Best n0. 9 since 1999

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Best no.9 since 1999

  • Total voters
    121
It is still a valid point that Wilson found something Blackwell, Speed and Ale house Adams could not, A number 9 is there to score goals and Ched did under Wilson be it in League one makes no difference, most Unitedites rate Keith Edwards but most of his goals were scored in the lower leagues.
 



metalblade said:
It is still a valid point that Wilson found something Blackwell, Speed and Ale house Adams could not, A number 9 is there to score goals and Ched did under Wilson be it in League one makes no difference, most Unitedites rate Keith Edwards but most of his goals were scored in the lower leagues.
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Fair point, but I think you have to judge a player who scored consistently in the higher leagues as a better player than someone who scored consistently in the lower leagues. Ian Rush and Edwards were two of the most prolific goal scorers of the 80's, but as the former scored all his goals at the top level and the latter never got a single goal at that level no-one doubts Rush was the better player.
 
Just Beattie from HMS, closely followed by Hulse. But for a broken leg Hulse would probably have got the vote as his goals would have kept us in the PL.
 
Ok Racy, if your vote for Porter is genuine, lets have a justification, If not, it's disallowed.
 
Darren said:
Fair point, but I think you have to judge a player who scored consistently in the higher leagues as a better player than someone who scored consistently in the lower leagues. Ian Rush and Edwards were two of the most prolific goal scorers of the 80's, but as the former scored all his goals at the top level and the latter never got a single goal at that level no-one doubts Rush was the better player.
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It would have been nice to see Edwards being supplied by McDermot, Whelan, Souness and Barnes, whilst playing alongside Mr Dalglish.

I voted for Ched, my most recent memory of a Player on the rampage
 
Darren said:
Fair point, but I think you have to judge a player who scored consistently in the higher leagues as a better player than someone who scored consistently in the lower leagues. Ian Rush and Edwards were two of the most prolific goal scorers of the 80's, but as the former scored all his goals at the top level and the latter never got a single goal at that level no-one doubts Rush was the better player.
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Fair point Darren but we are comparing United number 9's Rush was shit for us, Ched got 9 goals at championship level 2010/11 four more than Creswell and Bogdanovic managed in a truly shit team, fair to say as a young player he out performed established strikers.
 
Darren said:
Beattie scored 34 goals in one and a half seasons in the second tier, Evans got 13 in 2 seasons. You don't think that gives you an idea of how good they were vis-a-vis each other?

I really don't buy this "Ched was awful because of crap managers and crap players around him". He played under three managers - Blackwell, Speed and Adams - in the 2nd tier and was mediocre at best and dreadful at worse under all of them. In addition in 2009-10 he was part of a team challenging for the play offs most of the season. I venture to suggest that had our "star" striker been capable of more than 4 goals that might have made the difference between the 8th place finish we had and a play off place.

Oh, and the idea is to compare their performances when they wore the shirt in question. Not for potential or performances at other clubs.
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I sort of agree, Ched seemed to find his level in div 3, though who knows if he would have scored more if Wilson was the manager in the championship? On the other hand look at Billy Sharp, crap for blades, brill for everyone else, granted most of his footie for us was under Blackwell of course.
 
Darren said:
Fair point, but I think you have to judge a player who scored consistently in the higher leagues as a better player than someone who scored consistently in the lower leagues. Ian Rush and Edwards were two of the most prolific goal scorers of the 80's, but as the former scored all his goals at the top level and the latter never got a single goal at that level no-one doubts Rush was the better player.
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Anyone who saw both play for United might disagree!
 
Worksop II said:
It would have been nice to see Edwards being supplied by McDermot, Whelan, Souness and Barnes, whilst playing alongside Mr Dalglish.

I voted for Ched, my most recent memory of a Player on the rampage
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If Edwards had been as good as Rush he would have played alongside players like Dalglish and Souness.
 
Guesty said:
Anyone who saw both play for United might disagree!
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I remember Rush being clear through on goal in one match for us, the only player in the attacking half, and he still managed to fluff it!
 
I've gone somewhat left field with Bent. The original Bent was a very good player sold for a couple of mill. He scored a decent number of goals in a very average team.

Marcelo would have got it for wearing two shirts and scoring because "I was inspired by our fans and knew I would" or words to that effect v Coventry, removing one to throw into the crowd. Sadly this was 1998.

Beattie in that number only played half a season and fucked us off so I can't vote for that and presume those that did are tagging on the previous season's memories.

Ched is thick as pig poo and had a torrid two seasons in the championship as a top top earner. Even Europe's premier striking coach (Corky) couldn't get him going. His good season was ruined by his off the field actions.

Hulse was great for almost a full season but a shadow of his former self after. If he'd stayed fit and we'd stayed up he'd win hands down.

I was glad we signed Asaba and thought he'd do better. Did he have some injury troubles that niggled him? Scored against the pigs. Good lad but can't remember too much other than a hot streak when we first got him and a good song about him.

HMS I can't vote for as he was a fat fucker and despite being good for the team wasn't an aspirational CF that I would want in my 'greats' team. At least with Bent there was a rawness and a feeling that he would pull something out of the bag.

