A bit of quality at the top of the pitch

[The Vicar]

Not too many days ago there were a lot on here waxing lyrical about how excellent were when we smashed 4 past Aston Villa, now we don't have any quality up front again. I'm hoping that as Wilder isn't a petulant 12 year old he doesn't go from "I love it here" to "fuck this I'm resigning" on a weekly basis.

The instant gratification required by some fans is ridculous, give Wilder (and the Chairman/men) a few more windows to strengthen and I'm pretty sure he'll be fine.

Good to hear a bit of sense on here! If the opposition dont score then you cannot lose, so strengthening the defence was always the first signing, particularly as we have BS, LC & DM. OK they are ageing and will probably not get 15 goals each, but if they get 1 and we concede 2 we lose. Listening to CW on RS he seemed to emphasise DM’s first half misses as the primary reason we lost, as he felt the first goal was always crucial in the Championship.

MTLBWY

UTB

 

[Fulwood Blade]

There is absolutely zilch we can do about getting extra quality now - we have to work with what we have got, and yes, we are ALL disappointed at yet ANOTHER game has finished where we should have got something. I lost count how many last season and for certain one was Birmingham at home as mentioned by the OP.

We have to work with what we have and yesterday at Bristol, CW once again tried to win the game. It didn't work out, but we weren't beaten by a well worked goal, just some some fluky back header, just headed into an area.

Almost certainly, CW could have shut up shop and got a 0-0 - it's isn't what he does - never has from memory and he does keep telling our fans this is how he will play - some just don't want to listen.

We will get more points going for a win than settling for a draw - that's why there has been 3 points for a win for ages.

Bristol City are no mugs and a decent team, but the game should have been virtually over at half time - even my missus said at half time "bet you lose 1 nil now". It wasn't even a good. well worked goal - it was a lucky goal.

We just need to move on, and as CW has said in his post match interview, he expects a response from the players on Monday.

I for one, expect not a better performance v Birmingham, just a more clinical one - it's ALL the players need to do.

What it does show is how important our centre midfield are and how we need Coutts fit and be able to play some part asap.

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[Sheffsteel]

Some really illogical comments on here, Wilder would probably be laughing at some of our supporters.

So we need a quality striker?
Someone has already mentioed that the quality to transfer fee ratio isn’t linear, it’s disproportionate.

For example a run of the mill striker in the Championship cost 3 million and is paid £10K a week wages.
A fraction better, a decent Championship level striker cost 5 million and £15-£20K a week wages
A fraction better, a top Championship striker cost 10 million and £40K a week wages
A fraction better, a striker that could probably do a job in the PL cost 25 million and £100K a week wages.

There isn’t a massive difference between the quality of the striker options above, but one costs 3 million and the other 25 million. They only gradually improve in quality but the price shoots up disproportionately.

All our strikers are run of the mill to decent (when on form). Wilder is looking for better, his minimum requirement is a “decent Championship striker” level which cost 5 million. He’d like a top Championship level striker which might help push us over the line but it would be a massive risk to spend 10 million on a player and offer 40K a week, for a striker probably not even good enough for the PL.

Recent history shows that Sheff Wed were in a similiar situation to us.
They made the ambitious jump to buy Jordan Rhodes and that had a terrible affect.

Spending multiple millions doesn’t gaurantee succes and we simply can’t afford gambling with the required 10 million plus totally destroying the wage structure offering £40,000 a week wages.

Also if a new striker was being paid £40K there are consequences, the agents of the other players would demand pay rises. It could upset the positive mood and team spirit that Wilder has built up. The club could go into a financial meltdown.

You can bet the same people would then be slagging off McCabe for wasting millions putting the club at financial risk, as we become another Bolton Wanderers.

 

[Tom Bott]

Oh, and I’d still be saying it after a 1-0 win because I think it’s pretty obvious we’re still short of genuine quality up there.

Not after a 0-3 and a 4-1 win though ?

 

[Tom Bott]

In terms of 'championship pedigree, summer signings; Grabban, Waghorn, Marriot, Bamford (now injured) not showing miles better quality so far...

Don't forget Rhodes to nowhere.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

striker of genuine quality is the one that will get you those 1-0 wins

......and the ultimate example of this is Cantona - helped enormously by Schmeichel at t'other end one year as they went on to win the Prem title.

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[wizadry]

......and the ultimate example of this is Cantona - helped enormously by Schmeichel at t'other end one year as they went on to win the Prem title.

UTB

That’s bollocks, he can’t play on grass.

