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But then we are all assuming that promotion is the agenda naturally.....
 
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Deleted Member said:
We was totally and utterly shit yesterday. We looked weaker than MK Dons in every department, and they didn't play well either. We looked slow and ponderous, showed no attacking threat or intent, until the last 5-10 minutes but by that point the game it was a case of too little, too late. The only player who really looked like creating something for us was Jamal Campbell-Ryce.

At the minute we need a couple of new players in there, and need some height, power and pace in the side, as we are quite clearly missing all 3 of those attributes, and that is pretty much why we are a soft touch in the league especially away from home.
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Yes, we were poor. I watched it on BP, but had to skip the first 10 minutes of the first half as it was filmed against the sun and you could hardly see anything.

I think the plan was to play a counter attacking game like we do in cup games. Part of the problem may have been that players' apetite for the game was nowhere near what it is when we're underdogs in the cup. I think many of them had the Tottenham on their mind already. Like many of us I reckon. I wrote a blog this week, and it wasn't about the MK Dons game. But here are some thoughts:


  • Full backs were reluctant to go forward. We very rarely managed to get the ball to Murphy and JCR in good positions in the first half. Murphy had one chance to go for the byline against an uncomfortable looking right back, but frustratingly cut inside. Consequently we created little from wide, until JCR decided to take responsibility in the second half.
  • Their left back Lewington is getting slow, and we should have targeted him from the start.
  • We created nothing from central
  • Like vs Preston we tried Baxter in the holding role for some of the game, but he had little impact there.
  • Both Doyle and Scougall failed to offer anything going forward. We may have been happy with 0-0 at the break though.
  • Doyle had an effective game vs Preston, but I think Clough is wrong if he thinks he can play in an advanced midfield role regularly.
  • McNulty was very poor. There were a few times where our players were closed down aggressively and had to chip it forward down the line, hoping McNulty would come out wide for the ball. Every time it was a centre half who picked it up, with McNulty at best jogging after him. I think Clough's criticism was valid.
  • Alcock was awful. A bit of rustiness may be expected after a lengthy injury, but I thought he was poor positionally and struggled with his man all game. He's not comfortable on the ball and accepts very little responsibility offensively. Despite his good leap, I do hope Flynn is back on Wednesday, and I think Freeman may be needed.
  • In general we looked stretched, maybe the defence was too deep. McNulty and wingers very isolated. Midfield couldn't cover enough space.
  • I think two players had good games, McEveley and JCR.
  • Our organisation slipped up when they scored. No cover behind McEveley.

I think we will see a better performance on Wednesday.
 
GRUMPY BLADE said:
Won't bring in a striker but righting off £34M is a fair old slab of investment?
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A bit like a payday loan eh ................. starts off small then when it can't be paid he lends us more and on and on until the interest (at a higher rate than the banks) is like a millstone round the clubs neck, even the club assets can't pay it off. What started off as a few million in hard cash has in a few years become between £30-50 million owed to our Kev. £8m a year just to service a debt on an account sheet, anyone really think our Kev has had to go to his local branch of Barclays and write a cheque for £34m, the payday loan companies would still survive if they wrote off the debts owed them so will our Kev of that I can assure you.
 
Bergen Blade said:
Yes, we were poor. I watched it on BP, but had to skip the first 10 minutes of the first half as it was filmed against the sun and you could hardly see anything.

I think the plan was to play a counter attacking game like we do in cup games. Part of the problem may have been that players' apetite for the game was nowhere near what it is when we're underdogs in the cup. I think many of them had the Tottenham on their mind already. Like many of us I reckon. I wrote a blog this week, and it wasn't about the MK Dons game. But here are some thoughts:


  • Full backs were reluctant to go forward. We very rarely managed to get the ball to Murphy and JCR in good positions in the first half. Murphy had one chance to go for the byline against an uncomfortable looking right back, but frustratingly cut inside. Consequently we created little from wide, until JCR decided to take responsibility in the second half.
  • Their left back Lewington is getting slow, and we should have targeted him from the start.
  • We created nothing from central
  • Like vs Preston we tried Baxter in the holding role for some of the game, but he had little impact there.
  • Both Doyle and Scougall failed to offer anything going forward. We may have been happy with 0-0 at the break though.
  • Doyle had an effective game vs Preston, but I think Clough is wrong if he thinks he can play in an advanced midfield role regularly.
  • McNulty was very poor. There were a few times where our players were closed down aggressively and had to chip it forward down the line, hoping McNulty would come out wide for the ball. Every time it was a centre half who picked it up, with McNulty at best jogging after him. I think Clough's criticism was valid.
  • Alcock was awful. A bit of rustiness may be expected after a lengthy injury, but I thought he was poor positionally and struggled with his man all game. He's not comfortable on the ball and accepts very little responsibility offensively. Despite his good leap, I do hope Flynn is back on Wednesday, and I think Freeman may be needed.
  • In general we looked stretched, maybe the defence was too deep. McNulty and wingers very isolated. Midfield couldn't cover enough space.
  • I think two players had good games, McEveley and JCR.
  • Our organisation slipped up when they scored. No cover behind McEveley.

