Ownership update !

[Blade58]

Yeah but it looks like the Prince is the preferred buyer, it's price (and presumably conditions) which is the stumbling block. It looks like the spiel is "look Abs, the price is this, take it or leave it, and while you're at it you have to sign up to keeping Wilder, no foreign players and no move from BDTBL etc.". The Prince's line will be "now you look Kev, it's £xm and I then do what the fuck I want with it". It all sounds a bit comical to me, It's like the Blades sagas of old.

The Prince isn't the preferred buyer, he's the only buyer and if the future of the club isn't guaranteed then I don't see McCabe letting go and for me, good on McCabe

 

[grafikhaus]

Sadly not all though.

There are plenty on here who want rid of McCabe, in favour of anyone who promises to spunk some moneh.

Be careful what you wish for doesn't even come into it.

Damn right. It's not about 'failing memories', you've just got to look Barnsley-wise to see what a well-dodgy 'foreign owner' can do to fuck a club up to feed his own ego. Kim Wrong 'Un is lucky in that - like his North Korean brother - he's got an army of blank-eyed, unquestioning and gullible believers in S6.

Kev. is not perfect - how many of us are? - but he's a reminder of the good old local businessman who's only got the interests of our club at heart.

Minus: No serious investment to compete with the Parachute teams.Championship mid table is about as good as we can expect

I'm sure QPR, Norwich, Sunderland, Forest etc. would settle for that. Let's not run before we can walk (at this level)

HRH in charge.

Plus: Probably (a bit) more money to improve the team may be able to regularly compete for a play off spot.

Plus, plus: A solid, interested Chairman and a manager who won't be forced out of the door by 'advisors' who are in thrall of 'Jos Wots-His-Name'-type managers.

The Blades - 'Mes que un club'.

 

[UnitedBlade]

If Prince Abdullah doesn't understand SUFC after five years, then I am struggling to think he ever will.

One other point, Sabella popped up on Twitter today, must be 40 years since he played for us, or something like that, and that got me thinking that we have had some decent overseas players in the past. Not saying that CW is wrong to want British and Irish lads, because I see that as being a big part in the team spirit/team bonding, all the lads have a similar shared culture.

Looks like the ownership thing will drag on for a while longer, but I do feel it's best to have KM involved for as long as he can.

Chris isn’t against foreign players, he said so in an interview with ESPN in November. It sounds like he doesn’t like the suggested approach or involvement of van Winckel. That’s a guess on my part but potentially a big problem and dilemma.

The club has said nothing about van Winckel’s role which is appalling, 3 months on. I don’t have a problem with a football man on the Board presumably to sort international scouting but if Wilder and van Winckel don’t work together we have a major problem.

 

[derfblade.3]

On the overseas topic, i don't think we have had that many in our history compared to most other clubs. How many did we have our last premiere league "year"?
As for Kev, well, we know that he want's to leave us in good and safe hands when he eventually departs and we know we can all trust him 100% on that!
He will go nowhere until he has assurances and we should thank him for that.

 

[Pedro's Winger]

Might need more than the Brexit Blades eventually.
Bit daft to believe that a footballer from outside the UK can't muck in like any other.
Being British didn't make Hammond and Wolfy great contributors to the cause.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Did anyone at the meeting ask McCabe why, given these concerns he has, the Prince was brought into the club in the first place?

There’s a complete information void from the Prince’s side to this point (and let’s be honest, since Phipps stepped down) and the ball’s very much in his court to answer some of the concerns McCabe has raised directly. If he were to come out for example and say he wouldn’t entertain the idea of moving from BDTBL, then that would go some way towards some reassurance on that point at least.

The other question is did McCabe suggest this relationship is irreparably damaged, or would it still be possible to resolve if for example the Prince suddenly brought in sponsorship and extra investment within the current set-up?

 

[Sean Thornton]

Yes but that could have been a throwaway remark, we don’t know whether that really meant I’m not selling the club.

No reference at all to potential new investment money concerns me and it’s not surprising Kevin wants to influence how the club maintains its heritage once he sells. But I’m not sure he can do that and get the money he wants to relinquish power. He could maybe introduce any investors he’s spoken to but I don’t sense from what’s been reported he particularly wants to carry on.

His "throwaway" remarks have got him criticism before though. Surely he knew using those words would only be likely to be taken one way? He'll be accused of Beattie Flu again and you can see why.

 

[Davalon]

Muddy waters for me.

A few concerning comments but then again KM says he'd sleep easy if the Prince took over.