Nightmare for me would be Ward as I presume he swallowed up quite a lot of our budget at the time and gave little back. I remember him scoring against Leeds but nothing else. I also remember NW saying if he had a million pounds he'd still sign the Wardster. A comment that worried me immensely. Unfair to cite Thomas as he had a few games and was probably free as part of the Bent deal. Porter is what he is, a body who plays a certain role when we're skint. I think nightmares should be those who came with great expectation or at great expense and let us down. . . And Jordan Stewart (Id love to know what he earnt off us and Derby)
 
Ollessendro said:
Tough, tough choice. We've actually had a few quality strikers since 1999.

I went for HMS Shipps. He just edged Hulse out, mainly due to Hulse being gash after he broke his leg. Neil Shipperley was absolutely intergral to us going up in 2005/6. A proper striker. The only rival for a striker that led the line the best since Deane is Rob Hulse. Shipps was fantastic in our promotion season. He held the ball up brilliantly, was a nuisance all the time, brough other players into the game and formed excellent partnerships with Kabba (firstly) and Webber.

Evans was decent, but it is telling that he only started to bang goals in in the third tier. You can argue about confidence, but it was the drop in standards that made Evans look better than what he is. Don't get me wrong, he was on fire. His movement was good, he is a decent finisher and the goal spoke for themselves. But (in my opinion) it is unfair to compare with the likes of Hulse and Shipperly as he was tearing much poorer defences apart. The Beattie comparison is much fairer, but I never rated him. Beattie was a decent free kick taker, penalty taker and natural finisher. But he was lazy, not a team player and contributed little to open play. I am sure the debates will start again, but the fact is that we actually achieved better results without Beattie.
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Agree with what you say about HMS as per my previous post, interesting though that he was officially credited with 0 assists that season. A prime example of the stats not telling the true story. A bit like our league position ;)
 
Beattie in that number only played half a season and fucked us off so I can't vote for that and presume those that did are tagging on the previous season's memories.

But that is the same for everyone on the list, just about:

Marcelo - played about 5 games after squad numbers came in, then sold.

Bent - played about one full season's worth of games, then sold

Thomas - on loan, a few games only

Asaba - 2 and a bit seasons. Had his moments but not a great spell.

Ward - two seasons in which he was mainly injured

Shipperley - Only played league games in one season

Hulse - two seasons, injured and then absolutely terrible in the second one.

Lupoli - on loan, few games only

Evans - a mind boggling 3 seasons: awful in two, great at a lower level in a third, you know the ending

Porter - two and a bit seasons of poor to mediocre play

Beattie is a very defensible choice, even on half a season's football, because no number 9 stays very long unless they are (a) injured (b) not very good. Otherwise, we sell them.​
 



Revolution said:
Beattie in that number only played half a season and fucked us off so I can't vote for that and presume those that did are tagging on the previous season's memories.

But that is the same for everyone on the list, just about:

Marcelo - played about 5 games after squad numbers came in, then sold.

Bent - played about one full season's worth of games, then sold

Thomas - on loan, a few games only

Asaba - 2 and a bit seasons. Had his moments but not a great spell.

Ward - two seasons in which he was mainly injured

Shipperley - Only played league games in one season

Hulse - two seasons, injured and then absolutely terrible in the second one.

Lupoli - on loan, few games only

Evans - a mind boggling 3 seasons: awful in two, great at a lower level in a third, you know the ending

Porter - two and a bit seasons of poor to mediocre play

Beattie is a very defensible choice, even on half a season's football, because no number 9 stays very long unless they are (a) injured (b) not very good. Otherwise, we sell them.​
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Very true Revo. Doing this by squad numbers is much harder than polling players in each position
 
Darren said:
It's late today as I was having a wisdom tooth out :-(

On the no. 8 McCall won by another landslide leaving our dream squad as follows:

1. Paddy Kenny
2. Matt Lowton
3. Wayne Quinn
4. Nick Montgomery
5. Chris Morgan
6. Phil Jagielka
7. Michael Brown
8. Stuart McCall

I'm surprised Alan Kelly is not in goal!
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Jim Chimmerney said:
Agree with what you say about HMS as per my previous post, interesting though that he was officially credited with 0 assists that season. A prime example of the stats not telling the true story. A bit like our league position ;)
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do you have the stats on assists? I'd be interested to see them. We need Highbury_Blade to do his key passes analysis. Perhaps if he has a long commute or sumert ..... ;)
 
Darren said:
Would any of the 19 voters who voted for Evans who banged them in in the 3rd Division as opposed to Beattie and Hulse who banged them in in the PL and top of the 2nd tier care explaing their votes. Genuine query by the way.
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Thats what made me vote for Hulse ahead of Evans
 
Ollessendro said:
do you have the stats on assists? I'd be interested to see them. We need Highbury_Blade to do his key passes analysis. Perhaps if he has a long commute or sumert ..... ;)
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I don't although I remember thinking at the time how weird it was. HMS had great positional sense and tended to drag defenders out of position leaving space for others to run into which is probably why he didn't 'physically' provide the assists.

Can't remember whether they did assists in the programme that season otherwise yep, it's sit down in front of the telly. It is of course, a fantastic DVD with yours truly making a cameo appearance towards the end :)
 
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