Freeman’s downturn

[Bladepicker]

Jesus h Christ above, wing backs are (wait for it...) DEFENDERS NOT MIDFIELDERS. THATS WHY IT’S A BACK 5. For crying out loud.

I’m more than bored of this now.

Wing backs play deeper than wingers but more advanced than the back 3. An actual true rigid look at the formation is probably 3-2-3-2 - however read all the coaching manuals and the media/pundits describing how we or other teams like us play - they will call it 3 5 2.

 

[Eric Cartman]

You said defenders play the wing back role, they clearly don’t. I seriously thought you were taking the piss at first but you seem to be being serious. Image thinking a team as attacking as ours plays 5 at the back

This is literally the last of it now because I’m bored senseless.

Midfielders can play it. Victor Moses did for Chelsea but on the other side they had Marcos Alonso who’s always been a full back. Spurs played it with Danny Rose/Ben Davies and Kieron Tripper/Kyle Walker as wing backs (not wingers) who have always been full backs.

It’s literally a minute difference, I can’t believe it’s taken up 3 pages. But the point still stands that wing backs are defenders hence why I’d class our formation as a FIVE, TWO, ONE, TWO - if we’re being exact. Lord give me strength.

 

[Eric Cartman]

Wing backs play deeper than wingers but more advanced than the back 3. An actual true rigid look at the formation is probably 3-2-3-2 - however read all the coaching manuals and the media/pundits describing how we or other teams like us play - they will call it 3 5 2.

Oh my god

 

[Sean Thornton]

Fuck me do you know how silly you sound? The thread started off about Freeman, with people wondering what’s wrong with him and showing genuine concern. Then we get pages full of shite about who calls it one thing and who calls it another. It doesn’t matter what you fucking call it, it works. It doesn’t matter who wins the argument, it’s an online forum, there’s no trophy at the end.

Please stop ruining threads.

Far better to just speculate then, with general concern obviously, repeating about what’s wrong with Freeman when his apparent inability to last a game out has been a topic for discussion since his return from international duty weeks ago.

No,no trophy. Internet police don’t really exist either.

 

[Sean Thornton]

This is literally the last of it now because I’m bored senseless.

Midfielders can play it. Victor Moses did for Chelsea but on the other side they had Marcos Alonso who’s always been a full back. Spurs played it with Danny Rose/Ben Davies and Kieron Tripper/Kyle Walker as wing backs (not wingers) who have always been full backs.

It’s literally a minute difference, I can’t believe it’s taken up 3 pages. But the point still stands that wing backs are defenders hence why I’d class our formation as a FIVE, TWO, ONE, TWO - if we’re being exact. Lord give me strength.

Ask him for the other half a brain instead.

 

[Eric Cartman]

Ask him for the other half a brain instead.

No it’s okay no need - I’ll ask him why you can’t seem to grasp that a wing back is a defender not a midfielder.

 

[Birdwell Blade]

Far better to just speculate then, with general concern obviously, repeating about what’s wrong with Freeman when his apparent inability to last a game out has been a topic for discussion since his return from international duty weeks ago.

No,no trophy. Internet police don’t really exist either.

Not interested.

 

[Bladepicker]

No it’s okay no need - I’ll ask him why you can’t seem to grasp that a wing back is a defender not a midfielder.

Because nearly the entire footballing media, punditry and coaching world classes the system as 3-5-2.

But Eric says otherwise so OH MY GOD if you don't agree with your alternate view.

You just cannot admit when you may have got something wrong can you?

 

[Sean Thornton]

No it’s okay no need - I’ll ask him why you can’t seem to grasp that a wing back is a defender not a midfielder.

Says the man who cant grasp that everyone but him States our primary formation is 352, where 5 line up in an arch system across the midfield where at least one central midfielder will be lying deeper than both the wingbacks.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Not interested.

Why the rant then? Or the reply?

