Well done Wigan!

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pommpey

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Population: 81.000
Primary sport: Rugby League
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FA Cup Winners 2013, beating last year's Premiership Championis with a simply fucking awesome display of bollocks and refusal to be afraid

Sheffield?

ps Anyone see who was Lid Twat?
 



More major honours in the last 2 hours than the whole of Sheffield football put together over the last 75 years.

Us and Wednesday really are a fucking shambles.
 
Agree well done Wigan. Pretty shaky in the first 5 mins but then held their own. All in all a pretty good cup final to watch. No ex-Blades on show this year.
 
Well that was a refreshing change, just shows what can be achieved by a club with modest support that play football the right way, appoints a footballing manager and has a owner with a little bit of ambition and bollocks.

p.s take note Kevin
 
That now brings a total of 40 clubs who have won a major tropy since United last won one:

2013: Man Utd, Wigan, Swansea
2012: Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool
2011: Birmingham
2008: Spurs, Portsmouth
2005: Arsenal
2002: Blackburn
2004: Middlesbrough
2000: Leicester
1996: Villa
1995: Everton
1992: Leeds
1991: Wednesday
1990: Forest
1988: Luton, Wimbledon
1987: Coventry
1986: Oxford
1985: Norwich
1981: Ipswich
1980: West Ham, Wolves
1976: Southampton
1975: Derby
1973: Sunderland
1972: Stoke
1969: Newcastle
1968: West Brom
1967: QPR
1960: Burnley
1958: Bolton
1953: Blackpool
1947: Charlton
1938: Preston
1927: Cardiff
1926: Huddersfield
 
That now brings a total of 40 clubs who have won a major tropy since United last won one:

2013: Man Utd, Wigan, Swansea
2012: Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool
2011: Birmingham
2008: Spurs, Portsmouth
2005: Arsenal
2002: Blackburn
2004: Middlesbrough
2000: Leicester
1996: Villa
1995: Everton
1992: Leeds
1991: Wednesday
1990: Forest
1988: Luton, Wimbledon
1987: Coventry
1986: Oxford
1985: Norwich
1981: Ipswich
1980: West Ham, Wolves
1976: Southampton
1975: Derby
1973: Sunderland
1972: Stoke
1969: Newcastle
1968: West Brom
1967: QPR
1960: Burnley
1958: Bolton
1953: Blackpool
1947: Charlton
1938: Preston
1927: Cardiff
1926: Huddersfield

We can only take comfort from Notts County. They haven't won owt for 120 years!

:eek::confused:
 
Yup a team who were in a similar situation to ourselves on the last day of our most recent Premiership season one moved forward and won a cup the other one regressed and find themselves scratching around in the third division not even sure if they have bottomed out yet.
 
The difference:
Dave Whelan - footballer
Kevin Mcabe - businessman

McCabe's not really a businessman, though is he? Let's face it, if he'd bought half of Wigan's team on show today, we'd hardly be eating ourselves inside out with anger and frustration would we? To see Espinoza tearing Man City - yes, Man City to bits down the left and McManaman and McArthur playing them off the park (and they did) was heartening. Less heartening to know that Wigan is again, possibly about the same size as Barnsley, give or take. Had we bought them, then we'd be coining it in season after season with television royalties and facing a European campaign next season.

pommpey
 
If we had Wigan's squad and were in Wigan's legue position then the general feeling would still be one of frustration and anger. Probably pointing to the likes of Southampton or Swansea and asking why we can't be more like them. In this day and age with the PL money then the size of the town your are based in is irrelevent, once that TV money goes away then it starts to be significant. If we had beaten Wigan several years ago there is nothing to say they would not be in the same brown smelly stuff that we find ourselves in now.
 
Today Wigan showed the benefit of ingraining a passing style over many years. It's hard to imagine a team which plays long doing what Wigan did in beating Man City. The ball would just keep coming back. I'd suggest that the Stoke side which lost the cup final the other year was better, man-for-man, than Wigan's this year.

One day we might see United play a big game with the courage to do the difficult things, knowing that they're the right things.
 
McCabe's not really a businessman, though is he? Let's face it, if he'd bought half of Wigan's team on show today, we'd hardly be eating ourselves inside out with anger and frustration would we? To see Espinoza tearing Man City - yes, Man City to bits down the left and McManaman and McArthur playing them off the park (and they did) was heartening. Less heartening to know that Wigan is again, possibly about the same size as Barnsley, give or take. Had we bought them, then we'd be coining it in season after season with television royalties and facing a European campaign next season.

pommpey

Sure I heard them say this was the first season Wigan have made a profit whilst in the Prem so hardly coining it in.
 
