CONFIRMED Ryan Leonard

[Weasel]

Leave him be. Let him collect his 15k a week and play League 1 football

But as Rootshall has just stated that the 15k a week wage is what some Shrimpers fan is saying is the wage that Utd are allegedly prepared to pay, not his current club.

Therefore if he stays at Southend he probably won't be picking up a £15k a week wage anytime soon.

That said, I don't believe that Utd would be paying him that wage either. I could see him being on about half of that figure though but this is pure speculation on my part.

 

[Blade58]

We have a structure and by my reckoning £15k/week will be the wage we throw at players should we ever make the Prem

It just aint happening at this current time, unless of course our Prince manages to get a few of his buddies on board

What could happen is that the club keep within the wage structure (and so they should) but offer a signing on fee as a sweetener

 

[Weasel]

So for me, at this moment 7 weeks from the window closing, we have bid his value.

Not sure i agree with your final sentence. Currently we have made a bid which is what we perceived would be potentially enough to get his current club to accept.

As it turns out it isn't enough. However there is nothing to say that CW doesn't actually rate the lad at a higher value than what he has already bid. He might value the lad at say £500k but thought after discussions with the players agent that £350k would be enough to get him. Im sure that CW doesnt always go in with his top most valuation as a starting bid.

Maybe what we have already bid is CW's top valuation...or maybe he is prepared to go higher (still within his own valuation figure) but is just seeing if Southend get a bit twitchy first. Who knows. I wouldnt be surprised if Utd go in with a higher 'take it or leave it' offer soon though.

 

[Scooter_mcgavin]

We have a structure and by my reckoning £15k/week will be the wage we throw at players should we ever make the Prem

It just aint happening at this current time, unless of course our Prince manages to get a few of his buddies on board

What could happen is that the club keep within the wage structure (and so they should) but offer a signing on fee as a sweetener

Christ, if we're throwing 15k at players in the prem we're fucked!

We were paying more than that 12 years ago!

 

[Harrisblade]

Maybe the £15K a week is out there as a figure that Southend couldn't match IF Leonard were to sign.
Doesn't have to be true, but even the most diehard Shrimper would have to admit that Southend couldn't match it so if player leaves, it's no blame on the club.

 

[Rootshallbloke]

I think it's very likely that our poster is mistaken or his source is winding him up. He's taken a bit of a spanking from our posters for offering up that little gem. So in conclusion, it's highly unlikely that your club will pay much more than £350k for Lenny, you certainly wouldn't offer £15k a week in wages, we've got no chance of promotion and the Spanish are good at singing Annie's Song.

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

We will have players on more than the figures being quoted here. No way our better players were on 5k a week last season. Maybe some of the squad players were!

I expect a few of our better players were on about 10k a week last season and they will be on more like 15k this season. The structure would have to take us up to that to give us even a hope of signing anyone.

Struggling Championship clubs will be paying players between 15-20k a week on average. Football finance has moved on.

 

[Bergen Blade]

Que?

Blades: Hi there. Us again. We're offering £350,000 for Ryan Leonard. Final offer. That's his worth and we're not paying a penny more. We'd rather keep our money than pay anything more.
Southend: Oh, ffs. This crap has been going on for ages. Oh, very well then, you can have him for that.

* Leonard signs for the Blades

Southend: Hi, Southend here. We'd like to offer £350,001 for Ryan Leonard please.
Blades: MORE than his worth? Hmm, ok, that's fair I suppose. We'll send him back.

*Leonard signs for Southend.

Blades: Ha! Suckers!
Southend: Ha! Suckers!

 

[Ricky]

You're not getting it are you?

We have a budget, Wilder needs a number of players. He has it planned, and that doesn't include using money he HAD planned for another player to pay more than he seems reasonable for another.

Why the desperation?
It's not about affording it's about sticking to a budget. If this kid was so great and worth the extra someone else would have swooped in by now from our level.
So for me, at this moment 7 weeks from the window closing, we have bid his value.

No, I'm not getting it am I, as ever nobody gets it but you and I'm just one of the rest.....

Now you try to get what I'm saying.