 

[Eric Cartman]

Because nearly the entire footballing media, punditry and coaching world classes the system as 3-5-2.

But Eric says otherwise so OH MY GOD if you don't agree with your alternate view.

You just cannot admit when you may have got something wrong can you?

Wing backs are defenders.

 

[Eric Cartman]

Says the man who cant grasp that everyone but him States our primary formation is 352, where 5 line up in an arch system across the midfield where at least one central midfielder will be lying deeper than both the wingbacks.

Wing backs are defenders.

Everyone but me... interesting take.

 

[Birdwell Blade]

Plenty saying the same things around us in the South Stand.

On song, Freeman is one of our most effective players; he influences the game. This is not the Freeman we know, however.

He hasn't been right since he came back from his Wales call-up. It's clear as day that this is not a form thing; it's a health and/or fitness issue. It's quite extraordinary that the staff who see him every day at training seemingly can't see anything, which seems to be the case given that they are picking him to play football matches.

Barnet had a break down their left shortly into the second half today - so not even an hour gone - and Freeman who was a couple of yards behind the play literally gave up on it. No attempt to sprint back at all. He all but walked back as if he couldn't even raise a jog. By th time he got back to the 18 yard line, the ball was out of play and the attack over. Freeman bent over on his haunches and all he'd done was walk back from the half-way line.

As I say, this I s not the Freeman we know; the one who bombs from box to box and is almost as likely to pop up in the opposition's six-yard box as our strikers are. It's perplexing.

The thing I find strangest is when he looks like he can’t be bothered to run back. Maybe he’s accepted that he’s not fit enough to do the job CW wants and is giving up on it? It’s a shame whatever it is because when on form he’s an asset to us.

Has CW come out and said anything in any interviews ie. when he dropped him for Baldock? Or was that just down to injury? Can’t remember.

 

[Bladepicker]

Wing backs are defenders.

Everyone but me... interesting take.

Why does everyone in the media refer to it as 3 5 2 then?

I've linked to some examples I could give you thousands more from England's world cup and our last three seasons alone?

If it's so fucking obvious that it is 5 at the back then why does no pundit, coach or football writer seemingly refer to it as such???

Any idea?

 

[Sean Thornton]

“The wing backs should have more goals”


But, but, they’re defenders.......

 

[LJBlade]

This is literally the last of it now because I’m bored senseless.

Midfielders can play it. Victor Moses did for Chelsea but on the other side they had Marcos Alonso who’s always been a full back. Spurs played it with Danny Rose/Ben Davies and Kieron Tripper/Kyle Walker as wing backs (not wingers) who have always been full backs.

It’s literally a minute difference, I can’t believe it’s taken up 3 pages. But the point still stands that wing backs are defenders hence why I’d class our formation as a FIVE, TWO, ONE, TWO - if we’re being exact. Lord give me strength.

I’ll leave it at this, if you ever get the chance ask Wilder if we play 3 at the back or 5, he’ll let you know

 

[LJBlade]

Not interested.

Clearly

 

[Sean Thornton]

The thing I find strangest is when he looks like he can’t be bothered to run back. Maybe he’s accepted that he’s not fit enough to do the job CW wants and is giving up on it? It’s a shame whatever it is because when on form he’s an asset to us.

Has CW come out and said anything in any interviews ie. when he dropped him for Baldock? Or was that just down to injury? Can’t remember.

He seemed to drop of the edge of a cliff after international duty. He was playing well before that but suddenly - seeing him. from the South Stand- he started fading badly after an hour or so, looking knackered. This went on for a few weeks prior to Baldock coming back. It was notable that it seemed to happen very quickly, rather than over a few games.

 

[LJBlade]

Because nearly the entire footballing media, punditry and coaching world classes the system as 3-5-2.

But Eric says otherwise so OH MY GOD if you don't agree with your alternate view.

You just cannot admit when you may have got something wrong can you?

Exactly. Throughout the World Cup England were described as playing 3-5-2 but Eric knows differently...

