Transfer targets

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blade67 said:
I reckon that is bang on for students or folk fancying a city/ country break, "Chatsworth on the Friday, beers and a meal out on the Saturday".

Perhaps less appealing to millionaire twenty something footballers though.
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I read an article about Hathersage, Bakewell, Chatsworth etc in some magazine whilst waiting at a hospital for someone to come out after having their appointment.

The article basically told of the wonderful country life, pubs, restaurants, hotels..........and all within a stones throw of Manchester.
Now bearing in mind most of these places have a "S" Postcode and supposedly belong to Sheffield's marvellous peak district suburbs, you can see how Sheffield has failed even in the things it supposedly promotes so well.
 

JJBlade said:
I read an article about Hathersage, Bakewell, Chatsworth etc in some magazine whilst waiting at a hospital for someone to come out after having their appointment.

The article basically told of the wonderful country life, pubs, restaurants, hotels..........and all within a stones throw of Manchester.
Now bearing in mind most of these places have a "S" Postcode and supposedly belong to Sheffield's marvellous peak district suburbs, you can see how Sheffield has failed even in the things it supposedly promotes so well.
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You know it really pisses me off that north Derbyshire is seen as a "Sheffield suburb". It's undoubtedly true. Families who have lived in our villages for generations (in my case centuries) are all bring priced out by wealthy Yorkshire commuters and retirees, and our own families are bring displaced to towns, even though they may still work in the village. Seeing someone we recognise from school days - or even hearing a Derbyshire accent - is becoming a rarity.

And the arrogance of Yorkshire people who move into Derbyshire and fly the Yorkshire flag, just to rub our noses into it - really pisses me off. Those f*cking flags need burning.
 
SheepdipBlade said:
Families who have lived in our villages for generations (in my case centuries) are all bring priced out by wealthy Yorkshire commuters and retirees, and our own families are bring displaced to towns, even though they may still work in the village.
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There's a huge rental and housing crisis going on and you'll find that stuff happening up and down the country, it's not specific to this neck of the woods.

I've lived in Heeley and Meersbrook for years until rent caught up and I had to move back up on the arbour. Recently I've been living in Bristol for work but I've just had to move back to Sheffield because the rental market is genuinely absurd down there. People are paying £700pcm for a room in a shared flat, no bills included.

Even before I moved down there last year, I was renting a nice flat in Meersbrook...same flat is on the market now...but for £725 instead of £550. That's a huge increase in less than a year, which means I'm now having to look at renting somewhere further out. When I rent somewhere further out (because it's more affordable) and other people do the same, then the rents go up in that area and people who were living there before eventually get priced out and have to move somewhere else...where the cycle repeats.

It's one of the worst aspects of capitalism. Those with less get pushed out of the way for those with more. It's crap, and it's particularly rife under this government.

Some very good friends of mine got priced out of Millhouses and ended up having to move to Clowne to get somewhere big enough for them, that they could afford. So they're now living in Derbyshire, and they're pretty annoyed at having to commute to work everyday...never mind having to change their kids schools.

Look at the bigger problem rather than just raging at other people who are affected by the same issues ✌🏻
 
SheepdipBlade said:
You know it really pisses me off that north Derbyshire is seen as a "Sheffield suburb". It's undoubtedly true. Families who have lived in our villages for generations (in my case centuries) are all bring priced out by wealthy Yorkshire commuters and retirees, and our own families are bring displaced to towns, even though they may still work in the village. Seeing someone we recognise from school days - or even hearing a Derbyshire accent - is becoming a rarity.

And the arrogance of Yorkshire people who move into Derbyshire and fly the Yorkshire flag, just to rub our noses into it - really pisses me off. Those f*cking flags need burning.
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I grew up in the Peaks and it's a hilarious misconception about being part of Sheffield. DE postcodes for one (except Hope Valley), but Chesterfield and Matlock were the go to 'bigger' places. There were only a few buses to Sheffield. That's much better now, but people living out there don't use Sheffield much unless they're from here.

I know people who have stayed there and it's incredibly difficult to find affordable accommodation.
 
