Are our players good at football yet?

[PokerBlade]

"12) Well done to Graeme Souness for not blaming Chelsea’s performance on Paul Pogba. But his post-match assertion that “if you were to pick a starting eleven from the players on both teams, I’m not sure if any Sheffield United players get in,” seemed wide of the mark.

He went on to explain that “the difference” was “attitude, attitude, attitude,” which is an over-simplified compliment. He is not wrong in that Sheffield United approached the match with far greater clarity and focus but that does them a typical disservice. While he likely said it for effect and to make it seem like an even bigger achievement, only a fool would not take Henderson, Egan, O’Connell, Stevens and at least two of those midfielders at Chelsea at the very least.

Praise them for their mentality by all means but diluting it solely to that is patronising. These players are quality as a team but many would improve most sides around them as individuals."

Sheffield United thrash Chelsea 3-0: 16 Conclusions from Bramall Lane

Football365 - This was a showcase of Sheffield United at their best and Chelsea at their worst. "Attitude" alone was not "the difference".

www.football365.com

Pretty good article on yesterday's game. This part more or less repeats something I said after the Spurs game where we heard all this none of our players are good enough for a side that can't defend.

 

[CentralQuay]

Of course they are, they are 7th in the best league in World Football.

The question about whether Blades players could improve the Chelsea side is a debate that is not needed though, it's all hypothetical and it doesn't make sense.
You recruit players and build a team to play a specific style.
Chelsea and Sheffield United play completely different styles, and i'm pretty sure both sides would be just as ineffective at trying to emulate each others style.

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

The interesting thing is, it takes months of performing well, for other teams to either be considered to be having and off day, or we're performing above our level. Still, credibility is hard gain.

It only takes 1-2 average performances to be back at the level we were expected to be at.

 

[CentralQuay]

The interesting thing is, it takes months of performing well, for other teams to either be considered to be having and off day, or we're performing above our level. Still, credibility is hard gain.

It only takes 1-2 average performances to be back at the level we were expected to be at.

Why would you want their recognition?

Burnley still don't get any recognition despite season after season spending a fraction of what Blades spent in the summer.
Leicester 'fluked' a 38 game season.
Wolves are probably ignored even more than Burnley.
Palace/Watford don't get any praise either, despite sides like Leeds/Forest/Wednesday/Derby etc being in the lower tiers.

 

[Blade58]

Yesterday Souness said we didn’t have one player that would get into the Chelski side. I would argue our whole 5 across the back would get in

Forget what a player cost. Our defence have been superb for most part of the season. Can anyone say the same about Chelskis defence?

Defending, attacking, overlapping. Work ethic, commitment and ability. That’s how I describe our defence. Can you say the same about Chelski as an all round defensive unit?

Chelski 49 goals conceded. 49!

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Burnley still don't get any recognition despite season after season spending a fraction of what Blades spent in the summer.

Nit-picking, but I think a season of spending just £9m isn’t really a true comparison when they’ve spent around £100m in the previous 2-3 seasons. We’ve got some catching up to do.

 

[Carlton Blade]

Why would you want their recognition?

Burnley still don't get any recognition despite season after season spending a fraction of what Blades spent in the summer.
Leicester 'fluked' a 38 game season.
Wolves are probably ignored even more than Burnley.
Palace/Watford don't get any praise either, despite sides like Leeds/Forest/Wednesday/Derby etc being in the lower tiers.

I much prefer it when people think we are shit to be honest. Leeds will get all the media nonsense next year, suits me fine

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

Why would you want their recognition?

Burnley still don't get any recognition despite season after season spending a fraction of what Blades spent in the summer.
Leicester 'fluked' a 38 game season.
Wolves are probably ignored even more than Burnley.
Palace/Watford don't get any praise either, despite sides like Leeds/Forest/Wednesday/Derby etc being in the lower tiers.

Merely answering the OP and the suggestion that we still aren't any good, yet.

 

[CentralQuay]

Nit-picking, but I think a season of spending just £9m isn’t really a true comparison when they’ve spent around £100m in the previous 2-3 seasons. We’ve got some catching up to do.

According to transfermarket.co.uk Blades total transfer balance this season is -£61 million.
That is more than Burnley have lost/spent since the 2015/16 season.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

According to transfermarket.co.uk Blades total transfer balance this season is -£61 million.
That is more than Burnley have lost/spent since the 2015/16 season.

