Big games

[judge]

I'd be interested to know what our history is like in big games ( finals semi finals play offs or promotion / relagation deciders) if you were to take out warnocks tenure

I can only think of relagation at Chelsea and the don givens game but surely this can be countered by Leicester and promotion from div 4
Guess what I'm asking you is warnock responsible for the culture of this clubs supporters of going into big games believing we will lose ? Can Wilson end that ? Surely someone will

I've deliberately left Blackwell out of the equation for obvious reasons but I believe that sooner or later someone will redefine the DNA of this club by winning when it matters irrespective of the nail biters and nerve jangled fans sat on the verge of total mental breakdown

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Just move on.

 

[JohnDenver]

I heard a Man U fan the other day bemoaning the fact they "always do it the hard way".

We may be regular bridesmaids but the mindset isn't exclusive to us.

 

[Revolution]

Nice attempt to limit criticism of NW, judge.

Anyway, taking a game on the last day or a playoff tie as a "decider", non Warnock stuff just for you:

Promotion deciders: won when we had to in 1990, 1984 (promoted due to game after we'd finished), 1971, 1950 (didn't go up as Pigs won game in hand), 1939.
lost playoffs in 1997, 1998 and 2009 and won a "Test Match" in 1893.

lost when we needed to win in 1938 (2nd at end of game, 3rd place team won game in hand and passed us)

Relegation deciders: lost needing a draw in 1994, 1981, 1968 (and 2007). Drew when needed to win in 1949.
Drew when an 8-0 win might have saved us in 1979
Won last game to stay up only once - 1930.
Lost relegation playoffs in 1988, but had won on last day of the season when defeat could have sent us down had other results gone against us.

FA Cup: won 6 of 13 semi final ties, but lost last 4 in a row (1961, 1993, 1998 and under NW in 2003)
Lost last Cup final (1936)

League Cup - only semi (lost) under NW>

Automatic promotion record: very good
Playoff record: terrible
Relegation record: terrible
Cup Record: okay, though poor recently.

Now please move on.

 

[Worksop_Blade]

Wallsall 1981 Manager: Harry H

Premiership Relegation #1 Manager: Harry B

FA Cup Semi Final 93: Manager Harry B

Play Off Final 97 Manager: Howard Kendall

FA Cup Semi Final 98 Manager: S Thompson

Play Off Semi Final 98 Manager: S Thompson

Play Off Final 09 Manager: Kevin Blackwell

You can't take Blackwell out the equation and looking at the above it's got zero amount anything to do with Warnock.

Did this post whilst Revolution was posting his more in depth post. Bravo.

 

[Darren]

Nice attempt to limit criticism of NW, judge.

Anyway, taking a game on the last day or a playoff tie as a "decider", non Warnock stuff just for you:

Promotion deciders: won when we had to in 1990, 1984 (promoted due to game after we'd finished), 1971, 1950 (didn't go up as Pigs won game in hand), 1939.
lost playoffs in 1997, 1998 and 2009 and won a "Test Match" in 1893.

lost when we needed to win in 1938 (2nd at end of game, 3rd place team won game in hand and passed us)

Relegation deciders: lost needing a draw in 1994, 1981, 1968 (and 2007). Drew when needed to win in 1949.
Drew when an 8-0 win might have saved us in 1979
Won last game to stay up only once - 1930.
Lost relegation playoffs in 1988, but had won on last day of the season when defeat could have sent us down had other results gone against us.

FA Cup: won 6 of 13 semi final ties, but lost last 4 in a row (1961, 1993, 1998 and under NW in 2003)
Lost last Cup final (1936)

League Cup - only semi (lost) under NW>

Automatic promotion record: very good
Playoff record: terrible
Relegation record: terrible
Cup Record: okay, though poor recently.

Now please move on.

Just a couple of corrections

1989: got the draw we needed at Wolves in the penultimate game making promotion 95% certain and then didn't get hammered in the last game at Bristol City in order to confirm promotion.

1979: we didn't need to win 8-0 to give us a chance of staying up. We needed a score like that to overhaul Charlton, but any win would have seen us go 1 point ahead of Oldham. However, they had two games in hand and I believe they won both of them, so a win would, in the event, have been academic.

 

[davidpinder]

I'd like a statto to work out our record in big games at BDTBL because i remember some big results in big games Playoffs, cups etc etc

 

[Pollingtonblade]

I'd like a statto to work out our record in big games at BDTBL because i remember some big results in big games Playoffs, cups etc etc

When you say big games do you mean such as cup quarter finals? play off semis or relagation deciders?

 

[Darren]

I'd like a statto to work out our record in big games at BDTBL because i remember some big results in big games Playoffs, cups etc etc

Define me a "big game" and I will oblige....

 

[Revolution]

United have never lost a home game in the playoffs - W3 D2 L0.
They have never won away: W0 D3 L2
Everyone knows what our record in Playoff finals is.

As for the Cup, United have won the last 4 cup quarter finals at the Lane (1993, 1998- both on pens - and in both Cups in 2003). They also won the league cup semi game at the Lane in 2003. Our last defeat in the last 8 of a Cup at the Lane was to Man Utd in 1990.

 

[davidpinder]

Define me a "big game" and I will oblige....

Well playoff semi final 2nd legs, cup quarter finals, semi finals 1st or 2nd leg, league promotion clinches.

