, relative to fanbase.

We averaged nearly 29K last season in a ground that from November suffered a capacity restriction down to 30.5K.
There's no way if Sheff Wed were involved in promotion from the Championship would get close to filling out their stadium every match.

How do I know this? because they never have.
SWFC are obviously a slightly bigger club (that is fact) but the distance isn't as big as some people think
SWFC have a bigger stadium and have had very impressive one off attendances but for some reason have rarely ever had a full stadium on a regular basis and that is a fact. My opinion is that SWFC have a lot of half hearted followers who hardly ever go to games.
Agree if SWFC were in the PL then these half hearted followers would all go in the 1st season, suspect they would sell out every match.

 

[Sheffsteel]

Oh dear, we really haven't, they've been utter shite the whole time, we've been pretty decent. Not even worth the argument.

We've been shite and massively underperformed....ever since Hitler invaded Poland.

Also we've recently had 6 seasons in league 1.....that's enough to finish off any fanbase.
Could you imagine SWFC spending consecutive 6 season in league 1? Gates would be sub 15K.

Sheff Wed only have 2 seasons in league 1 and they all talk about how they can't handle the pub league
and may as well pack in. The Sheff United support is remarkable really.

PS: Do agree that SWFC have excellent support, it's something both Sheffield clubs should be proud of.
Was just stating facts that Sheff Utd now consistently have higher support. If they were both in the Championship next season....both mid table....both charging the exact same prices...then Sheff United would still end up with a bigger average home attendance
and that's with Hillsoboro having a much larger capacity with crowds boosted by much higher away numbners
The Sheff Utd away end holds just 2,900 where as the Sheff Wed away end holds 4,700.

 

[FATTYFOULKE]

To be fair to the Wendys, they do get very good support considering they haven’t done anything of any note for the best part of 25 years.

That said, let’s keep Chansiri in charge a while longer and (fingers crossed) another 25 years of being rubbish and then we’ll see how their numbers hold up.

Tbf to United our support puts theirs in the shade considering we’ve done nowt for the best part of 99 years.

 

[FATTYFOULKE]

Oh dear, we really haven't, they've been utter shite the whole time, we've been pretty decent. Not even worth the argument.

Dear me.

 

[Sheffsteel]

No I don't. Going up to the premiership builds a fanbase. We also consistently have minor success and way cheaper prices but I suppose we can judge if they ever go up, could be a while though. It doesn't matter anyway. Although we aren't very good we are still better on the pitch, do you think a man city fan cares that there rivals are literally 10x bigger than them, not one bit.

Now I know you either on the wind up or a Wednesday fan.

Man Utd are a far bigger club (historically and currently) than Man City and can never catch up, so don't care.

Where as in Sheffield it's very different, the facts show that Sheff Wed are historically slightly bigger than Sheff Utd..but arguably this century not bigger than Sheff Utd. It's that old factor of how much weighting to put on history....I think it's important and SWFC do have plenty of history but at some point that history become ancient history like Old Etonians winning the FA cup.

Only a Wednesday fan would refuse to accept black and white facts.....facts and statistics are like kryptonite to SW fans.
Sheff Wednesday fans have this strange desire to be "big"., must be one of the most insecure fanbases always worrying about what other fans think about them. You hear them on the radio Sheffield phone in and they always mention the attendance but round it to the nearest 5,000. Bizarre really.

Don't fall in to the cheap ticket/ expensive ticket trap.
I've already explained this....it part true but quite misleading.

Last season SUFC had some of the highest match days prices in the Championship and were £3 a match higher than at Hillsboro.
This season at the time ST prices were set....SWFC were almost guaranteed Championship football (10 points clear at the top).
where as SUFC were being quickly chased down by Boro.....so the SU season tickets prices were also set with Championship football in mind.

A fact that very few seem to be aware of is that the early bird prices at S2 and S6 were similar priced.
Think the SWFC Kop is about £10 more than the SUFC Kop
but the SUFC south stand is about £10 more than the SWFC north stand.
Agree the SWFC south stand is substantially (think over £100) higher than anything at SU.

The high prices controversy at S6 is a marketing blackmail strategy.
SW have 20K season ticket holders...if they are renew on early bird when they come on sale then prices are quite reasonable.
If they delay renewing then the price goes up and up and up but of course the high pricing hardly effect anyone because Chansiri strategy ensures 95% of fans renew at the very reasonable prices.

Also SWFC have extremely variable match day price and the upper categories are eye watering but again hardly anyone is affected because all proper fans have already bought their season tickets at reasonable prices,. very similar to what SU fans pay for their season tickets.

Anyway just seen PNE 0 SW 1.....good win that.