I think we will see a better performance on Wednesday.
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Some good points Bergs,but the one with McEveley and trying to detract away from what was clearly his fault was wrong imo.He has done this a few times now and we desperately need a good solid Centre back who doesn't let strikers turn them as easy as he does.I'm not saying he's a bad player,but to me it has now come apparent that with all the tendancies he has,he has to stick to his usual position,which unfortunately he isn't going to be playing there as Chopper is by far our best option there.He wouldn't be a bad back up though.
 
We are now going into a period where we will be playing two games a week, judging by recent form does anyone believe our present squad is strong enough to cope with this ?
I'd say If the squad isn't strengthened considerably in this widow disaster could well be looming on all fronts ...
 
wizadry said:
Some good points Bergs,but the one with McEveley and trying to detract away from what was clearly his fault was wrong imo.He has done this a few times now and we desperately need a good solid Centre back who doesn't let strikers turn them as easy as he does.I'm not saying he's a bad player,but to me it has now come apparent that with all the tendancies he has,he has to stick to his usual position,which unfortunately he isn't going to be playing there as Chopper is by far our best option there.He wouldn't be a bad back up though.
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There were several things going wrong when they scored. Kennedy breaks out of the backline and McEveley is suddenly all alone dealing with the striker and a midfielder running through. McEveley should have tried to hold them up, rather than committing himself. It's a midfielder who runs through and scores though, not the striker he challenged. . Alcock, Kennedy and Harris are not free from blame either.

I like focusing on: Why did it become a difficult situation to deal with?

Not just: Who was nearest when they scored?
 
Bergen Blade said:
There were several things going wrong when they scored. Kennedy breaks out of the backline and McEveley is suddenly all alone dealing with the striker and a midfielder running through. McEveley should have tried to hold them up, rather than committing himself. It's a midfielder who runs through and scores though, not the striker he challenged. . Alcock, Kennedy and Harris are not free from blame either.

I like focusing on: Why did it become a difficult situation to deal with?

Not just: Who was nearest when they scored?
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I too like looking for why these situations have developed and agree in most part there with your assesment,but ultimately,if McEveley holds his ground and is a bit stonger,they don't score and we could've nicked it.These are the fine margins we're talking about while ever Clough adopts the tactics he does.
 
wizadry said:
I too like looking for why these situations have developed and agree in most part there with your assesment,but ultimately,if McEveley holds his ground and is a bit stonger,they don't score and we could've nicked it.These are the fine margins we're talking about while ever Clough adopts the tactics he does.
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Yes, but at the time McEveley is all alone with a striker and a player running beyond him, we are in trouble.

How we allowed MK Dons to put us in such a situation is the main thing to look at if we want to improve our defending, and do better next time.
 
Bergen Blade said:
Yes, but at the time McEveley is all alone with a striker and a player running beyond him, we are in trouble.

How we allowed MK Dons to put us in such a situation is the main thing to look at if we want to improve our defending, and do better next time.
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I don't want to get into a long winded debate about it like the MaCarthy debacle,but whatever happens up the pitch should normally get stopped at some point by your best tacklers or defenders.This didn't happen as McEveley isn't a Centre back.I don't just blame him,but he was the main culprit and has in general done a decent job to say it's not his natural position.
 
wizadry said:
I don't want to get into a long winded debate about it like the MaCarthy debacle,but whatever happens up the pitch should normally get stopped at some point by your best tacklers or defenders.This didn't happen as McEveley isn't a Centre back.I don't just blame him,but he was the main culprit and has in general done a decent job to say it's not his natural position.
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Ok pal, I'll leave it at that.
 
