The Lundstram Myth...

[Wards]

He was superb yesterday

 

[true99blade]

"Tend to look for it" - or tend to ignore it when you don't want to see it, he's doing it often and its painful that fans think that its not happening.

Every fucker on the pitch will give the ball away at some point. Ironically, Lunny is far better at holding the ball than the golden God Couttsy was. Admit you still find it difficult to admit he’s doing fantastically well this season.

 

[PittsburghBlade]

Every fucker on the pitch will give the ball away at some point. Ironically, Lunny is far better at holding the ball than the golden God Couttsy was. Admit you still find it difficult to admit he’s doing fantastically well this season.

I appreciate that but he gives the ball away under no pressure which isn't acceptable. If you can honestly look at yourself in the mirror and say Lundstram is far better at holding onto the ball than Coutts was then we'll just agree you're wrong and move on.

 

[true99blade]

I appreciate that but he gives the ball away under no pressure which isn't acceptable. If you can honestly look at yourself in the mirror and say Lundstram is far better at holding onto the ball than Coutts was then we'll just agree you're wrong and move on.

You’ve seen the reaction to your original post by everyone have you not?

 

[bornablade]

None of our players are very good actually, but put all 11 (+) together and they are awesome.

Many of our players would be bricking it if they were sold. Put them at another club without our strong ethics running from top to bottom and they'd soon get found out.

They all need each other. We are a totally UNITED unit.

 

[Greasy Chap Butty]

I appreciate that but he gives the ball away under no pressure which isn't acceptable. If you can honestly look at yourself in the mirror and say Lundstram is far better at holding onto the ball than Coutts was then we'll just agree you're wrong and move on.

Seeing as we are on a goal-scoring spree, who would you replace our 2nd highest goalscorer with?

 

[Guesty]

Every fucker on the pitch will give the ball away at some point. Ironically, Lunny is far better at holding the ball than the golden God Couttsy was. Admit you still find it difficult to admit he’s doing fantastically well this season.

Well that's not true. But I agree he's played brilliantly this season.

 

[PittsburghBlade]

You’ve seen the reaction to your original post by everyone have you not?

What's that got to do with Lundstram being able to hold onto the ball better than Coutts? Who's said that and where except you? If Coutts had Lundstram's physical abilities he'd have him cleaning his boots ffs.

None of our players are very good actually, but put all 11 (+) together and they are awesome.

Many of our players would be bricking it if they were sold. Put them at another club without our strong ethics running from top to bottom and they'd soon get found out.

They all need each other. We are a totally UNITED unit.

So that's it, this is the 11 that's going to stay with us for the next 20 years is it? Why can nobody disagree with my OP and its points yet I'm completely wrong for doing so I just don't get it honestly I'm not even saying he's a bad player I've just pointed out that he's the next player who needs to be replaced and there is no direct competition for him. I even said if we brought in direct competition he might lift his game which is exactly what a lot of our players have done.

 

[PittsburghBlade]

Seeing as we are on a goal-scoring spree, who would you replace our 2nd highest goalscorer with?

A midfield three of Hourihane, Fleck, Norwood would give us more goals, just like my post said.

 

[BushBlade]

Amazing some of the responses on here. Not one person has been able to disagree with me based on my reasoning yet I'm completely out of order for criticizing him its baffling and typical of this fashion of fans just going with what's popular to say on twitter or clueless Facebook blayaards

What reasoning? A bunch of ‘he does this twice a game’, ‘he does this three times a game’ followed by ‘if you don’t believe me, watch the games in full’. No, no I’ve got better things to do than watch all our games again in full taking notes on how many times Lunny plays a hospital ball or overplays a switch ball.
If you’re unwilling to even consider that his plus points hugely outweigh his negatives then there’s little point trying to debate it.
If you want to be taken more seriously maybe don’t use a title for your thread that sounds like a shit Robert Ludlum novel and present some evidence that can be verified by others without having to spend 20 hours reviewing old games.

I watched ‘Miked Up’ the other night with Karl Robinson. It briefly covered his recruitment database and the type of information it contained, things like how much running you have to be capable of in a certain position, what your minimum sprint speed should be, things like that. Things that actually matter.

What you’ve done, pick out his faults, could be done for every player.

 

[Houso]

Amazing some of the responses on here. Not one person has been able to disagree with me based on my reasoning yet I'm completely out of order for criticizing him its baffling and typical of this fashion of fans just going with what's popular to say on twitter or clueless Facebook blayaards

Apart from Beans who provided a forensic analysis of why he was excellent yesterday.

 

[PittsburghBlade]

What I find odd is that we’re so prone to focusing on the perceived weak link in our team at a time they’re all doing astonishingly well, without exception.