We're not spending on Holmes. It's quite likely we won't spend a fee on any other attacking midfielder. If so that leaves us with more left in the budget than planned. I said 100k - that isn't a large amount. It might not even be 50k more than we've always been willing to offer. That won't make a big difference to our budget. Having chased him for months I'd be surprised if Wilder let this one get away over a petty amount - especially as alternatives have gone elsewhere in the meantime.

Put it this way, missing out on Holmes doesn't weaken our bidding position for Leonard does it? See my edit to your post.

Also worth considering the likely Walker sell on fee. It will only strengthen our budget - not that it should lead to us paying way over the odds.

 

[Ernest]

But as Rootshall has just stated that the 15k a week wage is what some Shrimpers fan is saying is the wage that Utd are allegedly prepared to pay, not his current club.

Therefore if he stays at Southend he probably won't be picking up a £15k a week wage anytime soon.

That said, I don't believe that Utd would be paying him that wage either. I could see him being on about half of that figure though but this is pure speculation on my part.

Yes mate, I saw his response after I'd posted mine. If that's the case then fair enough, but like you said, I can't see United paying him that type of money. It's not as though he's a proven Championship midfielder is it?

 

[Th!stledo]

I think it's very likely that our poster is mistaken or his source is winding him up. He's taken a bit of a spanking from our posters for offering up that little gem. So in conclusion, it's highly unlikely that your club will pay much more than £350k for Lenny, you certainly wouldn't offer £15k a week in wages, we've got no chance of promotion and the Spanish are good at singing Annie's Song.

Beginning to wonder if Leonard has got the same agent as Holmes and their looking to screw you over, like they did Charlton.

 

[HarryBassett]

No, I'm not getting it am I, as ever nobody gets it but you and I'm just one of the rest.....

Now you try to get what I'm saying.

We're not spending on Holmes. It's quite likely we won't spend a fee on any other attacking midfielder. If so that leaves us with more left in the budget than planned. I said 100k - that isn't a large amount. It might not even be 50k more than we've always been willing to offer. That won't make a big difference to our budget. Having chased him for months I'd be surprised if Wilder let this one get away over a petty amount - especially as alternatives have gone elsewhere in the meantime.

Put it this way, missing out on Holmes doesn't weaken our bidding position for Leonard does it? See my edit to your post.

Also worth considering the likely Walker sell on fee. It will only strengthen our budget - not that it should lead to us paying way over the odds.

Ricky I'll be surprised if the Leonard one happens.
The way I look at it Wilder will have a budget and a list of players those players will be split into groups.
Stearman will be part of the group that we may have to pay a bit more to get more than Wilder wanted to pay one of the highest earners at the club but knows he improves the 11 did any of us think we would sign a player like Stearman.
To me players like Leonard and Holmes will be in the second catogrey basically this is what I think the players worth this is how much I want to pay him take it or leave it. If Wilder really wanted Holmes and Leonard and they were going to be big players for us next season they would be in Malaga now.

 

[Ricky]

Ricky I'll be surprised if the Leonard one happens.
The way I look at it Wilder will have a budget and a list of players those players will be split into groups.
Stearman will be part of the group that we may have to pay a bit more to get more than Wilder wanted to pay one of the highest earners at the club but knows he improves the 11 did any of us think we would sign a player like Stearman.
To me players like Leonard and Holmes will be in the second catogrey basically this is what I think the players worth this is how much I want to pay him take it or leave it. If Wilder really wanted Holmes and Leonard and they were going to be big players for us next season they would be in Malaga now.

I don't think we'll get Leonard either. These long pursuits are never successful.

I think Wilder really wanted Holmes, he seemed to be his first choice attacking midfield target and we didn't get him. Not sure if he wants Leonard as much but we've prioritised him despite what he'd cost when good alternatives have moved elsewhere on frees or are still available on frees. So I'd say he's very keen on him.

 

[HarryBassett]

I don't think we'll get Leonard either. These long pursuits are never successful.

I think Wilder really wanted Holmes, he seemed to be his first choice attacking midfield target and we didn't get him. Not sure if he wants Leonard as much but we've prioritised him despite what he'd cost when good alternatives have moved elsewhere on frees or are still available on frees. So I'd say he's very keen on him.