Nothing there that clears anything up for me.

I can't fault the Wilder revolution but I do wonder if we really should be more open to looking at foreign players. It's an area that I feel we've lagged behind in and it's going to be difficult to continue progressing on a limited budget and only considering players from these shores.

 

[snootyfenooty]

The Prince isn't the preferred buyer, he's the only buyer and if the future of the club isn't guaranteed then I don't see McCabe letting go and for me, good on McCabe

McCabe will let go though. He's 70 now and old father time will make sure he's not around much longer. His kids have already done a runner so it sounds as though the Prince is the only option open to us. The business deals between him and KM are one thing, nothing you and I do is going to influence anything. Maybe it's time to get behind the Prince, he seems a decent sort and on the face of it his behaviour has been exemplary since he joined us. Better the devil you know and all that.

 

[Blade58]

Chris isn’t against foreign players, he said so in an interview with ESPN in November. It sounds like he doesn’t like the suggested approach or involvement of van Winckel. That’s a guess on my part but potentially a big problem and dilemma.

The club has said nothing about van Winckel’s role which is appalling, 3 months on. I don’t have a problem with a football man on the Board presumably to sort international scouting but if Wilder and van Winckel don’t work together we have a major problem.

My understanding is that CW was uncomfortable with the Prince wanting to bring Van Wynkel onto the SUFC board, hence he was voted down by the board of Directors. Am I right in saying Van Wynkel was then voted onto the other board?

 

[Sean Thornton]

Did anyone at the meeting ask McCabe why, given these concerns he has, the Prince was brought into the club in the first place?

There’s a complete information void from the Prince’s side to this point (and let’s be honest, since Phipps stepped down) and the ball’s very much in his court to answer some of the concerns McCabe has raised directly. If he were to come out for example and say he wouldn’t entertain the idea of moving from BDTBL, then that would go some way towards some reassurance on that point at least.

The other question is did McCabe suggest this relationship is irreparably damaged, or would it still be possible to resolve if for example the Prince suddenly brought in sponsorship and extra investment within the current set-up?

To be fair, this meeting was to provide information to the shareholders of SU Ltd, which owns half of Blades Leisure Ltd. The Prince owns the other half himself so doesn't have to come out and say anything. Giving fans details of any fall out will just fuel speculation. Yes we want the details but now it's gone legal, it'll just be rumour and myth. Remember only two days ago it was reported as fact on here that the Prince didn't know the running costs until a fortnight ago.

 

[Sean Thornton]

My understanding is that CW was uncomfortable with the Prince wanting to bring Van Wynkel onto the SUFC board, hence he was voted down by the board of Directors. Am I right in saying Van Wynkel was then voted onto the other board?

I understand the original role suggested by HRH was DoF.

 

[UnitedBlade]

My understanding is that CW was uncomfortable with the Prince wanting to bring Van Wynkel onto the SUFC board, hence he was voted down by the board of Directors. Am I right in saying Van Wynkel was then voted onto the other board?

No, he’s on both boards Blades Leisure and SUFC. I don’t believe anyone has a vote/veto on Board appointments, I’m sure I read somewhere they provide equal numbers for each owner so it’s entirely up to the Prince who represents him.

 

[Blade58]

McCabe will let go though. He's 70 now and old father time will make sure he's not around much longer. His kids have already done a runner so it sounds as though the Prince is the only option open to us. The business deals between him and KM are one thing, nothing you and I do is going to influence anything. Maybe it's time to get behind the Prince, he seems a decent sort and on the face of it his behaviour has been exemplary since he joined us. Better the devil you know and all that.

I can't tho snooty. The safeguard of the club is paramount. The investment to move us forward is secondary at this current time

I know very little about the Prince, his motives and his intentions to be able to trust him

Football is awash with tragic stories of piss poor take overs, clubs going bust and fans in turmoil. God forbid this ever happens to SUFC

If/when McCabe is happy at some stage to move the club on and is confident it's in safe hands, then I suppose I will be. McCabe looks very much to me like this is not one of those times

 

[cooperblade]

If I was in a position where I wanted to turn public opinion against a potential foreign owner of a football club, I'd drop hints about leaving the ground, I'd say they saw the fans as customers and I'd say they didn't get the culture of the club.

 

[Sean Thornton]

If I was in a position where I wanted to turn public opinion against a potential foreign owner of a football club, I'd drop hints about leaving the ground, I'd say they saw the fans as customers and I'd say they didn't get the culture of the club.

There are some who hate them both already.....

