I know very little about Jimmy hagan but...

[GRUMPY BLADE]

I too was at Joe Shaw's testimonial (what a legend he was) and saw Jimmy Hagan play and then understood what my dad and my uncles (all regulars at the lane for years) said about him being the best player to ever play for United, past, present and future. A particular memory from that game was when Jimmy "plucked" the ball, travelling at some pace, from waist height by an outstretched leg. It seemed as if he trapped the ball between his toes and shin and brought it down in one rapid movement. I do not remember anyone else doing that feat of brilliant ball control since. I was also astounded by the quality of the free kick he scored with too. Not bad for a man in his 50s who was the manager of WBA then

Said it before but my Father in Law always said he was better than Curry and when he was in a tight spot knew he could kick the ball towards Hagan at any height or speed and he would control it as you've discriped above.

Bearing in mind that Curry was the best ever, how good must have Hagan have been?

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

A few things I don't understand (hopefully due to age rather than ignorance)

- what were the "other games" he was scoring in during the war? Wikipedia doesn't describe them as league or cup games.

- what kind of team was the "war time" England team that he played for 16 times and scored 11 goals?

- I know he didn't get going with us until he was around 28, and I can see that he didn't make many appearances each season... But his goal scoring record isn't as amazing as I expected to be.

Can anyone shoot me down, or clear any of that up?

The "other games" would have been Wartime league games that replaced the suspended football league during WWII. I believe Jimmy Hagan turned out for Aldershot as well as United.

The war time England team was a very good England XI that played games against predominantly the other home nations, although they did play France and possibly Belgium towards the end of the war.

Different formations in those days but i think I'm right in thinking Hagan was more of a midfield player than forward. I'm sure others will confirm this, or not as the case may be.

FFS Grumpy it's Currie!!

 

[Silent Blade]

Different formations in those days but i think I'm right in thinking Hagan was more of a midfield player than forward. I'm sure others will confirm this, or not as the case may be.

He was an Inside Forward

 

[beightonblade]

Lets put this to bed....Jimmy was good but not as good as TC....and TC had the swagger.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

The "other games" would have been Wartime league games that replaced the suspended football league during WWII. I believe Jimmy Hagan turned out for Aldershot as well as United.

The war time England team was a very good England XI that played games against predominantly the other home nations, although they did play France and possibly Belgium towards the end of the war.

Different formations in those days but i think I'm right in thinking Hagan was more of a midfield player than forward. I'm sure others will confirm this, or not as the case may be.

FFS Grumpy it's Currie!!

Spell checker on damn phone!!!!

 

[FTPE]

Lets put this to bed....Jimmy was good but not as good as TC....and TC had the swagger.

Really? Do many people think that too? I mean people who saw them both?
(I saw neither)

 

[beightonblade]

Really? Do many people think that too? I mean people who saw them both?
(I saw neither)

The sight of TC running towards the kop blowing kisses is a memory I will treasure forever.
BDTBL was electric when he was playing.

 

[beightonblade]

Ahhhhhhhhhhh memories ..........

 

[Hodgyman]

Really? Do many people think that too? I mean people who saw them both?
(I saw neither)

I used to love to see Currie perform his football and crowd-pleasing magic skills too but was convinced by the opinions of my dad & 2 uncles who saw them both many times, and the once that I saw Jimmy Hagan, that Jimmy was the best

 

[finlaytheblade]

Lets put this to bed....Jimmy was good but not as good as TC....and TC had the swagger.

you cannot compare players from different era,s as football is changing all the time.But i will say to manipulate the ball in Hagan,s era was more difficult as the ball was leather with no coating which made the ball very heavy when wet.the pitches were
mudbaths as well and although the pitches were still dodgy in TC,s time they were an improvement on Jmmy,s time.
its just a pity that most of Jimmy,s time was lost to history as theyr is not much film of him in action,we can all still
watch highlights of TC and druel over his skills, obviously two fantastic players will we ever see the likes of them again?
We can dream !!,

 