It’s true we should always look to improve, and I’m sure the management are. But as fans, why are we looking for someone to criticise, and essentially ignoring facts in order to do so?

I even said he was efficient and deserved his place in the team. How the fuck do you think you get better? not replacing anyone? That's how you get stagnant and fail to progress how you could.

 

[ucandomagic]

The OP is a classic example of our observations as defined by the Israeli psychologists who were behind the Moneyball etc factual assessment of people. Human beings form an opinion very quickly and then only look for evidence to support that opinion and tend to ignore evidence that contradicts their ideas. Sports scouts are particularly guilty of this. I have experienced this myself - as early on I felt that Duffy lost the ball too often, and that became all that I saw during a game. Eventually, I went through recordings of 2 whole matches and wrote down each time that he did something well. I was amazed. This is why all of the stats gathering began, initially with baseball but now crucial in our game. The stuff that Beans quotes and Blades Analytic does is the only truly objective view of a player’s contribution. Everybody’s individual view is always subjective and biased. Unfortunately, we’re only human!!

 

[PittsburghBlade]

What reasoning? A bunch of ‘he does this twice a game’, ‘he does this three times a game’ followed by ‘if you don’t believe me, watch the games in full’. No, no I’ve got better things to do than watch all our games again in full taking notes on how many times Lunny plays a hospital ball or overplays a switch ball.
If you’re unwilling to even consider that his plus points hugely outweigh his negatives then there’s little point trying to debate it.
If you want to be taken more seriously maybe don’t use a title for your thread that sounds like a shit Robert Ludlum novel and present some evidence that can be verified by others without having to spend 20 hours reviewing old games.

I watched ‘Miked Up’ the other night with Karl Robinson. It briefly covered his recruitment database and the type of information it contained, things like how much running you have to be capable of in a certain position, what your minimum sprint speed should be, things like that. Things that actually matter.

What you’ve done, pick out his faults, could be done for every player.

Because his rapid progression into someone who is actually capable of playing football in the premier league from someone too slow for the championship is massively overshadowing the consistent mistakes he's making.

If you're not willing to watch games back and see that the points I'm making might actually be true then that's fine don't say I'm wrong.

We can sit here and pick faults with every player if you want but the point I'm making is he's the first player we need to replace or at least bring direct competition in for in attempt to see if he can elevate his game again. Why's that so unreasonable ?

 

[georgebernardshaw]

Fleck, Norwood, Hourihane can easily play in a 3.

Possibly, given that there are three of them...

 

[Akinbiyi]

Out of 50 passes attempted yesterday, 23 were forward, 17 were in attacking third (only Fleck had more), he created 2 chances (joint most with McGoldrick) including the 1 "big chance" of the game that McGoldrick put over - which came off a 60-yard sprint with the ball and then a perfect pass.

Amazing some of the responses on here. Not one person has been able to disagree with me based on my reasoning yet I'm completely out of order for criticizing him its baffling and typical of this fashion of fans just going with what's popular to say on twitter or clueless Facebook blayaards

Me and Swiss did on page 1.

 

[BushBlade]

Because his rapid progression into someone who is actually capable of playing football in the premier league from someone too slow for the championship is massively overshadowing the consistent mistakes he's making.

If you're not willing to watch games back and see that the points I'm making might actually be true then that's fine don't say I'm wrong.

We can sit here and pick faults with every player if you want but the point I'm making is he's the first player we need to replace or at least bring direct competition in for in attempt to see if he can elevate his game again. Why's that so unreasonable ?

I agree with the idea that we should be looking at cover/competition for him. And others.

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

None of our players are very good actually, but put all 11 (+) together and they are awesome.

Many of our players would be bricking it if they were sold. Put them at another club without our strong ethics running from top to bottom and they'd soon get found out.

They all need each other. We are a totally UNITED unit.

What an absolute load of shite.

 

[finlaytheblade]

A midfield three of Hourihane, Fleck, Norwood would give us more goals, just like my post said.

Dont agree and as for Lunnie ! yes he can be improved upon but you could say that about almost all players in the premier league.
Dont understand why you hate Lunnie so much he gives his best every match and improving all the time.

 

[Houston_Blade]

A midfield three of Hourihane, Fleck, Norwood would give us more goals, just like my post said.

Might give the opposition more as well though.

I still think your OP is ultra-critical and we need to retain a balance between squad improvement and the spirit that has got a bunch of shit league 1 cloggers to the PL pretty quickly. Every single position on the pitch could be improved upon without doubt, but at the moment John Lundstram is not someone we should actively be looking to improve upon in my opinion.