Well I don't think he is a priority signing if he was I think he would be with us by now as for Holmes I think the development over the summer of Brookes has put an end to that. I still think there will be a couple of signings along the lines of Stearman one mid and one striker

 

[Roygbiv]

Ricky I'll be surprised if the Leonard one happens.
The way I look at it Wilder will have a budget and a list of players those players will be split into groups.
Stearman will be part of the group that we may have to pay a bit more to get more than Wilder wanted to pay one of the highest earners at the club but knows he improves the 11 did any of us think we would sign a player like Stearman.
To me players like Leonard and Holmes will be in the second catogrey basically this is what I think the players worth this is how much I want to pay him take it or leave it. If Wilder really wanted Holmes and Leonard and they were going to be big players for us next season they would be in Malaga now.

I don't think either Holmes or Leanord would have started for us initially. Our midfield was the strongest part of our team last season and Wilder is naturally going to give them the chance to prove themselves in the Championship. Eventually Leanord and Holmes would have got a chance and may well have cemented themselves as first teamers but they aren't players in positions we are desperate for and both come with a risk as they've never played above League One level unlike Stearman who has proven himself at Championship level.

We may well rue not getting hold of Leanord and he may go for much more money in the future than what we are offering but at this moment in time I don't think he's someone we should be paying above what we think he's worth. There are times where you have to pay over odds to get a player as their presence would be that important to the team (Simon Moore may be a good example as it was clear we desperately needed a keeper) but I don't think Leanord and Holmes are those sort of players as it stands.

 

[Grizzly blade]

Ricky

But you are at it again.
You think he will have this target and that target but you have no idea. You have names you think he should be in for but he isn't.

For all you know, the money he had lined up for Holmes could have been used to get our third choice centre back at the fee we paid.
In other words, Wilder may well have had a similar maximum fee lined up for Stearman...then brooks happened, he realised Holmes was staying put and thought he would ensure he got "his number one target" in stearman.

As for the Walker money....he's not gone anywhere yet. Even if he does move that might not be til the end of August. He can't go spending now in the hope he gets a windfall from Spurs.
Transfers aren't simple. This ain't a computer game where you just input a price and the rest takes care of it.
For a start there's wages...and agent fees. all of which eats into a budget. And lower fees might mean higher wages.
It's that reason Fleck probably turned up...I doubt he will be in peanuts.

It just hacks me off hearing nonsense like that...."well now he isn't signing Holmes (his main attacking midfield target) he can just use that money elsewhere!!"
Bullshit...for all you know him missing out on Holmes might mean he has to spend more money to get his next target in! You have no idea if Holmes was or is his top target. He might have already missed out on his top two, because as we all know many of his transfer dealings are very quiet and enquiries for others will often be left unreported.

Plus...think about this. While he has been "negotiating" with Southend, he has been trying to secure better players to a new contract, namely Coutts. Perhaps sowing the seed in coutts that we have a potential replacement lined up and what his contract will be aids the negotiating position somewhat. Perhaps that's all Leonard was...a back up plan in case Coutts decided he didn't want a new contract.


So there we have it....several other what ifs and maybes that are equally possible than your simple...just offer 100k more.
We stick to the script, we hold our nerve. Get some perspective, he's an average to good league one player at Southend in the last year of his contract, with one other interested club who haven't offered more than us. He may have potential but that's all.

 

[Grizzly blade]

Not sure i agree with your final sentence. Currently we have made a bid which is what we perceived would be potentially enough to get his current club to accept.

As it turns out it isn't enough. However there is nothing to say that CW doesn't actually rate the lad at a higher value than what he has already bid. He might value the lad at say £500k but thought after discussions with the players agent that £350k would be enough to get him. Im sure that CW doesnt always go in with his top most valuation as a starting bid.

Maybe what we have already bid is CW's top valuation...or maybe he is prepared to go higher (still within his own valuation figure) but is just seeing if Southend get a bit twitchy first. Who knows. I wouldnt be surprised if Utd go in with a higher 'take it or leave it' offer soon though.

It isn't enough for them to accept now no.
However in 7 weeks if we are still the highest bidder and have offered no more then it might well be then.
Alternatively, another club might join the fray and offer more before then, we then have to decide if we want to match their offer or outbid.
Until then we stay as we are, it's an area we are NOT weak in so there is no need to rush.