[FTPE]

you cannot compare players from different era,s as football is changing all the time.But i will say to manipulate the ball in Hagan,s era was more difficult as the ball was leather with no coating which made the ball very heavy when wet.the pitches were
mudbaths as well and although the pitches were still dodgy in TC,s time they were an improvement on Jmmy,s time.
its just a pity that most of Jimmy,s time was lost to history as theyr is not much film of him in action,we can all still
watch highlights of TC and druel over his skills, obviously two fantastic players will we ever see the likes of them again?
We can dream !!,

Again?I'm waiting to see my first one.
Borbokis is the closest I've seen, and hearing how you guys talk about the others it sounds like a really bad comparison

 

[Sirius]

Really? Do many people think that too? I mean people who saw them both?
(I saw neither)

Currie blew better kisses and could out swagger most.
Good as. Currie was as a player and showman he never matched the skills that. Hagan demonstrated. Hagan better by a country mile. I. M. O

 

[Shalalalafenoughty]

Although my dad stopped going regularly when Hagan retired, he saw Currie on plenty of occasions including in the promotion season of 1971 when TC was playing brilliantly. He was a very fair-minded man and he always said Hagan was the better of the two but, significantly, he didn't regard the comparison as ridiculous like I would if someone compared Currie with, say, Michael Brown.

As I've mentioned earlier, he used to go to Bramall Lane one week and Owlerton the next for many years and he was adamant that Hagan was the best player he had ever seen in Sheffield. As a matter of interest, he always said that Jackie Robinson was the best Wednesday player he'd seen with Albert Quixall in second but neither of them were in Hagan's league.

Currie is without a shadow of a doubt the best player there has been in Sheffield since I started going in 1964 so I think we can say with some confidence that we've had the best two individual players to have played in Sheffield, certainly from the late thirties onwards.

 

[Silent Blade]

As I've mentioned earlier, he used to go to Bramall Lane one week and Owlerton the next for many years and he was adamant that Hagan was the best player he had ever seen in Sheffield. As a matter of interest, he always said that Jackie Robinson was the best Wednesday player he'd seen with Albert Quixall in second but neither of them were in Hagan's league.

.

I remember hearing about Jackie Robinson being a brilliant player for Wendy before the war and then when he came back to play for them after the war he had put on weight and wasnt the same player as he was,

I think he is 2nd from left in that infamous 1938 photo

 

[FTPE]

I remember hearing about Jackie Robinson being a brilliant player for Wendy before the war and then when he came back to play for them after the war he had put on weight and wasnt the same player as he was,

I think he is 2nd from left in that infamous 1938 photo

Bet he regrets the smile with the nazi salute though in hindsight...

 

[wizadry]

Again?I'm waiting to see my first one.
Borbokis is the closest I've seen, and hearing how you guys talk about the others it sounds like a really bad comparison

As much as i appreciate the views on the two legends in question,i think it's quite obvious who our legend is FTPE.

 

[FTPE]

As much as i appreciate the views on the two legends in question,i think it's quite obvious who our legend is FTPE.

Wasn't jagielka voted our best player of all time? At our anniversary awards I mean? Could be wrong

 

[Karaoke Blade]

Really? Do many people think that too? I mean people who saw them both?
(I saw neither)

My Dad (sadly, now passed away) saw both of them and would always tell me that Jimmy Hagan was the best player he had ever seen.

 

[Karaoke Blade]

Wasn't jagielka voted our best player of all time?

 

[Silent Blade]

Wasn't jagielka voted our best player of all time? At our anniversary awards I mean? Could be wrong

TC won the vote but remember how many of the voters never saw Hagan play, probably over 90% of the voters

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

TC won the vote but remember how many of the voters never saw Hagan play, probably over 90% of the voters

It's difficult to envisage a player that you've never seen play but if he was better than Currie [spell check back on PC] then he was [as opposed to must have been] some player.

 

[FTPE]

TC won the vote but remember how many of the voters never saw Hagan play, probably over 90% of the voters

Oh? I'm pretty sure there was either a starting 11 team or just a top 10 that they did that anniversary night that didn't have hagan in,
That said- it's pretty irrelevant if none of them saw him play any way.