 

[PittsburghBlade]

Dont agree and as for Lunnie ! yes he can be improved upon but you could say that about almost all players in the premier league.
Dont understand why you hate Lunnie so much he gives his best every match and improving all the time.

I don't hate him because i criticize him thats completely stupid, I have credited him with massive improvement and said he deserves his place in the team.

I could give my best every match for united and so could everyone else doesn't mean we can't be replaced by better.

 

[Carlton Blade]

None of our players are very good actually, but put all 11 (+) together and they are awesome.

Many of our players would be bricking it if they were sold. Put them at another club without our strong ethics running from top to bottom and they'd soon get found out.

They all need each other. We are a totally UNITED unit.

What are you talking about??? Do you genuinely think Wilder could take any 11 people and make this work? Absolute insanity. These are extremely talented footballers. The system accents their quality, it doesn't create it out of fresh air.

If this isn't a piss take you should just stop going. If it is, find better material

 

[dc_blade]

I don't hate him because i criticize him thats completely stupid, I have credited him with massive improvement and said he deserves his place in the team.

I could give my best every match for united and so could everyone else doesn't mean we can't be replaced by better.

You've posted about almost nothing else this season. Why do you have it in for Lundstram? It's not the facts, as they've been presented to you and you still haven't acknowledged you're wrong. Strange obsession.

 

[true99blade]

What's that got to do with Lundstram being able to hold onto the ball better than Coutts? Who's said that and where except you? If Coutts had Lundstram's physical abilities he'd have him cleaning his boots ffs.

Wasn’t alluding to that, was alluding to you thinking he gives the ball away all the time, which he doesn’t. I see you’re trying to switch this to me thinking Lunny’s keeps hold of it better than Coutts. Irrelevant really but there’s a reason why Lundstram plays for a Premier League team and Coutts a League One team. And it ain’t just “physical abilities”. Lundstram surprises me how well he keeps hold of the ball, I’d say slightly better than Fleck, and Norwood/Coutts (different type of player though in fairness).

 

[Swannyblade]

Lundstram has transformed himself from a deep-lying Norwood wannabe to a box to box type midfielder.
He performs best when playing against teams who attack us. His main strengths now are his engine and his late runs into the box.
Against teams who sit back and invite us on (see Newcastle) a box to box type is less effective. In these games, I would be tempted to give Freeman the nod or at least the last 30mins to open it up with his ball carrying and movement.
There won't be many teams that sit back against us this year, so Lunny should be starting in the majority of games for me.
His improvement this year (especially considering the step up to the Prem Lge) has been a very welcome surprise and this criticism is bizarre.

 

[Carlton Blade]

Lunny is really good at football. He's not the best midfielder in the world. His improvement has been pretty astounding. I really don't know what else needs to be said?

 

[BushBlade]

Because his rapid progression into someone who is actually capable of playing football in the premier league from someone too slow for the championship is massively overshadowing the consistent mistakes he's making.

If you're not willing to watch games back and see that the points I'm making might actually be true then that's fine don't say I'm wrong.

We can sit here and pick faults with every player if you want but the point I'm making is he's the first player we need to replace or at least bring direct competition in for in attempt to see if he can elevate his game again. Why's that so unreasonable ?

Furthermore, I didn’t say you were wrong, I implied the points you make are trivial nit-picking rather than creditable analysis.
And your OP said ‘tin hat on’ so you knew perfectly well you were posting something controversial. Then you post a load of points that can be only verified by literally hours of work and say no one can comment unless they actually do the work.
Your OP wasn’t to initiate debate, it was to assassinate Lunny to stir up a reaction. Or that’s how it comes across.

 

[Greasy Chap Butty]

Amazing some of the responses on here. Not one person has been able to disagree with me based on my reasoning yet I'm completely out of order for criticizing him its baffling and typical of this fashion of fans just going with what's popular to say on twitter or clueless Facebook blayaards

OK, if you know what you're talking about, and everybody else here just copies and pastes Twitter / FB shite, you've got to be right

 

[Sharrow Snuff Mill]

Amazing some of the responses on here. Not one person has been able to disagree with me based on my reasoning yet I'm completely out of order for criticizing him its baffling and typical of this fashion of fans just going with what's popular to say on twitter or clueless Facebook blayaards

No player, not even Messi, is perfect. The fact is that Lunny has played every game for a promoted team currently occupying eighth place in the Premier League.

 

[BushBlade]

Lunny is really good at football. He's not the best midfielder in the world. His improvement has been pretty astounding. I really don't know what else needs to be said?

Not much, apart from that we could actually do with some cover/competition for him at some point. If that had been the sole content of the OP I’d have just agreed with it