LudlamBlade said:
There's a huge rental and housing crisis going on and you'll find that stuff happening up and down the country, it's not specific to this neck of the woods.

I've lived in Heeley and Meersbrook for years until rent caught up and I had to move back up on the arbour. Recently I've been living in Bristol for work but I've just had to move back to Sheffield because the rental market is genuinely absurd down there. People are paying £700pcm for a room in a shared flat, no bills included.

Even before I moved down there last year, I was renting a nice flat in Meersbrook...same flat is on the market now...but for £725 instead of £550. That's a huge increase in less than a year, which means I'm now having to look at renting somewhere further out. When I rent somewhere further out (because it's more affordable) and other people do the same, then the rents go up in that area and people who were living there before eventually get priced out and have to move somewhere else...where the cycle repeats.

It's one of the worst aspects of capitalism. Those with less get pushed out of the way for those with more. It's crap, and it's particularly rife under this government.

Some very good friends of mine got priced out of Millhouses and ended up having to move to Clowne to get somewhere big enough for them, that they could afford. So they're now living in Derbyshire, and they're pretty annoyed at having to commute to work everyday...never mind having to change their kids schools.

Look at the bigger problem rather than just raging at other people who are affected by the same issues ✌🏻
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And you can't even say you put your kids into Clowne College anymore.

Sheffield is currently a target for southerners looking for cheap houses. A side effect of working from home means many no longer need to be near central London. Fairly easy commute for a day or two a week as well.

The house prices are crazy (50-80k over asking price in Popular areas). People without rich parents or partners simply will never own a house unless they want to live in a poor area. Consequently, rents are sky-rocketing while wages stagnate.

My rent is significantly higher than my mortgage would be. Unless I win the lottery, I'm fucked for life.
 
LudlamBlade said:
There's a huge rental and housing crisis going on and you'll find that stuff happening up and down the country, it's not specific to this neck of the woods.

I've lived in Heeley and Meersbrook for years until rent caught up and I had to move back up on the arbour. Recently I've been living in Bristol for work but I've just had to move back to Sheffield because the rental market is genuinely absurd down there. People are paying £700pcm for a room in a shared flat, no bills included.

Even before I moved down there last year, I was renting a nice flat in Meersbrook...same flat is on the market now...but for £725 instead of £550. That's a huge increase in less than a year, which means I'm now having to look at renting somewhere further out. When I rent somewhere further out (because it's more affordable) and other people do the same, then the rents go up in that area and people who were living there before eventually get priced out and have to move somewhere else...where the cycle repeats.

It's one of the worst aspects of capitalism. Those with less get pushed out of the way for those with more. It's crap, and it's particularly rife under this government.

Some very good friends of mine got priced out of Millhouses and ended up having to move to Clowne to get somewhere big enough for them, that they could afford. So they're now living in Derbyshire, and they're pretty annoyed at having to commute to work everyday...never mind having to change their kids schools.

Look at the bigger problem rather than just raging at other people who are affected by the same issues ✌🏻
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Some very fair points, but you'll find the situation in Clowne and the old pit villages is very different from that in Bakewell, Hathersage that JJBlade was talking about.

What we see in the Peak District villages - and to a lesser degree those villages that border the National Park like Holmesfield, Barlow etc is house prices that are not cheaper than Sheffield - but considerably higher due to their location.

We're not seeing Sheffielders displaced by high city prices moving out, we're seeing wealthy commuters and retirees buying an "escape to the countryside" lifestyle and gentryfying our communities.

These people are killing village after village as living communities. House prices sky rocket, local amenities close as they still shop etc in town, the village social life becomes orientated towards bloody geriatrics and the village football team is full of outsiders as no one is left in the village fit to kick a ball. You can't even chuck a dart in the pub in case it lands in someone's braised camembert.

On a day to day level, these people think they own the bloody place, and are trying to make it some kind of pretend rural idyll. A few weeks back, my dog did a crap on the grass 100yds from home, and I had to go back for a bag. The attitude I got from the dee-dahs who've moved in was something to be seen as are the signs they've since put up. How dare I leave that muck there for all of two minutes!