Jim Chimmerney said:
I've seen nothing in the Chumpionship games I've seen this season to suggest we couldn't be competitive, even with what we have now.
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I have. The teams in that league are massive and on the whole much faster. They'd eat us alive.
 
metalblade said:
A bit like a payday loan eh ................. starts off small then when it can't be paid he lends us more and on and on until the interest (at a higher rate than the banks) is like a millstone round the clubs neck, even the club assets can't pay it off. What started off as a few million in hard cash has in a few years become between £30-50 million owed to our Kev. £8m a year just to service a debt on an account sheet, anyone really think our Kev has had to go to his local branch of Barclays and write a cheque for £34m, the payday loan companies would still survive if they wrote off the debts owed them so will our Kev of that I can assure you.
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Pity we aren't with the Co-Op Bank then
 
grafikhaus said:
Yeah. Good call. When that match is long forgotten and Soton are a force in the top flight while we're languishing in the lower divisions, I'll realise you were right, and United had got it right all along.
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No, I agree with your main points about Southampton. We should aspire to emulate them. And you're right, they have made some astute signings and managerial appointments since 2010.

However, let's not forget who Adkins inherited as part of his Div 3 promotion winning squad: Lambert, Lallana, Barnard and Oxlade-Chamberlain to name a few (to be fair you or I could have won promotion with that group). One could argue he was very fortunate and his subsequent performance, when required to build his own teams may be a better reflection on his ability?

In making the point about our Southampton victory, I'm simply implying we're not as bad as some of our fellow supporters suggest. Cloughie and the rest of us know we need more firepower. He inherited an average Div 3 team and turned it quickly around into a promotion contending team, capable, on its day, of beating a string of Premier League and Championship teams. The only players he inherited who were arguably of Premier League quality, both left - for reasons beyond his control.

He has made mistakes, though most of his signings have improved us. Unfortunately his worst (Higdon) was the one he most needed to get right. All involved deserve criticism for not remedying this sooner.

I expect new arrivals this week and I'm confident of making the play-offs. If we don't win promotion this season, will it be failure on Cloughie's part? Probably, but he will still have moved us forward considerably from where he found us and given us more good memories in 12 months than we'd experienced in the 5 years before he arrived.

Remember: Southampton wasn't built in a day!
 



The Bohemian said:
No, I agree with your main points about Southampton. We should aspire to emulate them. And you're right, they have made some astute signings and managerial appointments since 2010.

However, let's not forget who Adkins inherited as part of his Div 3 promotion winning squad: Lambert, Lallana, Barnard and Oxlade-Chamberlain to name a few (to be fair you or I could have won promotion with that group). One could argue he was very fortunate and his subsequent performance, when required to build his own teams may be a better reflection on his ability?

In making the point about our Southampton victory, I'm simply implying we're not as bad as some of our fellow supporters suggest. Cloughie and the rest of us know we need more firepower. He inherited an average Div 3 team and turned it quickly around into a promotion contending team, capable, on its day, of beating a string of Premier League and Championship teams. The only players he inherited who were arguably of Premier League quality, both left - for reasons beyond his control.

He has made mistakes, though most of his signings have improved us. Unfortunately his worst (Higdon) was the one he most needed to get right. All involved deserve criticism for not remedying this sooner.

I expect new arrivals this week and I'm confident of making the play-offs. If we don't win promotion this season, will it be failure on Cloughie's part? Probably, but he will still have moved us forward considerably from where he found us and given us more good memories in 12 months than we'd experienced in the 5 years before he arrived.

Remember: Southampton wasn't built in a day!
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great post Behemian i agree 100% our lack of goals has cost us heaverly this season if you were to talk to clough im sure he would agree with you definately been short of a goalscorer and he has not really done much to remedy it apart from within the ranks trying players.Mcnulty is coming through but as clough says he has a lot to learn(radio sheffield should be ashamed of themselves trying to drive a wedge between the fans and clough regarding comments he made after MK match
they cut out the bit where clough was supporting Mcnulty to make an issue out of nothing just to draw some vitreol from fans who think he should be starting every match clough signed him for the blades and is making a good player out of him but as clough said he will have games like MK shame on them!) hopefully he will remedy the finishing problem as it has become acute and could cost us dear in the run in
 
But that's the surprising thing, why has he avoided the striker problem .
Chris O'Grady is not the only striker in the football league, nor is he a particularly prolific one, and if he is so important to the structure of the team why didn't Nigel offer more at the beginning of the season?

Was this a Nigel failing or a board decision.
 
SandyMcBlade said:
But that's the surprising thing, why has he avoided the striker problem .
Chris O'Grady is not the only striker in the football league, nor is he a particularly prolific one, and if he is so important to the structure of the team why didn't Nigel offer more at the beginning of the season?