If we had Wigan's squad and were in Wigan's legue position then the general feeling would still be one of frustration and anger. Probably pointing to the likes of Southampton or Swansea and asking why we can't be more like them. In this day and age with the PL money then the size of the town your are based in is irrelevent, once that TV money goes away then it starts to be significant. If we had beaten Wigan several years ago there is nothing to say they would not be in the same brown smelly stuff that we find ourselves in now.

I'm sure we'd all be suggesting how the team could play better, which player is the weak link but anger?

I'm also sure we'd all be pleased to see us bungy jumping between the top two divisions.
 



Sure I heard them say this was the first season Wigan have made a profit whilst in the Prem so hardly coining it in.

That's because you need a wage bill of £40mill to come fourth bottom, roughly what the tv money is. Wigan don't have the opportunity to make much more on top. I'd like to think we could, not much more, but we could. But we'd spunk it all on wages and the crowd would hate the players for being shit on £25k per week rather than £5k per week.

Slowly but surely I'm losing interest due to the huge figures in the game, 90% of which go on players wages rather than creating better clubs. I'm chuffed for Wigan today because it shows there is still a chance for an underdog. It'll be back to a final between the top five again next year no doubt.
 
That's because you need a wage bill of £40mill to come fourth bottom, roughly what the tv money is. Wigan don't have the opportunity to make much more on top. I'd like to think we could, not much more, but we could. But we'd spunk it all on wages and the crowd would hate the players for being shit on £25k per week rather than £5k per week.

Slowly but surely I'm losing interest due to the huge figures in the game, 90% of which go on players wages rather than creating better clubs. I'm chuffed for Wigan today because it shows there is still a chance for an underdog. It'll be back to a final between the top five again next year no doubt.

Don't be too sure, remember Bradford made the Leauge Cup final as well.
Football probally thought SUFC were going to win everything around 1900 and that we'd dominate things the next century?

Still waiting.
 
That's because you need a wage bill of £40mill to come fourth bottom, roughly what the tv money is. Wigan don't have the opportunity to make much more on top. I'd like to think we could, not much more, but we could. But we'd spunk it all on wages and the crowd would hate the players for being shit on £25k per week rather than £5k per week.

Slowly but surely I'm losing interest due to the huge figures in the game, 90% of which go on players wages rather than creating better clubs. I'm chuffed for Wigan today because it shows there is still a chance for an underdog. It'll be back to a final between the top five again next year no doubt.

All true, diplomat. Despite the massive hype about getting to the PL being worth £X Squillion, to survive, all that - and more - will be spent on wages and agents' fees 'in order to compete'. But compete at what? The top four have it all sewn up, a few teams will briefly give the illusion that 'they may break into the top four' (Spurs, Everton). But they won't. Ever.

The middling teams will produce sterile dross just to remain in the 'Promised Land' (Stoke, Sunderland). And the rest are in a permanent relegation battle. Plus, teams who have recently 'broken into the top flight' by playing attractive football get reeled in and will soon end up back where they belong (Norwich, Southampton, Swansea).

Another thing that suggests it's all a big fake are good teams who sell their players to the top teams. Recently we've seen Athletic Bilbao, Braga, Dortmund (and soon Basel) who have built terrific teams, got their long suffering fans all excited and promptly break the team up by selling their best players. Oh, I know we get the usual 'We couldn't stand in their way' bollocks. But it's hardly a sustainable business model, is it? Just look at United post-2009.

Finally (honest!) what a lot of people forget is the number of great players Wigan have sold recently - Moses, Palios, Rodallega etc. The difference is, they've obviously got a superb scouting network, especially in South America. Espinoza (my MOM yesterday) shows that you can get away with selling, as long as you keep that conveyor belt going.
 
Well done Wigan ,dont know who got lid twat but Espinosa got '
201305111449533834962-p2.jpg
looking like the cowardly lion in wizard of Oz twat '. Put em up :)
 
If Wigan go down this season and Martinez inevitably leaves, I can see them spiralling back down the divisions, particularly if Whelan jumps ship. He would no doubt go for it next season to try and get them straight back up but if that failed, that could be it for them.
 