It's not that they're incomers, it's not that they're wealthy - it's their arrogance - and when they top it off by flying their White Rose flags to say - "look what a success we've made of our life - we can afford to move out to the countryside". That grinds my gears.

So many local people, whose families have been the bedrock of those communities for decades have been driven out and split up by these incomers - and we don't need our noses rubbing in by being told we're not good enough to live in our own village anymore or to have to put up with their f*cking flags.
 
SheepdipBlade said:
Some very fair points, but you'll find the situation in Clowne and the old pit villages is very different from that in Bakewell, Hathersage that JJBlade was talking about.

What we see in the Peak District villages - and to a lesser degree those villages that border the National Park like Holmesfield, Barlow etc is house prices that are not cheaper than Sheffield - but considerably higher due to their location.

We're not seeing Sheffielders displaced by high city prices moving out, we're seeing wealthy commuters and retirees buying an "escape to the countryside" lifestyle and gentryfying our communities.

These people are killing village after village as living communities. House prices sky rocket, local amenities close as they still shop etc in town, the village social life becomes orientated towards bloody geriatrics and the village football team is full of outsiders as no one is left in the village fit to kick a ball. You can't even chuck a dart in the pub in case it lands in someone's braised camembert.

On a day to day level, these people think they own the bloody place, and are trying to make it some kind of pretend rural idyll. A few weeks back, my dog did a crap on the grass 100yds from home, and I had to go back for a bag. The attitude I got from the dee-dahs who've moved in was something to be seen as are the signs they've since put up. How dare I leave that muck there for all of two minutes!

It's not that they're incomers, it's not that they're wealthy - it's their arrogance - and when they top it off by flying their White Rose flags to say - "look what a success we've made of our life - we can afford to move out to the countryside". That grinds my gears.

So many local people, whose families have been the bedrock of those communities for decades have been driven out and split up by these incomers - and we don't need our noses rubbing in by being told we're not good enough to live in our own village anymore or to have to put up with their f*cking flags.
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It’s a problem for communities across the board from Cornwall all the way up to the lakes rural and urban communities in desirable areas are being pushed out and marginalised completely altering the sense of place which often made those locations desirable in the first place.

And whilst it can be dismissed as moaning we do lose something when it happens we lose the traditions, heritage and local dialects that add to the richness of our country. Our history isn’t just our physical spaces but also the people who transform those spaces into the places they are.

I wish I could offer you some hope sheepdip but it’s just not a priority in terms of legislation and without significant investment into housing stock I can’t see a solution. Maybe some form of restrictions on ownership meaning a certain percentage have to be owned by local families but I can’t see it sticking. Especially given the uproar there has been over places like St Ives trying to limit second home ownership never mind trying to ensure a degree of local ownership. Ultimately there’s too much money to be made by private landlords, holiday rents and those who are looking to renovate and sell on at a large mark up and those who operate in those industries seem to have wielded significant influence over successive governments.

A degree of outside migration is a good thing for communities especially when those coming in embrace the lifestyle and traditions of the area they are moving to and in many cases add to it but when the number of incomers is sufficient to supplant those who are native to the area then issues arise.
 
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Yogi said:
It’s a problem for communities across the board from Cornwall all the way up to the lakes rural communities in desirable areas are being pushed out and marginalised completely altering the sense of place which often made those locations desirable in the first place.

And whilst it can be dismissed as moaning we do lose something when it happens we lose the traditions, heritage and local dialects that add to the richness of our country. Our history isn’t just our physical spaces but also the people who transform those spaces into the places they are.

I wish I could offer you some hope sheepdip but it’s just not a priority in terms of legislation and without significant investment into housing stock I can’t see a solution. Maybe some form of restrictions on ownership meaning a certain percentage have to be owned by local families but I can’t see it sticking. Especially given the uproar there has been over places like St Ives trying to limit second home ownership never mind trying to ensure a degree of local ownership. Ultimately there’s too much money to be made by private landlords, holiday rents and those who are looking to renovate and sell on at a large mark up and those who operate in those industries seem to have wielded significant influence over successive governments.
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A good summing up Yogi.