Now...if it were a reserve keeper then fair enough, seeing as we don't have one.

 

[Grizzly blade]

I don't think either Holmes or Leanord would have started for us initially. Our midfield was the strongest part of our team last season and Wilder is naturally going to give them the chance to prove themselves in the Championship. Eventually Leanord and Holmes would have got a chance and may well have cemented themselves as first teamers but they aren't players in positions we are desperate for and both come with a risk as they've never played above League One level unlike Stearman who has proven himself at Championship level.

We may well rue not getting hold of Leanord and he may go for much more money in the future than what we are offering but at this moment in time I don't think he's someone we should be paying above what we think he's worth. There are times where you have to pay over odds to get a player as their presence would be that important to the team (Simon Moore may be a good example as it was clear we desperately needed a keeper) but I don't think Leanord and Holmes are those sort of players as it stands.

Exactly. At the time we needed a keeper and quick. We couldn't fuck about, his value to us was higher and we did what was needed.
Leonard- We are well covered in midfield, he's not a priority. We have offered what we feel is fair for him in his current situation. If that situation changes we may alter our bid, we may not

 

[8lade]

I really don't think Leonard or Holmes were/are priority signings, most of the players we've signed have come out of the blue but these two negotiations have become sagas, I think there was only Clarke which happened in a similar way and as useful as he was he wasn't pivotal to our success. The real signings we only hear about last minute and Wilder threw up a smoke screen in his interview by 'praising' the media for almost always finding out who we wanted to sign, when they rarely do before it appears elsewhere.

 

[Ricky]

For all you know, the money he had lined up for Holmes could have been used to get our third choice centre back at the fee we paid.
In other words, Wilder may well have had a similar maximum fee lined up for Stearman...then brooks happened, he realised Holmes was staying put and thought he would ensure he got "his number one target" in stearman.

That's unlikely though isn't it? The deal for Stearman will have been in progress well before he arrived. There's no way we will have given up on Holmes weeks ago.

You're also suggesting there that Wilder might've paid more than he wanted for Stearman - an important target. The same as I'm suggesting we could do (to the tune of just 100k) with Leonard. Who it seems is also an important target for Wilder. The Coutts thing is another unlikely piece of speculating.

It just hacks me off hearing nonsense like that...."well now he isn't signing Holmes (his main attacking midfield target) he can just use that money elsewhere!!"

Again, you've just suggested we might have done that with Stearman.

I know there are other possible knock on effects but on the surface no Holmes should only put us in a better position to get Leonard.

Bullshit...for all you know him missing out on Holmes might mean he has to spend more money to get his next target in! You have no idea if Holmes was or is his top target. He might have already missed out on his top two, because as we all know many of his transfer dealings are very quiet and enquiries for others will often be left unreported.

Possible, but everything suggests Holmes was his number 1 choice. It's unlikely that we'll spend more than 400/500k on another AMF given Brooks' emergence and the absence of links to any other costly options - others linked are the likes of Reeves (free), Carey (free) and Mackay-Steven (loan).

 

[Grizzly blade]

Ricky
What suggests Holmes was his number one choice??

I would say there is more evidence to suggest he wasn't his top target exists then the opposite considering he didn't go in with the offer to get him at all costs.
Not getting Homes makes no difference to Leonard.
And you say the deal for Stearman was in negotiation a while back....it was mentioned a while back by rods somebody or other, as well as that the problem in the deal for Holmes wasn't money it was age related. More likely Charlton were prepared to offer a longer contract while the money was similar. Again suggests he was hardly his top target.

It's more likely Wilder sees Leonard as a risk, as back up to what we have and therefore won't use his valuable budget to bring in a squad player. If O'Shea had said yes we may well have had no interest in him. So as he expected O'Shea to stay the money found for Leonard may well be already in excess of what he had initially planned.
And Brooks ability to play both wide and centrally may be in his mind too. In other words, Brooks is an unknown quantity. He won't want to block his path to the first team as this will hamper his progress. So bringing in a player with a fee would do just that. Hence why he won't risk chucking more money at a player when he might already have a better player in the club!!