 

[Cerberus Blade]

I posted ages ago on this topic, when we came up from League 1, saying that the choice of strikers then wasn't ideal, naming, Clarke, Sharp, Evans, Hanson. I said age was against Clarke and Sharp, Evans was a nothing more than a punt and we couldn't rely on him ever being the same again - and Hanson wasn't up to it at Championship level. Since then we had the cameo of Brooks, who one could argue isn't a striker, but he was a breath of fresh air attacking from midfield. Of course he's gone. Evans has gone on loan till January and Wilder has already said, more or less, he can stay there all season, so that tells you everything you need to know about him featuring in our future plans. Hanson has gone of course. Donaldson came and went in that time - another "old" bloke who offered bits and pieces in flashes, but not really good enough to rely on him to be a main striker for us. And we've now got McGoldrick who is perhaps a slight improvement over Donaldson tbf - but another "old bloke" who we can't rely on to be a main striker for us. Then we've added Washington who, never in a million years, would have been on Wilder's wanted list if better quality strikers had come our way.

So, we are back to Clarke and Sharp as our perennial hope of scoring goals. And I'm sure they both will. But will they score enough? Will Clarke stay fit long enough for a start? He's been out injured already and looked off the pace when he's played.

Wilder isn't stupid. When he says we needed 2 new strikers this summer he meant it. And he meant "quality" above and beyond what we already had. I don't blame him, or the board, for not being able to bring those "quality" strikers in. I'm sure he tried his best and the Board were willing to back him. But it's just not worked out for the likes of Gallagher or Hogan to join us yet. Maybe one or the other will in January - depending on how well we are doing in the table?

But let's not kid ourselves...much as we might adore Leon or love Billy, it's a bloody tough act to expect them to carry the burden of firing us into the top 6 at this stage of their career, at this level of football. And the other strikers we've got are out of the "Lucky Bag" - maybe they'll be great! Maybe they'll not. You can't build a promotion squad on that kind of chance.

 

[Keen Blade]

Settling for a 7-10 finish is not a CW approach - should he look abroad in the next window ?

 

[wizadry]

Settling for a 7-10 finish is not a CW approach - should he look abroad in the next window ?

I think the more pertinent question should be, when you can buy a striker abroad for a fraction of the price of one over here then why shouldn’t we be looking abroad for one?

 

[knowsnowt]

Ok can those saying we wasted 4m on Egan and should have spent it on a striker pls name one that we could have bought with that amount that would improve us and would score goals at this level.

Unless we unearth an upcoming gem then even throwing 20m at it won't help. Proven strikers just aren't within our budget or wage structure.
Does my head in all those clammering for us to throw 8m+ at someone no better than we already have. Thankfully we definitely won't be going down that road.
Chris either unearths a gem of deano proportions or we just constantly plod along as a top half championship team.
Personally I'd rather we didn't waste 8m on shit like waghorn and upset the players that actually earn their wages by fulfilling their roll for 1/8th of the cost.
Maybe I just lack " ambishun".

 

[Jan Age]

We were in Arsenal mode on Saturday ; happy to pass it around but with no real purpose which was the exact opposite of Villa when everything had a purpose.

We nearly always concede (which is a concern) which means we need two or more to win.

The only way we can win is to to really go out teams for the full 90. Creating enough chances for our strikers to at least score 2 (so about 15) and limiting the opponents to 4 or 5 (of which 1 will go in)

We dont have the quality to play for a draw or manage the game for a 1-0 win.

Saturday shows we are a top 10 side this season with an outside chance of the playoffs.

All things considered I’m happy with that given it’s just our 2nd season back and with the boardroom struggles.

Onwards and upwards.

 

[Weasel]

Due to the inflated prices for forwards, I think we should be casting our net a bit further afield in looking for potential strikers and looking abroad.

We should be all over the German / Scandinavian / Eastern European league's trying to find a striker or two. We are much more likely to find a gem for a damned sight less money than we would do in England.

I'm comfortable with United sourcing the vast majority of players from the UK and remaining predominately a British side, but the cost of British forwards are disproportionate to the players level of ability (much more so than other positions in the team) and this is why we should look further afield for that striker or two. It's a gamble I suppose, but no more so than buying Waghorn for £5m plus and then giving him north of £30k a week wages.

The days of getting a Brian Deane for £35k are long gone.

 

[lakedistblade]

Anyone see wolves yesterday who created 39 attempts on goal and scored once. Their costly striker Bonatini missed at least 5 easy chances. Often see the same with Kane and even Salah this season. A player Finding the net regularly with a team that creates a lot of chances like us is a strangely fickle talent that Clarke did last season and Sharpe has regularly. We just need one of our strikers confidence to click and whether they are worth 5 million or not can slot in the crosses. Not creating chances is much more of a concern. I am glad we don have an expensive flop like waghorn Rhodes disturbing morale. Hoping for a striker to be prolific and win games for you is like wanting a good summer nice when it happens but always far from certain based on history.