I was away near Ulverston last week and was talking to a local about this, off the back of the Whitby vote.

He was saying that he could only stay local as he had a tied cottage and that 12 of the 14 houses in the local hamlet were either second homes or holiday lets. Another similarity with here is that the people working in the local economy had to commute out from town as local wages wouldn't support living close. The girls running the shop were both Ukrainian refugees.

An answer the Swedes made work (but our govt wouldn't consider I'm sure) is to ring fence local houses for the local market at a functioning (as opposed to speculators) price for six months - and only opening the sale to the open market if there's no local interest/need.
 
SheepdipBlade said:
A good summing up Yogi.

I was away near Ulverston last week and was talking to a local about this, off the back of the Whitby vote.

He was saying that he could only stay local as he had a tied cottage and that 12 of the 14 houses in the local hamlet were either second homes or holiday lets. Another similarity with here is that the people working in the local economy had to commute out from town as local wages wouldn't support living close. The girls running the shop were both Ukrainian refugees.

An answer the Swedes made work (but our govt wouldn't consider I'm sure) is to ring fence local houses for the local market at a functioning (as opposed to speculators) price for six months - and only opening the sale to the open market if there's no local interest/need.
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Yeah it’s something that directly affects quite a lot of my uni mates some of who are from Cornwall and rural wales and who are all now pretty much resigned to not being able to remain in their communities long term.

Yep the end result is a drain away of services as those who are employed to operate them can no long afford to live within a manageable distance when you add the current fuel and cost of living rises on top of that a lot of communities are going to see that exacerbated. Ultimately we end up with ghost towns only populated at the weekend.

The Swedish model sounds very reasonable dip but you’re right I’d be floored if we saw something similar. Our approach tends to be to avoid doing anything proactive if at all possible.
 

LudlamBlade said:
It's one of the worst aspects of capitalism. Those with less get pushed out of the way for those with more. It's crap, and it's particularly rife under this government.✌🏻
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It's got nothing to do with everyone's favourite catch-all bogeyman "capitalism". In fact it's the opposite of capitalism as housing and rental prices are a function of shortages on the supply side, which is a wholly political issue. So put the blame where it belongs, with environmentalists and NIMBYs

Neither those people nor capitalism, however, are to blame for our lack of realistic transfer targets.
 
Yogi said:
Yeah it’s something that directly affects quite a lot of my uni mates some of who are from Cornwall and rural wales and who are all now pretty much resigned to not being able to remain in their communities long term.

Yep the end result is a drain away of services as those who are employed to operate them can no long afford to live within a manageable distance when you add the current fuel and cost of living rises on top of that a lot of communities are going to see that exacerbated. Ultimately we end up with ghost towns only populated at the weekend.

The Swedish model sounds very reasonable dip but you’re right I’d be floored if we saw something similar. Our approach tends to be to avoid doing anything proactive if at all possible.
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It's been going on since about the late 60s mate and no one has given enough of a shit to do anything about it. It's made worse by the fact that when the countryside did get noticed, those idiots in the Countryside Alliance (remember them?) hijacked the agenda to make it about fox hunting.

It'll not be long before there's no one left in villages who isn't wealthy. Since when did it become morally acceptable that rural life if simply for the rich?

Anyway - this really should be on general chat, so I'll stop ranting now.
 
this is a very difficult problem to solve. I like the idea of the Swedish solution. However in reality the party selling a property want the highest return. Human nature. As I get older I like the idea of living out my retirement( if and when I get there) in a pretty little spot that still has a pub and a store, nice location and a bus ride from a supermarket, Hospital and train station. Someone will take my money, probably from selling great aunt Elsie's old cottage/flat, and then I'll see out my days being hated by the same locals that sell their properties. I will , however, free up a family home close to schools and jobs.
I will continue to take holidays in cottages etc all over the UK and contribute in some way to the local economy and job market. No doubt most of these tiny properties will only be comfortable for short stays as there is no room for the things you fill up your family homes with. Garage, Shed, Greenhouse, driveway, garden big enough for boistrous kids to let off steam. not required for a week or two at the max, but for a family with pets and hobbies etc a necessity . Most holiday lets are not family homes just old fashioned properties that are a bit small, lack parking and storage and are in villages that no longer have schools, shops , pubs etc. Landowners need to be able to, or pushed into, freeing up marginal land to build modern family housing in these villages that are for local families only.
 
