First half vs Second half tables

[Nick Jansky]

Gus looked cooked after 10 minutes. He did well to keep going but surely someone at the club should say ‘ Gus unless you lose 2 stone we aren’t paying you,’ Its insane that he’s allowed to be such a fat bastard. And don’t get me wrong he’s my favourite player.

Shouldn’t it be the manager’s job to be having those conversations?

 

[sheepbridge]

Shouldn’t it be the manager’s job to be having those conversations?

It is, but also these are professional athletes.
The last season ended in late May and started again in August.

How hard is it to retain fitness during that time?
It shouldn't need Wilder or the fitness coaches to need a pre-season to get them fit enough to be able to play 90 minutes in March, and Wilder did come back in September.

It's pretty embarrassing both as a club and for the players individually that that manager is saying some of them aren't fit enough to play 90 minutes.

It's been mentioned that Selles concentrated more on technical stuff and less on fitness. Ok, that's fine. If the players thought that, why not do a bit of fitness work after training? Surely as athletes they know what level they need to be at for the start of the season and shouldn't need to be told or made to do it.

It just all feeds in to the narrative that this club is badly run, and has been for many years.

 

[Shawy24]

Wilder makes all his “tactical” substitutions in the second half. Just saying…….

 

[BiggerBladeThanThou]

Selles, obviously.

We never conceded late goals last season to lose games we'd been winning or have players struggle to play more than 60 minutes every week.

It’s part Selles but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking Wilder hasn’t had long enough to sort that problem out. Wilder doesn’t know how to react in games. I’ve said it countless of times on here but he’s a one trick pony. he relies heavily on blowing teams away in the first half by fast, energetic pressing and hoping we get the lead. When he doesn’t get the lead or we get the lead by 1 or 2 (Preston, Wrexham etc.) there’s no game management from there on. He has no strategic thought as to how the game might’ve changed and what he may need to do to push for a goal in the second half (after he’s gassed us out first half) or how to hold on to a victory with the other team pressing hard to get back in it (Coventry both games).

He’s coming unstuck quickly.

 

[Badger Blade]

It's down to the squad that's been assembled as a collective effort from Wilder and Selles.

We have good footballers but it comes more down to mindset when we go a goal up. They're like greyhounds out the traps in the first half hour then it all drops off a cliff either when we score or the clock hits 65, whichever comes first. We had it about us for a while when we were gaining ground on the play offs, scoring goals, playing positive, direct (but not hoof) football which for some reason went by the wayside a month or so back.

They're professional footballers and should be fit enough to hack 90 minutes - not cutting corners knowing that there's 5 subs and that you might only have to do 60.

Subs are there for more than just injury prevention, red card prevention or taking someone off who is getting tired. They need to make some sort of an impact and that's what we desperately lack. There's nobody on the bench that the opposition would see getting ready and think "oh shit, not him". They'd see Tom Cannon or Chong getting ready and know that they're in for an easy ride for the last chunk of the game.

Its akin to the 20/21 season where as soon as we go a goal down, you can write it off because there's no chance we haul it back. Heads drop, they give up and there's no leadership to get things going again and nobody capable of changing the game.

Shoot me down but for a lot of the good performances since Wilder came back, Ben Mee was at the back.

Tanganga isn't captaincy material in my mind but Mee is virtually finished now. We need someone to dish out the bollockings and gee the team up but not at the expense of actually being a good player, which was the blind spot Wilder had with Robinson who lacked basic footballing ability at this level.

 

[espoo blade]

Cross-posting as we have a bunch of threads on a similar theme:

E

Post in thread 'Interesting stat....'

Today at 9:12 AM

Transfermarkt has a table based on the points picked up after taking the lead.

Only Wrexham and Coventry have taken the lead in more matches than us.
Boro are outstandingly efficient after taking the lead.
Only Blackburn, Leicester and Wendy have worse ppg when they've taken the lead.

Championship - Points after taking lead 25/26 (Detailed view)

This overview lists in detail the number of matches of the Championship in the 25/26 season in which a club took the lead and how many points were gained afterwards.

www.transfermarkt.com

• espoo blade

 

[cooperblade]

We were the better team for the first 54 minutes. It looked like hard work though. I felt it would have to take a monumental effort from almost the entire team for us to score a goal.

Eventually it happened, but then they hit a long punt down the channel and seconds later it was 1-1.

I think that was such a blow to us - after all our dominance, to see them score such an "easy" goal - that we never recovered.