 

[snootyfenooty]

I can't tho snooty. The safeguard of the club is paramount. The investment to move us forward is secondary at this current time

I know very little about the Prince, his motives and his intentions to be able to trust him

Football is awash with tragic stories of piss poor take overs, clubs going bust and fans in turmoil. God forbid this ever happens to SUFC

If/when McCabe is happy at some stage to move the club on and is confident it's in safe hands, then I suppose I will be. McCabe looks very much to me like this is not one of those times

I can't disagree with any of that but the main issue still remains; McCabe is trying to get shut ASAP. The question is therefore who next?

 

[LoughboroBlade]

To be fair, this meeting was to provide information to the shareholders of SU Ltd, which owns half of Blades Leisure Ltd. The Prince owns the other half himself so doesn't have to come out and say anything. Giving fans details of any fall out will just fuel speculation. Yes we want the details but now it's gone legal, it'll just be rumour and myth. Remember only two days ago it was reported as fact on here that the Prince didn't know the running costs until a fortnight ago.

But we are hearing about that already from one party involved. McCabe has very clearly called into questions the Prince’s intentions for the club – I’d suggest it’s in his own interests at this stage to respond to at least some of that.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

If I was in a position where I wanted to turn public opinion against a potential foreign owner of a football club, I'd drop hints about leaving the ground, I'd say they saw the fans as customers and I'd say they didn't get the culture of the club.

Absolutely. It’s a very one-sided commentary we have on this at the minute – hence why I think it would be in the Prince’s interest to say something in response to some of those particular issues raised.

 

[Blade58]

No, he’s on both boards Blades Leisure and SUFC. I don’t believe anyone has a vote/veto on Board appointments, I’m sure I read somewhere they provide equal numbers for each owner so it’s entirely up to the Prince who represents him.

Apologies UB, I spoke to someone over Xmas who is lets say high up at the club, but I was half cut. He told me a few things, some of which stuck. I may have misunderstood what he said, but I remember being told about Van Wynkel being brought in, in a DoF role by the Prince. This apparently wasn't well received by CW and I thought there were some steps taken to protect CW's opinion on the matter. I could be wrong tho

 

[Davalon]

If I was in a position where I wanted to turn public opinion against a potential foreign owner of a football club, I'd drop hints about leaving the ground, I'd say they saw the fans as customers and I'd say they didn't get the culture of the club.

It had crossed my mind

 

[Blade58]

I understand the original role suggested by HRH was DoF.

I'm also sure that's right Sean. What is his official role today because I was told steps were taken to protect CW's view about a DoF role for Van Wynkel?

 

[Sean Thornton]

But we are hearing about that already from one party involved. McCabe has very clearly called into questions the Prince’s intentions for the club – I’d suggest it’s in his own interests at this stage to respond to at least some of that.

He's also said he'd sleep soundly if the Prince takes over. It's all a bit confusing. Let's be honest, whatever the Prince might say, his word won't be good enough for quite a few. Pouring petrol on the fire by either side isn't going to help matters when it comes to Wilders budget for next season. Initially, that - and Wilders future - have to be the main concerns. Who will fund us in this league while the joint owners are legal arm wrestling?

 

[Sean Thornton]

I'm also sure that's right Sean. What is his official role today because I was told steps were taken to protect CW's view about a DoF role for Van Wynkel?

Just an advisor as part of HRH's team I believe.

 

[grafikhaus]

Sounds like a complete shambles - so no change there then. Two owners - neither capable of taking us forward.

I wish people would forget this nonsense about foreign owners = club going forward. Have Wednesday progressed from where they were when Despot Chansiri stepped in (January 2015)? They were ninth in the Championship, now they're 18th. Meanwhile, Watford and Bournemouth were busy getting into the PL. Not every takeover ends like Man. City's.

It is increasingly challenging to get value for money in the domestic market. The maximum sort of fee we can spend brings no guarantees whatsoever. We should use the foreign market at least to supplement what we get from the domestic one.

I think the 'foreign market' is an increasingly busted flush. As the top teams have snaffled up more talent than they will ever use, why not use the loan market. Fulham (five loan players), Forest's top scorer Kieran Dowell (on loan from Everton) etc. etc. These players have been brought through the 'English culture' of the game. Surely better than a promising player from, say Lille?

Only SUFC could conspire to ruin what should be the foundations of a golden future.

Any other club would be sitting down with the manager NOW to go through the plans for next season.