Perhaps the transfers were done early, but not said anything about it if they are free transfers and not saying anything till the end of June when they contracts run out
 
gordoncharles said:
It's got nothing to do with everyone's favourite catch-all bogeyman "capitalism". In fact it's the opposite of capitalism as housing and rental prices are a function of shortages on the supply side, which is a wholly political issue. So put the blame where it belongs, with environmentalists and NIMBYs

Neither those people nor capitalism, however, are to blame for our lack of realistic transfer targets.
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Quite honestly - you don't know what you're talking about.

It should be about housing policy and how political decisions are made to protect vibrant communities. However, politicians have failed to make those decisions (or enable more local bodies to make those decisions) so we have no meaningful rural housing policy or strategy. (The old Section 106 housing supported by Rural Housing Enablers was the closest we got, but it was swept away in the Con/Lib austerity drive)

In this vacuum we have instead the open market - so it's all about capitalism.

The logical extention of your point about environmentalists and nimbys is to blame them for stopping housing developments in rural areas and national parks - presumably housing developments huge enough the reduce local prices to meet rural wages.

Sorry mate - but only the most extreme open marketeer would advocate tarmacking over the Peak District. The nation's most precious landscapes need protecting so we can all enjoy them - but the question is how that protection in socially inclusive.

Right now we have the worst of both worlds. Protection of the landscapes, but open market forces trashing our communities. The communities need the same kind of protection as the landscape - not the landscape needs sacrificing in the name of market driven house prices.
 
SheepdipBlade said:
Quite honestly - you don't know what you're talking about.
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Right back at you.

Sprawling housing developments don't need to built on beauty spots - though that doesn't seem to stop fucking enormous windmills from sprouting up in exactly those places, ruining the outlook for eternity, but there's plenty of greenfield and brownfield sites that can be developed.

I was thinking this just at the weekend on a rare foray. Anyone who thinks this country is crowded should be forced to take the train from Leeds to Newcastle. 100 odd miles and barely a settlement to be seen.

Instead you accuse me of wanting to "tarmac over the Peak District". FFS.

The "open market" is having no effect because supply is being deliberately restricted at a time when the population continues to increase. Consequently prices go up. I'm amazed I even have to type that out it's so obvious.

Housing stock in the UK is about 24 million properties, of which about 3/4 of a million are "second homes" Whilst most of those are rented out, around 40% are used only as weekend retreats by their owners, which is around 1% of the total stock, which isn't much, as annoying as most of the people who own them are.

It's a great shame that people end up priced out of now-desirable locations where their families have lived for generations whether that's in Derbyshire, Cumbria, Oxfordshire, or for that matter in the leafier parts of major conurbations and that has happened consistently for 40 years through successive housing bubbles, which are a function of lack of supply. And don't get me started on the mortgage requirements now required following the 2008 crash, or the buy-to-let explosion of the 2000s due to the hollowing out of private pension funds, both piloted by the inept Gordon Brown.

What do you want, rent controls? Because that's a certain way to make sure there's no property available.
 
JJBlade said:
Yes
Many stay, but it doesn't mean they are succesful people or a person of higher quality because they went to Uni

There are different types of students, those that come from families of high ranking business people, doctors, surgeons, dentists and people with shitloads of money.

These people have to succeed. After Uni, they're gone.

And the second type of student is at Uni for a bit of a laugh, they're quite clever, but they aren't really that bothered about success, they are rebellious, and a bit left wing and Liberal in their views.