Tactically (not much we could do) , mentally (failing to reset) and physically (energy spent) we came up short. It's not the first time this season.

We have a decent XI, but if we haven't finished off teams by the time we (have to) make our second half substitutions, we struggle.

That sums it up nicely. We have to play well for a sustained period to score and our opposition seem to be able to score almost as soon as they come into the game.

We don't score easily enough and we concede too easily.

The big positive for me is that we are much better this season than last at having long spells of relatively free-flowing, attacking play. Other than a spell when we seemed to score 3 every game, it hasn't translated into goals though. I think part of this is a lack of good striker options and I also think it doesn't help that we have two, key attacking players in O'Hare and Hamer who offer so little from a physical point of view (O'Hare can run all day but can't run away from anyone).

I also think that tactically, as we saw last season, our game is a dependent on scoring first and scoring early. We run ourselves into the ground a bit and it might be an energy-usage thing (in that we use ours up too early and don't have the quality off the bench to mitigate it) rather than a pure 'we're not fit enough' thing (obviously there's a link between the two).

I haven't looked into the numbers but it feels a bit like we were incredibly good at holding onto leads for most of last season and we're incredibly bad at it this and if you've added it all together, it might come out somewhere close to the average?

 

[Brian Deane]

Fitness/bench. This is elite professional sport. Fundamentally football is about running, endurance and (increasingly) high intensity sprints.

The latter is definitely not going to help. Tis no wonder their bolloxed after a skinful.......

 

[Brian Deane]

Cross-posting as we have a bunch of threads on a similar theme:

E

Post in thread 'Interesting stat....'

Today at 9:12 AM

Transfermarkt has a table based on the points picked up after taking the lead.

Only Wrexham and Coventry have taken the lead in more matches than us.
Boro are outstandingly efficient after taking the lead.
Only Blackburn, Leicester and Wendy have worse ppg when they've taken the lead.

Championship - Points after taking lead 25/26 (Detailed view)

This overview lists in detail the number of matches of the Championship in the 25/26 season in which a club took the lead and how many points were gained afterwards.

www.transfermarkt.com

• espoo blade

Each to their own Pal, makes no difference to me.
Does the Mrs Know yet
Good Luck

 

[sheepbridge]

It’s part Selles but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking Wilder hasn’t had long enough to sort that problem out. Wilder doesn’t know how to react in games. I’ve said it countless of times on here but he’s a one trick pony. he relies heavily on blowing teams away in the first half by fast, energetic pressing and hoping we get the lead. When he doesn’t get the lead or we get the lead by 1 or 2 (Preston, Wrexham etc.) there’s no game management from there on. He has no strategic thought as to how the game might’ve changed and what he may need to do to push for a goal in the second half (after he’s gassed us out first half) or how to hold on to a victory with the other team pressing hard to get back in it (Coventry both games).

He’s coming unstuck quickly.

Sorry, I was being sarcastic, night not have come out that way.

Everything is Selles's fault, and will be for ever more for some people, including players not being fit, the same ones who weren't fit last season though either strangely.

We did concede late goals last year. Wembley as a prime example.
Partly down to fitness, partly down to poor substitutions, partly down to not being able to react to opposition managers changing personnel and formations, but it's more of an issue this year.

 

[Bergen Blade]

That sums it up nicely. We have to play well for a sustained period to score and our opposition seem to be able to score almost as soon as they come into the game.

We don't score easily enough and we concede too easily.

The big positive for me is that we are much better this season than last at having long spells of relatively free-flowing, attacking play. Other than a spell when we seemed to score 3 every game, it hasn't translated into goals though. I think part of this is a lack of good striker options and I also think it doesn't help that we have two, key attacking players in O'Hare and Hamer who offer so little from a physical point of view (O'Hare can run all day but can't run away from anyone).

I also think that tactically, as we saw last season, our game is a dependent on scoring first and scoring early. We run ourselves into the ground a bit and it might be an energy-usage thing (in that we use ours up too early and don't have the quality off the bench to mitigate it) rather than a pure 'we're not fit enough' thing (obviously there's a link between the two).

I haven't looked into the numbers but it feels a bit like we were incredibly good at holding onto leads for most of last season and we're incredibly bad at it this and if you've added it all together, it might come out somewhere close to the average?

Wilder seems reluctant to start O'Hare and Hamer away. It's happened only twice since early October. Both of those happened after good home wins (3-0 vs Brum, 3-1 vs Ipswich) and he probably was confident, but neither gave us away wins.