There are loads of considerations...I could go on. All possible, some more than others but all possible. But I'm more than happy to see this one out and thankfully so is the manager.
It was years of caving in and lack of forward planning that created the mess. I keep saying this but it seems some still want to just keep signing players and paying that little bit more than we have to. It's no way to run the business as we found to our cost.

We are doing things right for once, suck it up and wait and see.

 

[Ricky]

What suggests Holmes was his number one choice??

I would say there is more evidence to suggest he wasn't his top target exists then the opposite considering he didn't go in with the offer to get him at all costs.
Not getting Homes makes no difference to Leonard.
And you say the deal for Stearman was in negotiation a while back....it was mentioned a while back by rods somebody or other, as well as that the problem in the deal for Holmes wasn't money it was age related. More likely Charlton were prepared to offer a longer contract while the money was similar. Again suggests he was hardly his top target.

Wilder knows him well, wanted him last summer, he fits the bill perfectly in terms of work rate/quality/productivity and it's been a very public pursuit basically since the end of the season. I think there would've at least been far more talk of other attacking midfielders if we were trying to sign others ahead of Holmes - there are plenty of options out there.

Any reservations about contract length might have been from the club rather than Wilder. Likewise with the fee. Although I'd say offering 400-500k, if that's right, does show a certain level of commitment towards getting him, considering his age.

It's more likely Wilder sees Leonard as a risk, as back up to what we have and therefore won't use his valuable budget to bring in a squad player. If O'Shea had said yes we may well have had no interest in him. So as he expected O'Shea to stay the money found for Leonard may well be already in excess of what he had initially planned.
And Brooks ability to play both wide and centrally may be in his mind too. In other words, Brooks is an unknown quantity. He won't want to block his path to the first team as this will hamper his progress. So bringing in a player with a fee would do just that. Hence why he won't risk chucking more money at a player when he might already have a better player in the club!!

I think Wilder sees Leonard as more than just a squad player. Maybe not a regular starter but an important option which we haven't already got, and someone who'll start a good percentage of games.

Leonard's a completely different type to O'Shea and Brooks. Thank fuck O'Shea rejected the contract btw - he would've reduced our recruitment options quite significantly.


We are doing things better than we have for a long time but I just hope Wilder has the final say on everything.

 

[S64 Blade]

This thread reminds of of Groundhog Day, but without falling in love with a beautiful woman.

 

[HeCanDoMagic]

Wilder knows him well, wanted him last summer, he fits the bill perfectly in terms of work rate/quality/productivity and it's been a very public pursuit basically since the end of the season. I think there would've at least been far more talk of other attacking midfielders if we were trying to sign others ahead of Holmes - there are plenty of options out there.

Any reservations about contract length might have been from the club rather than Wilder. Likewise with the fee. Although I'd say offering 400-500k, if that's right, does show a certain level of commitment towards getting him, considering his age.



I think Wilder sees Leonard as more than just a squad player. Maybe not a regular starter but an important option which we haven't already got, and someone who'll start a good percentage of games.

Leonard's a completely different type to O'Shea and Brooks. Thank fuck O'Shea rejected the contract btw - he would've reduced our recruitment options quite significantly.


We are doing things better than we have for a long time but I just hope Wilder has the final say on everything.

Wilder has already confirmed that Stearman was his number one summer transfer target.

 

[Westran]

Let's just face it, none of us really know what goes on behind the scenes, guess work and speculation is all we've had for page after page after page.

 

[mancunianblade]

I'm pretty sure never stated Stearman was his No1 target he stated the position of CB was, that's how I heard it anyway.

 

[mancunianblade]

Must admit I found it very odd that he named Leonard and Holmes as target and that he had submitted bids, he never does that,he usually jokes about it and says he won't say anything until "he's holding the shirt" (quote) so when he said we had made bids I found it all a bit odd as he set himself up for a fall there.

I very much doubt he will be saying anything publicly again until he sits down with Radio Sheffield to talk about the man who just signed

 

[bertieblade]

Think he had no choice as it was clearly quoted by the selling clubs that we had put in offers

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

Two words.....

MOVE ON

 

[Grizzly blade]

Two words.....

MOVE ON

Two more...

SIT TIGHT!!

or

BID STANDS