After Uni, they get normal jobs and do nothing spectacular with their lives at all. They stay.
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I could introduce you to literally hundreds of very successful people who have chosen to move to Sheffield and love it here. But I won't, because by and large they don't like negative people ;)

If shopping is really your thing then Sheffield probably isn't for you. On the other hand, if you want a career in computer game design, music production, film & video production or advanced engineering or certain law specialisms, just to name a few examples, then there is nowhere finer to be.
 
gordoncharles said:
Right back at you.

Sprawling housing developments don't need to built on beauty spots - though that doesn't seem to stop fucking enormous windmills from sprouting up in exactly those places, ruining the outlook for eternity, but there's plenty of greenfield and brownfield sites that can be developed.

I was thinking this just at the weekend on a rare foray. Anyone who thinks this country is crowded should be forced to take the train from Leeds to Newcastle. 100 odd miles and barely a settlement to be seen.

Instead you accuse me of wanting to "tarmac over the Peak District". FFS.

The "open market" is having no effect because supply is being deliberately restricted at a time when the population continues to increase. Consequently prices go up. I'm amazed I even have to type that out it's so obvious.

Housing stock in the UK is about 24 million properties, of which about 3/4 of a million are "second homes" Whilst most of those are rented out, around 40% are used only as weekend retreats by their owners, which is around 1% of the total stock, which isn't much, as annoying as most of the people who own them are.

It's a great shame that people end up priced out of now-desirable locations where their families have lived for generations whether that's in Derbyshire, Cumbria, Oxfordshire, or for that matter in the leafier parts of major conurbations and that has happened consistently for 40 years through successive housing bubbles, which are a function of lack of supply. And don't get me started on the mortgage requirements now required following the 2008 crash, or the buy-to-let explosion of the 2000s due to the hollowing out of private pension funds, both piloted by the inept Gordon Brown.

What do you want, rent controls? Because that's a certain way to make sure there's no property available.
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You have said absolutely nothing that helps provide affordable housing for local people in protected areas. You complain that the housing market is being restricted and that "indigenous" families are being driven out - and say that housing developments don't need to be made in sensitive areas.

Those three simply don't add up.

You apparently don't want to see parks concreted over (so presumably support those regs that stop the concrete mixers) but don't offer a way to provide affordable housing within those regs - except go and live between Leeds and Newcastle.

All you've offered is general property gubbins - nothing that is specific to rural social exclusion (and the rising rates of suicide that accompany it). The only answer is more regulation of housing stock to ensure the right stock is built in the right places and ring fenced for the right people (those who contribute to the local community and economy) at affordable prices. The free market has failed and is costing lives.
 
gordoncharles said:
It's got nothing to do with everyone's favourite catch-all bogeyman "capitalism". In fact it's the opposite of capitalism as housing and rental prices are a function of shortages on the supply side, which is a wholly political issue. So put the blame where it belongs, with environmentalists and NIMBYs

Neither those people nor capitalism, however, are to blame for our lack of realistic transfer targets.
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So selling off all the council houses for profit, most of which was gleaned off by individuals, and not building any more...that's a leftie issue?

And that housing shortage isn't down to an unfeasibly high percentage of rental housing being owned by an unfeasibly small percentage of landlords and agencies who are...guess what...only in it to make money and will ramp rents up regardless of how it will affect their tenants (prospective or otherwise)...

And how on earth you think "environmentalists and nimbys" are anything to do with acres upon acres of land being sold to PRIVATE DEVELOPERS instead of being used for SOCIAL HOUSING is beyond me. If you can't see that it"s a problem which has it's roots firmly planted within capitalist structures...then, without wanting to sound rude, I'd honestly question whether you understand the issue enough to comment on it.

What are you basing your comments on, if I may ask? Where are you getting your sources?
 
SheepdipBlade said:
Some very fair points, but you'll find the situation in Clowne and the old pit villages is very different from that in Bakewell, Hathersage that JJBlade was talking about.

What we see in the Peak District villages - and to a lesser degree those villages that border the National Park like Holmesfield, Barlow etc is house prices that are not cheaper than Sheffield - but considerably higher due to their location.