No doubt he's looking at getting the balance right in every match we play. The first half table may indicate that he's quite good at setting the team up, but as match scenarios change we often lack the flexibility to adapt. The fact that a number of our players can't play a full game further complicates things for us.

 

[Champagneblade]

Big difference. Is it just about fitness? Any other reasons why we're poorer after the break?

View attachment 233566 View attachment 233567

Christ. What’s the half time routine? A packet of Benson and Hedges and a bottle of Sherry?!

 

[Bladesince59]

Not just this season though is it ? Been the same since before Christmas 2024.

 

[espoo blade]

Each to their own Pal, makes no difference to me.
Does the Mrs Know yet
Good Luck

I only do it when she's out at the "bingo"

 

[nopigfansintown]

Sorry, I was being sarcastic, night not have come out that way.

Everything is Selles's fault, and will be for ever more for some people, including players not being fit, the same ones who weren't fit last season though either strangely.

We did concede late goals last year. Wembley as a prime example.
Partly down to fitness, partly down to poor substitutions, partly down to not being able to react to opposition managers changing personnel and formations, but it's more of an issue this year.

Some of that is true albeit last season's pre season was hugely undermined by boardroom shenanigans. Two lists, tiny squad in place without the requisite fitness work due to timelines. The in season fitness was undermined by us having to run our small pre Jan squad into the ground due to the chronic lack of depth. Nobody expected an automatic challenge for that reason.Then key injuries to Souttar, Arblaster and Souza (the latter was never the same after we injured him running him into the ground) in the first half of the season. The players I believe could've been more professional last season (no prizes for guessing) were still night and day last season to this.

Context is King and revisionism to suit agendas should always be rejected. SUFC have been a dysfunctional club re transfers and fitness for at least four seasons. Even the Heckingbottom promotion happened amidst a season long injury crisis. The boardroom are primarily responsible.Any serious breakdown will lead you there.

Going forward:

* No large turnover of players in Jan. We need them in situ for the first game. 1-2 in Jan to cover injuries, take advantage of an unmissable deal or to bring in undoubted top class quality on loan if challenging. This is a league with 2-3 game weeks so rotation is imperative. Jan signings are historically besot with issues so any club bringing in a lot iof them is dysfunctional and highly likely to fail. It deserves to fail.

It can't be accepted that we lose matches because we aren't fit.

For the doubters who live in the 1980s: Analyse any athletic sport which requires a pre season and tell me what the performance outcomes are for the athletes that don't do a full pre season. Then find some quotes from players that analyse their own careers in autobiographies etc. I'm sure you'll find them talking about how shit they felt, and how that undermined their performance.

 

[Rudders]

Some of that is true albeit last season's pre season was hugely undermined by boardroom shenanigans. Two lists, tiny squad in place without the requisite fitness work due to timelines. The in season fitness was undermined by us having to run our small pre Jan squad into the ground due to the chronic lack of depth. Nobody expected an automatic challenge for that reason.Then key injuries to Souttar, Arblaster and Souza (the latter was never the same after we injured him running him into the ground) in the first half of the season. The players I believe could've been more professional last season (no prizes for guessing) were still night and day last season to this.

Context is King and revisionism to suit agendas should always be rejected. SUFC have been a dysfunctional club re transfers and fitness for at least four seasons. Even the Heckingbottom promotion happened amidst a season long injury crisis. The boardroom are primarily responsible.Any serious breakdown will lead you there.

Going forward:

* No large turnover of players in Jan. We need them in situ for the first game. 1-2 in Jan to cover injuries, take advantage of an unmissable deal or to bring in undoubted top class quality on loan if challenging. This is a league with 2-3 game weeks so rotation is imperative. Jan signings are historically besot with issues so any club bringing in a lot iof them is dysfunctional and highly likely to fail. It deserves to fail.

It can't be accepted that we lose matches because we aren't fit.

For the doubters who live in the 1980s: Analyse any athletic sport which requires a pre season and tell me what the performance outcomes are for the athletes that don't do a full pre season. Then find some quotes from players that analyse their own careers in autobiographies etc. I'm sure you'll find them talking about how shit they felt, and how that undermined their performance.

SUFC Boardroom Response: but but but last week of August bargainzzzzzz!!

 

[Blade56]

We don’t react when teams make changes, we just keep plugging away doing the same thing.

We’re a stat check for how good the other manager is.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS IS IT ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^