I'm sure mega-monied QPR, Sunderland, foreign-owned Birmingham and by-the-skin-of-their-teeth Wednesday are making plans for next season...

 

[SwissBlade]

Looking at this objectively, the way things have progressed over the last 18 months on and off the pitch we have become an investment opportunity. The Prince and McCabe are fully aware of this and as a result things that were probably on the back burner are now key topics.

The club is in a great position to go forward and whilst the two owners may not agree on everything, they know that the future can be a bright one.

Regarding today, I am not sure that there is a lot of new information, but clarity on things that were perhaps rumours and hearsay before.

McCabe, obviously has been able to tell things from his perspective and we have only heard his side of things. The Star article on the Prince this week has not really helped his side because i feel that the way it was reported by the star was not really well done by Shield.

Again trying to be objective, McCabe has made a lot of mistakes over the years, many which he has admitted and i think Wilder coming in when he did has not only revitalised his interest in the club, something it seemed was waning. Wilder and McCabe have given the club a new vision. As i said to my mate, McCabe of 2018 is a very different one to the McCabe of 2008.

I think the most important factor is that Wilder and McCabe have a plan, currently its working and if there are to be any changes such as international scouting, it has to be an improvement on what we have. We don't do things just because one guy likes the idea.

I think that the Prince and McCabe ownership situation can work, but as long as things stay the way they have been the last 12 months. Use the networks we have, use the people and teams we have and build on them. Know where we are weak, know what we don't know and address those issues. If we do feel the need to exploit foreign markets, then start small and grow those scouting networks naturally.

The current set up allows the manager to be accountable to the owners, but whilst keeping control on recruitment.

The Prince would be wise to enable the current structure to develop, funding this will generate more success than throwing money into international signings.

I would assume that the Prince, having had business success elsewhere, will be headstrong in what he wants, but also smart enough to realise that something is actually working quite well at United.

The last thing the Prince needs is to have a situation where he alienates the fans. McCabe seems to be preventing him going down this route, thankfully. And lets face it, McCabe knows what happens when he gets things wrong!

If the Prince is unsure what the result will be if he throws money in, but dismisses the importance of the clubs identity, he just needs to look around the Football league, particularly the bottom end of this division and also League one. Theres lots of fans there of clubs which used to be in the Premier League.

 

[Harry's Game]

I'm sure mega-monied QPR, Sunderland, foreign-owned Birmingham and by-the-skin-of-their-teeth Wednesday are making plans for next season...

I’m sure they are.

 

[UnitedBlade]

Apologies UB, I spoke to someone over Xmas who is lets say high up at the club, but I was half cut. He told me a few things, some of which stuck. I may have misunderstood what he said, but I remember being told about Van Wynkel being brought in, in a DoF role by the Prince. This apparently wasn't well received by CW and I thought there were some steps taken to protect CW's opinion on the matter. I could be wrong tho

Interesting. They may have originally planned a DoF role which was a direct day to day job which although has Director in the title is a management role. Typically those guys do recruitment and I can see Wilder viewing that as a threat. Maybe the fallback position was to appoint him to the Board.

My annoyance is they have said nothing about his responsibilities and what he’s doing. I would like to think Wilder and van Winckel could at least work together on international scouting. If they can’t we have a problem.

 

[Dongivensmademecry]

As minority shareholders and fans we will not be privy to what's really the situation.... And to that end as HH alluded to it may be time for us as the true custodians of our beloved club to do whatever we can to protect whatever we can until we are sure it's the right way forward ... A protection order on bdtbl mentioned by James Shields recently would be a good starting point , not sure if we still have an independent supporters type committee that is simply not a puppet of the owners ? .. But it may well be worth considering one to ensure we are coordinated in protecting OUR club .
I've just been with my 80 yr old father and we both came out with the same impression of the situation , ultimately money will dictate ... Wouldn't you sleep well with a wad in the bank ? ...Blade or not .......good last question that lady

 

[Rodley]

Sadly not all though.

There are plenty on here who want rid of McCabe, in favour of anyone who promises to spunk some moneh.

Be careful what you wish for doesn't even come into it.

Mostly people who’ve never known another owner apart from McCabe or have forgotten McDonald, Hashimi, Blades Italia, etc.

The JV with the Prince was a means of securing investment without selling out what being a Blade is about and keeping McCabe some form of control. It secured a decent amount of investment, some of it squandered, not huge certainly compared to some of the bigger hitters in the Championship.

The legal issues will be resolved i’m sure. No point panicking about it, unless it pushes your general agenda.

UTB