 

[judge]

Nice attempt to limit criticism of NW, judge


Wasn't my intention I merely wanted to know if our record in big games is as bad as some make out as I think a full house at bdtbl has seen put arsenal , man utd , Chelsea and others to the sword in my lifetime admittedly with much better sides

 

[davidpinder]

I can remember us turning over Leeds in 2 cups, liverpool in cup, forest in playoffs, preston in playoffs, Coventry in cup, man u in cup, blackburn in cup, plus i am sure a load more. I am not picking out random league games in nov, dec, jan etc games that can make a big difference and tomorrow could be a promotion clincher.

 

[Darren]

Well playoff semi final 2nd legs, cup quarter finals, semi finals 1st or 2nd leg, league promotion clinches.

Since 1960:

April 61 United 3 Derby 1 - clinches promotion, but with 2 games left
10/3/62 United 0 Burnley 1 - FAC QF
27/3/62 United 0 Blackpool 2 LC QF replay
7/12/66 United 2 Birmingham 3 LC QF
11/5/68 United 1 Chelsea 2 - fail to avoid relegation
1/5/71 United 3 Watford 0 - clinch promotion
26/4/75 United 4 Leicester 0 - keeping European qualification hopes alive
8/5/79 United 2 Leicester 2 - fail to avoid relegation
2/5/81 United 0 Walsall 1 - fail to avoid relegation
4/5/82 United 3 Rochdale 1 - virtually clinch promotion
12/5/84 United 2 Newport 0 - promotion hopes kept alive
18/5/88 United 1 Bristol City 1 - relegated after play offs
17/3/93 United 2 Blackburn 2 (5-3 on pens) - FAC QF
16/3/98 United 1 Coventry 1 (3-1 on pens) FAC QF
17/12/02 United 3 Palace 1 - LC QF
9/3/03 United 1 Leeds 0 - FAC QF
15/5/03 United 4 Forest 3 - qualify for play off final
30/4/04 United 1 Ipswich 1 - fail to keep realistic play off hopes alive
13/5/07 United 1 Wigan 2 - fail to avoid relegation
11/5/09 United 1 Preston 0 - qualify for play off final
30/4/12 United 2 Barnsley 2 - fail to keep alive hopes of avoiding relegation

I make that 11 successes to 10 failures

 

[davidpinder]

Since 1960:

April 61 United 3 Derby 1 - clinches promotion, but with 2 games left
10/3/62 United 0 Burnley 1 - FAC QF
27/3/62 United 0 Blackpool 2 LC QF replay
7/12/66 United 2 Birmingham 3 LC QF
11/5/68 United 1 Chelsea 2 - fail to avoid relegation
1/5/71 United 3 Watford 0 - clinch promotion
26/4/75 United 4 Leicester 0 - keeping European qualification hopes alive
8/5/79 United 2 Leicester 2 - fail to avoid relegation
2/5/81 United 0 Walsall 1 - fail to avoid relegation
4/5/82 United 3 Rochdale 1 - virtually clinch promotion
12/5/84 United 2 Newport 0 - promotion hopes kept alive
18/5/88 United 1 Bristol City 1 - relegated after play offs
17/3/93 United 2 Blackburn 2 (5-3 on pens) - FAC QF
16/3/98 United 1 Coventry 1 (3-1 on pens) FAC QF
17/12/02 United 3 Palace 1 - LC QF
9/3/03 United 1 Leeds 0 - FAC QF
15/5/03 United 4 Forest 3 - qualify for play off final
30/4/04 United 1 Ipswich 1 - fail to keep realistic play off hopes alive
13/5/07 United 1 Wigan 2 - fail to avoid relegation
11/5/09 United 1 Preston 0 - qualify for play off final
30/4/12 United 2 Barnsley 2 - fail to keep alive hopes of avoiding relegation

I make that 11 successes to 10 failures

lets hope its not 11 each after saturday

 

[Bladesman]

Since 1960:

April 61 United 3 Derby 1 - clinches promotion, but with 2 games left
10/3/62 United 0 Burnley 1 - FAC QF
27/3/62 United 0 Blackpool 2 LC QF replay
7/12/66 United 2 Birmingham 3 LC QF
11/5/68 United 1 Chelsea 2 - fail to avoid relegation
1/5/71 United 3 Watford 0 - clinch promotion
26/4/75 United 4 Leicester 0 - keeping European qualification hopes alive
8/5/79 United 2 Leicester 2 - fail to avoid relegation
2/5/81 United 0 Walsall 1 - fail to avoid relegation
4/5/82 United 3 Rochdale 1 - virtually clinch promotion
12/5/84 United 2 Newport 0 - promotion hopes kept alive
18/5/88 United 1 Bristol City 1 - relegated after play offs
17/3/93 United 2 Blackburn 2 (5-3 on pens) - FAC QF
16/3/98 United 1 Coventry 1 (3-1 on pens) FAC QF
17/12/02 United 3 Palace 1 - LC QF
9/3/03 United 1 Leeds 0 - FAC QF
15/5/03 United 4 Forest 3 - qualify for play off final
30/4/04 United 1 Ipswich 1 - fail to keep realistic play off hopes alive
13/5/07 United 1 Wigan 2 - fail to avoid relegation
11/5/09 United 1 Preston 0 - qualify for play off final
30/4/12 United 2 Barnsley 2 - fail to keep alive hopes of avoiding relegation

I make that 11 successes to 10 failures

Hopefully we can make it 12 successes.

 

[Silent Blade]

Wallsall 1981 Manager: Harry H

It was Martin Peters. Haslam had resigned 4 months earlier

 

[Silent Blade]

Won last game to stay up only once - 1930.

We won 5-1 at Man U!