 

[FTPE]

I'd usually write things like this as fact, But as you guys seem to really know your shit on this il make it a question-
Wasn't hagan very highly rated by Stanley Matthews too? I seem to remember hearing somewhere that he was picked by Matthews to play in his chosen 11 for his testimonial?

 

[Hodgyman]

I'd usually write things like this as fact, But as you guys seem to really know your shit on this il make it a question-
Wasn't hagan very highly rated by Stanley Matthews too? I seem to remember hearing somewhere that he was picked by Matthews to play in his chosen 11 for his testimonial?

I know that Sir Stanley saw him play. He was in the same team in Joe Shaw's testimonial. Any one present couldn't fail to be impressed

 

[Shalalalafenoughty]

I'd usually write things like this as fact, But as you guys seem to really know your shit on this il make it a question-
Wasn't hagan very highly rated by Stanley Matthews too? I seem to remember hearing somewhere that he was picked by Matthews to play in his chosen 11 for his testimonial?

He played in the warm-up match, billed as "post-war favourites." Roger Barnard covers it in his biography of Hagan, which I'd strongly recommend.

Matthews described the warm-up game in his own autobiography: "For the very last time people saw the sophisticated artistry of Tom Finney and Jimmy Hagan, the still lethal shooting of Morty (Stan Mortensen), Jackie Milburn and Nat Lofthouse, the crunch tackling of Harry Johnston and Jimmy Scoular, the heading of Neil Franklin that mixed power, grace and style, and, the most blessed sight of all, burly Jock Dodds, one time Blackpool (and Sheffield United) and my old RAF pal, slower in pace but not in mind or reflexes, harnessing all and sundry, appealing for justice and, as of yore, getting very little."

 

[Silent Blade]

Wasn't hagan very highly rated by Stanley Matthews too? I seem to remember hearing somewhere that he was picked by Matthews to play in his chosen 11 for his testimonial?

Not in the testimonial match, the pre-match entertainment consisted of another match of two veteran teams featuring many legends of the game. Harry Johnston led out a team consisting of: Bert Trautmann; Tim Ward; George Hardwick; Jimmy Hill; Neil Franklin; Don Revie; Stan Mortensen; Nat Lofthouse; Jimmy Hagan; Tom Finney; and Frank Bowyer (reserve). Walley Barnes led out an opposing team consisting of: Jimmy O'Neill; Jimmy Scoular; Danny Blanchflower; Jimmy Dickinson; Hughie Kelly; Bill McGarry; Jackie Mudie; Jackie Milburn; Jock Dodds; Ken Barnes; and Arthur Rowley (reserve)

The below is from the programme of that match, None of them were retired players

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Poor old Ritchie of Stoke City. He must have felt like Anne Widdicombe at the Miss World contest.

 

[Shalalalafenoughty]

Poor old Ritchie of Stoke City. He must have felt like Anne Widdicombe at the Miss World contest.

Indeed. And the worst was yet to come...

 

[Woodwardfan]

May I say what is always in my mind when fans eulogise over Currie. He left us to play for Leeds United.

Hagan said "no".

My hero Woodward stayed with us throughout.

These are indisputable facts.

There are various ways of choosing "best ever" players but I would never vote for one who left us for richer pastures. I think that is part of the package and influences my personal judgement.

Of course Currie wasn't a local. That has to make a difference to his loyalties, fair enough.

 

[bornablade]

May I say what is always in my mind when fans eulogise over Currie. He left us to play for Leeds United.

Hagan said "no".

My hero Woodward stayed with us throughout.

These are indisputable facts.

There are various ways of choosing "best ever" players but I would never vote for one who left us for richer pastures. I think that is part of the package and influences my personal judgement.

Of course Currie wasn't a local. That has to make a difference to his loyalties, fair enough.

Am I correct in thinking Matt Busby made a bid to sign TC in 1973(?) to replace Bobby Charlton and Currie turned down the move?