 

[LJBlade]

Wing backs are defenders.

You’re mixing up the word ‘are’ with ‘can be’. Wing backs can be defenders in defensive minded teams. We aren’t one of them. We are an attacking team, we play 3-5-2, as do most who play our system.

 

[Birdwell Blade]

He seemed to drop of the edge of a cliff after international duty. He was playing well before that but suddenly - seeing him. from the South Stand- he started fading badly after an hour or so, looking knackered. This went on for a few weeks prior to Baldock coming back. It was notable that it seemed to happen very quickly, rather than over a few games.

Yeh I know. I was at all the games where his form declined (remember Derby away was one of them I think). I suppose you never know, he might have a personal issue we don’t know about or something along those lines. However if it was that, and CW wanted to take him out of the limelight for a bit, why stick him in today?

 

[Eric Cartman]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....ands-experimental-phase-gareth-southgate/amp/

So basically regarding England’s World Cup formation in this article it’s referred to a 3-5-2. Yet in the article it says when they’re defending it’s a 5-3-2. Even a 3-1-4-2 when attacking.

England’s formation was the most fluid in the competition. Impossible to pin down to 1 paticular number. And wing backs are I’m afraid classed as defenders. .

But that’s the end of that because I’m bored to tears.

 

[Champagneblade]

I'd say we play 3-4-1-2.

We don't play a flat midfield 3 when Duffy is in there.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Yeh I know. I was at all the games where his form declined (remember Derby away was one of them I think). I suppose you never know, he might have a personal issue we don’t know about or something along those lines. However if it was that, and CW wanted to take him out of the limelight for a bit, why stick him in today?

That last sentence makes a good point. BB.

 

[Eric Cartman]

You’re mixing up the word ‘are’ with ‘can be’. Wing backs can be defenders in defensive minded teams. We aren’t one of them. We are an attacking team, we play 3-5-2, as do most who play our system.

Wing backs are defenders in association football.
Centre backs are defenders in association football. Would you make up a new position for JOC considering he spends a lot of time on the left wing? No. He’s a centre back.

 

[Birdwell Blade]

That last sentence makes a good point. BB.

The more I think about it, the fact he put him in today, and the way he spoke about the players after the game, might indicate that Freeman was one of the players he really wasn’t happy with today. He dropped him for Baldock, but started him today to give him a chance to prove himself, and he didn’t. So maybe it is his attitude. Anyway, now I AM starting to speculate so I’ll shut up and hope someone more knowledgeable adds something.

 

[Sean Thornton]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....ands-experimental-phase-gareth-southgate/amp/

So basically regarding England’s World Cup formation in this article it’s referred to a 3-5-2. Yet in the article it says when they’re defending it’s a 5-3-2. Even a 3-1-4-2 when attacking.

England’s formation was the most fluid in the competition. Impossible to pin down to 1 paticular number. And wing backs are I’m afraid classed as defenders. .

But that’s the end of that because I’m bored to tears.

So if the article stated they played 532 but 352 when they attacked, the primary formation is 352?

It’s becoming clearer.......

 

[Guesty]

Ok, he’s not really struggled much before today. So I don’t know what the ‘again’ refers too. Looked fairly solid before he went out, presumably with an injury.

Today it seems everyone was shit

He struggled mightily against Rotherham. Same thing as today, he looked unfit.

 

[bladesmanluke]

I thought he looked better today than he was before his recent rest, albeit he wasn’t great. He put some quality balls into the box, but looked absolutely fucked after about 70 minutes. Something is not right

 

[AWetFlannel]

3-5-2 and 5-3-2 are the same thing normally, just depends on the team and situation.
Derby away in the 2nd half we looked like a back 5 off the ball. Most games we don't even look like we have 3 at the back on the ball.

I'd also say it tends to be defenders who play as wing backs, but don't want to agree with EC too much after his trollfest this weekend...