We're not seeing Sheffielders displaced by high city prices moving out, we're seeing wealthy commuters and retirees buying an "escape to the countryside" lifestyle and gentryfying our communities.

These people are killing village after village as living communities. House prices sky rocket, local amenities close as they still shop etc in town, the village social life becomes orientated towards bloody geriatrics and the village football team is full of outsiders as no one is left in the village fit to kick a ball. You can't even chuck a dart in the pub in case it lands in someone's braised camembert.

On a day to day level, these people think they own the bloody place, and are trying to make it some kind of pretend rural idyll. A few weeks back, my dog did a crap on the grass 100yds from home, and I had to go back for a bag. The attitude I got from the dee-dahs who've moved in was something to be seen as are the signs they've since put up. How dare I leave that muck there for all of two minutes!

It's not that they're incomers, it's not that they're wealthy - it's their arrogance - and when they top it off by flying their White Rose flags to say - "look what a success we've made of our life - we can afford to move out to the countryside". That grinds my gears.

So many local people, whose families have been the bedrock of those communities for decades have been driven out and split up by these incomers - and we don't need our noses rubbing in by being told we're not good enough to live in our own village anymore or to have to put up with their f*cking flags.
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Rich people live in nice places while poor folk get moved on.

All symptoms of the same cycle my friend, I think we're actually arguing the same point in a weird way.

The only reason people are getting priced out is because of what you say...rich folk buying houses they want to and can afford to...without any thought for anyone else.

EG - House prices are high in Bakewell. But not as high as London. Tom & Jane live in London and want to buy somewhere nice and rural, and they get more bang for their buck in Bakewell than Hertfordshire. So they move there.

Then, Bob & Susan from Bakewell start to notice more people doing the same. More London influx. Rents start to go up.

So they look at Millhouses. Spending Hathersage money on Sheffield rent. The cycle repeats.

Then the people who have to move out of Millhouses, go to Clowne.

Gentrification, advancement, it's all grim when it's done without considerations for others.

But...shock horror...rich people get what rich people want. Those with less, make way for those with more.

Just saying - you might be barking at the wrong tree by giving it "coming over here waving their flags, shagging arr jobs and drinking arr wimmin" and directing it at Yorkshire folk? On a Sheffield United forum?

Perhaps I don't want you country bumpkin village types from over the border in that there Derbyshire, buying up seats on the south stand that could be taken by people from Heeley, Gleadless and Woodseats? And then, having THE ARROGANCE to post about being able to travel over from Bakewell...ooh we live in the country look at us, we haven't got to look out on endless council flats and face a dramatic level of inner city crime...how dare they rub that in our faces here in S2?

Mental attitude.

FWIW - I'm on your side mate and agree with your sentiment. Just think you're shouting at the wrong set of twats personally.

It's a bit like shouting at a dog who just shat on your lawn...while making polite conversation with the owner, who just told it to shit there. It's not the dog's fault.
 

SheepdipBlade said:
Quite honestly - you don't know what you're talking about.

It should be about housing policy and how political decisions are made to protect vibrant communities. However, politicians have failed to make those decisions (or enable more local bodies to make those decisions) so we have no meaningful rural housing policy or strategy. (The old Section 106 housing supported by Rural Housing Enablers was the closest we got, but it was swept away in the Con/Lib austerity drive)

In this vacuum we have instead the open market - so it's all about capitalism.

The logical extention of your point about environmentalists and nimbys is to blame them for stopping housing developments in rural areas and national parks - presumably housing developments huge enough the reduce local prices to meet rural wages.

Sorry mate - but only the most extreme open marketeer would advocate tarmacking over the Peak District. The nation's most precious landscapes need protecting so we can all enjoy them - but the question is how that protection in socially inclusive.

Right now we have the worst of both worlds. Protection of the landscapes, but open market forces trashing our communities. The communities need the same kind of protection as the landscape - not the landscape needs sacrificing in the name of market driven house prices.
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Just caught up on your replies to other people...you and I are actually way more on the same page than I think either of us realised.

Think I got a bit put out when you started shouting about Yorkshire folk 😉
 
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