I made the figure spent about £110m give or take a few:

Burnley transfer fees paid:
2019-20: £9m
2018-19: £29.5m
2017-18: £35.35m
2016-17: £39.45m

Figures taken from:https://www.transferleague.co.uk/burnley/english-football-teams/burnely-transfers

I won’t bother indexing them against overall spend / TV money available but I’d think our spend will likely follow a similar trend - big, almost as big, slightly smaller - unless rather than consolidate we suddenly find ourselves in serious top 6 contention in future.

 

[coaxingstar71]

I like Souness, he's been very complimentary about us for a while now, even saying he'd like a season ticket after the Man Utd game. I think he meant that perhaps Chelsea wouldn't have any of our team apart from the Henderson, not necessarily what he would choose..... if that makes sense.

On the OP, I note that even Wilder is still perpetuating the myth that we are a 'midtable Championship team' (his words not mine) unless we are bang at it or playing at '8's and 9's as he put it yesterday.

My view is that the majority of players HAVE stepped up. When I've watched the majority of Premier League players this season, I think ours, even indivually, are every bit as good as most of them, and in a lot of cases, better.

 

[CentralQuay]

I made the figure spent about £110m give or take a few:

Burnley transfer fees paid:
2019-20: £9m
2018-19: £29.5m
2017-18: £35.35m
2016-17: £39.45m

Figures taken from:https://www.transferleague.co.uk/burnley/english-football-teams/burnely-transfers

I won’t bother indexing them against overall spend / TV money available but I’d think our spend will likely follow a similar trend - big, almost as big, slightly smaller - unless rather than consolidate we suddenly find ourselves in serious top 6 contention in future.

Burnley net spend:
2019-20: -£5.27m
2018-19: -£22.5m
2017-18: +£12.83m
2016-17: -£39.96m
2015-16: -£4.50m

Total spend: -£59.4m

That's less than Blades net spend this season alone.
Dyche really has done a terrific job over a long period with such little outlay.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Burnley net spend:
2019-20: -£5.27m
2018-19: -£22.5m
2017-18: +£12.83m
2016-17: -£39.96m
2015-16: -£4.50m

Total spend: -£59.4m

That's less than Blades net spend this season alone.
Dyche really has done a terrific job over a long period with such little outlay.

Give us a chance mate! To sell players we’re shifting stocks that got us promoted from League 1 and finishing outside the playoffs in the Championship.

Burnley had assets to shift and from previous prem / champ charges - don’t think we can quite compincoming transfers.

Certainly not decrying the job Dyche has done, he’s wheeled and dealed very well to get and keep Burnley where they are within their means.

Our means has been the TV cash - of which there’s been more this year - and we’ve maybe brought some forward from next year to capture Berge.

 

[A Storm of Blades]

Burnley net spend:
2019-20: -£5.27m
2018-19: -£22.5m
2017-18: +£12.83m
2016-17: -£39.96m
2015-16: -£4.50m

Total spend: -£59.4m

That's less than Blades net spend this season alone.
Dyche really has done a terrific job over a long period with such little outlay.

In fairness they sold Keane and Gray a few years ago for over £45m which puts them back in the bracket of spending £100m+. Don’t get me wrong, it’s not fortunes in PL terms but hardly peanuts.

 

[CentralQuay]

In fairness they sold Keane and Gray a few years ago for over £45m which puts them back in the bracket of spending £100m+. Don’t get me wrong, it’s not fortunes in PL terms but hardly peanuts.

You have to look at net spend, not just outgoings.
It really is peanuts in Premier League terms.

 

[Ginger Gnome]

You have to look at net spend, not just outgoings.
It really is peanuts in Premier League terms.

You don't though, Burnley do spend a lot of money, them bringing in a lot of money doesn't alter that.

 

[CentralQuay]

You don't though, Burnley do spend a lot of money, them bringing in a lot of money doesn't alter that.

Of course it alters that.
If you sell £200 million worth of players, and buy £100 million worth are you 'spending a lot of money'?

 

[A Storm of Blades]

You have to look at net spend, not just outgoings.
It really is peanuts in Premier League terms.

Yes - but net spend can be deceptive if you have a couple of big sales. It’s responsible management, but they haven’t spent an insignificant amount and certainly way more than us.

 

[Ginger Gnome]

Of course it alters that.
If you sell £200 million worth of players, and buy £100 million worth are you 'spending a lot of money'?

You're still spending £100m, so obviously you're spending a lot of money. Just because you're in profit while doing it doesn't lessen the actual spend, just makes the spending more sustainable

 

[A Storm of Blades]

You're still spending £100m, so obviously you're spending a lot of money. Just because you're in profit while doing it doesn't lessen the actual spend, just makes the spending more sustainable

Exactly. Liverpool sold Coutinho for well over £100m. Does that mean they haven’t spent much? Of course not!