Was this a Nigel failing or a board decision.
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Because we won't pay over the odds,or be held to ransom:rolleyes::D
 
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The ones that will have learned a lesson from this season's performance will be the bookies.
You can bet they won't make the same mistake as Blades to win the league, no matter which league they end up playing in next season.
 
Toronto Blade said:
The ones that will have learned a lesson from this season's performance will be the bookies.
You can bet they won't make the same mistake as Blades to win the league, no matter which league they end up playing in next season.
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The bookies will be laughing their bollocks off,they wouldn't have liked it if we were top as the weight of money put on us was the reason we were that short.

So in short,the bookies haven't made a mistake,they've made a lot of money as per usual.
 
Bergen Blade said:
McNulty and wingers very isolated.
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This.

For Clough to make his system work, the whole team has to be 'on it' and attacking/defending as one...when they are, we see some good performances ("cup tarts" mainly, I know... 'tm' Kenilworth???)

When they are not 'on it', it's grim.

Sadly don't see a fairytale ending this time either, unless the Spurs players are incredibly stupid, apathetic and arrogant... :(
 
Esablade said:
This.

For Clough to make his system work, the whole team has to be 'on it' and attacking/defending as one...when they are, we see some good performances ("cup tarts" mainly, I know... 'tm' Kenilworth???)

When they are not 'on it', it's grim.

Sadly don't see a fairytale ending this time either, unless the Spurs players are incredibly stupid, apathetic and arrogant... :(
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No, no, no, no, no

How many times? It's "Fucking Cup Tarts"

;)
 
Esablade said:
This.

For Clough to make his system work, the whole team has to be 'on it' and attacking/defending as one...when they are, we see some good performances ("cup tarts" mainly, I know... 'tm' Kenilworth???)

When they are not 'on it', it's grim.

Sadly don't see a fairytale ending this time either, unless the Spurs players are incredibly stupid, apathetic and arrogant... :(
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To be fair Esa - the effing was added in later - the original thread called them "Cup Tarts" after the Crewe match last year

http://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/hang-your-fucking-heads-in-shame.32944/
 
Putney Blade said:
Crap.

Offensively poor AGAIN. We are no threat to teams. We lack pace, strength and guile.

McNulty is no lone striker. He is too slow to run the channels, lacks quick feet to turn defenders and lacks height to be a threat. Not his fault he played alone, appears to be box player, somebody who can seize on opportunities created for him. But he can't run the line alone.

The club does not currently possess a striker of any quality. That is how bad it is.

Higdon came on for McNulty, huffed and puffed, showed no quality. What are poor signing!

If you want to play a lone striker, they've got to have pace, strength and pull the central defenders all over the park. Neither McNulty or Higdon can do this.

Our midfield is too slow and small. We are good at playing in triangles and across the pitch, but there is no penetration. We don't have the quality to break down two banks of four. The only danger is when JCR get's on the ball wide, either running at defenders or cutting inside. And that's it folk. He is our one danger. Baxter, Reid, Doyle, Scougall look to play side ways, lacking pace and power, they can't get themselves into threatening positions and create opportunities for themselves and others.

How many goals have our midfielders scored this season? Not many I suspect, like the rest of them

We also must have one of the smallest teams in the league; MK has some big lads, there is power throughout their team. They have a fare amount of skill too.

Apart from JCR, Murphy is the only other player with a degree of pace and ability, but like MK today, teams see him as the danger and mark him closely, often with two players. He was absent in the first half, got better in the second as we upped the tempo. Pity we decided to up the heat when chasing the game!

Let's be honest. Today was no surprise. Not been good enough offensively all season. Our home record is appalling. No reason to believe this will change. Difficult to see us winning the play-offs, can't score goals. Auto promotion is impossible.

Lacked striking power coming into this season. NC failed to appreciate this. He still does. The blame is with him. He buys, he sells, he loans, he set's formation, he set's the tactics.

Somebody needs to have a quiet word with him, otherwise we will be in exactly the same position next-season!

UTB




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That is how I saw the game too.....it was poor
 
Revolution said:
I have. The teams in that league are massive and on the whole much faster. They'd eat us alive.
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I was going to post that but thought Jim might think I was picking on him. :)

Teams can go up and prosper, but after years of watching Div1 football I've been impressed when seeing Championship football this season. Some no-messing about signings would be required.
 
Esablade said:
Sadly don't see a fairytale ending this time either, unless the Spurs players are incredibly stupid, apathetic and arrogant... :(
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I read on a Spurs forum that the team is preparing itself for a strong physical game, in other words they're gonna be shocked and defeated by our midget team.
 



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