All true, diplomat. Despite the massive hype about getting to the PL being worth £X Squillion, to survive, all that - and more - will be spent on wages and agents' fees 'in order to compete'. But compete at what? The top four have it all sewn up, a few teams will briefly give the illusion that 'they may break into the top four' (Spurs, Everton). But they won't. Ever.

The middling teams will produce sterile dross just to remain in the 'Promised Land' (Stoke, Sunderland). And the rest are in a permanent relegation battle. Plus, teams who have recently 'broken into the top flight' by playing attractive football get reeled in and will soon end up back where they belong (Norwich, Southampton, Swansea).

Another thing that suggests it's all a big fake are good teams who sell their players to the top teams. Recently we've seen Athletic Bilbao, Braga, Dortmund (and soon Basel) who have built terrific teams, got their long suffering fans all excited and promptly break the team up by selling their best players. Oh, I know we get the usual 'We couldn't stand in their way' bollocks. But it's hardly a sustainable business model, is it? Just look at United post-2009.

Finally (honest!) what a lot of people forget is the number of great players Wigan have sold recently - Moses, Palios, Rodallega etc. The difference is, they've obviously got a superb scouting network, especially in South America. Espinoza (my MOM yesterday) shows that you can get away with selling, as long as you keep that conveyor belt going.


I agree, it's miles better watching cleft footed artisans grinding out nil-nil in front of a half empty, narcoleptic stadium.

And we've Gillingham next season too....
 
If we had Wigan's squad and were in Wigan's legue position then the general feeling would still be one of frustration and anger. Probably pointing to the likes of Southampton or Swansea and asking why we can't be more like them. In this day and age with the PL money then the size of the town your are based in is irrelevent, once that TV money goes away then it starts to be significant. If we had beaten Wigan several years ago there is nothing to say they would not be in the same brown smelly stuff that we find ourselves in now.


But we didn't win that game, and in the last 35 years we have made a bit of a habit of losing the crunch games. I don't think many other clubs have messed up important games to the extent that we have.
 
But we didn't win that game, and in the last 35 years we have made a bit of a habit of losing the crunch games. I don't think many other clubs have messed up important games to the extent that we have.

I was thinking about that watching the final yesterday. Over the last 20 years, we have been involved in 12 "crunch" games or series of games - 6 play offs, 3 FA cup semi finals, 1 league cup semi final and the 2 relegation deciders in 1994 and 2007. We have failed in all of them.

We can also perhaps add seasons 1994-95, 1998-99, 2003-04 and 2004-05 when we had a good chance of getting into the play offs as the last few games of the season came up and we messed up. In that 20 years we have never managed a late run to get in the play offs against the odds - we have either just missed out on automatic (2009 and 2012), been favourites for the play offs all season but never looked realistically like getting automatic in the latter part of the season (1997 and 2003) or stumbled into the play offs narrowly having looked like certs for them all season (1998 and 2013)

On the credit side of the ledger,we can put the 3 wins at the end of the seaon in 1993 to guarantee safety and the getting our act together after a poor run in the last few games of 2006 to get promotion.

So, in total we can give 16 examples over the last 20 years of where we messed up when the pressure was on:

6 play off defeats
4 failures to make the play offs
4 semi-final defeats
2 relegation decider defeats

( you can potentially add in the Palace game in 2009 and the Stevenage game in 2012 when we failed to get the resul we needed to give us the best chance of automatic though, of course, in the former case it would not have made a difference in the end).

compared to 2 definite examples when we didn't mess up (1993 and 2006) and 2 more dubious examples where we did just enough to avoid messing up (1998 and 2013 play off qualifications).

No wonder we are all so miserable....
 
I was thinking about that watching the final yesterday. Over the last 20 years, we have been involved in 12 "crunch" games or series of games - 6 play offs, 3 FA cup semi finals, 1 league cup semi final and the 2 relegation deciders in 1994 and 2007. We have failed in all of them.

We can also perhaps add seasons 1994-95, 1998-99, 2003-04 and 2004-05 when we had a good chance of getting into the play offs as the last few games of the season came up and we messed up. In that 20 years we have never managed a late run to get in the play offs against the odds - we have either just missed out on automatic (2009 and 2012), been favourites for the play offs all season but never looked realistically like getting automatic in the latter part of the season (1997 and 2003) or stumbled into the play offs narrowly having looked like certs for them all season (1998 and 2013)

On the credit side of the ledger,we can put the 3 wins at the end of the seaon in 1993 to guarantee safety and the getting our act together after a poor run in the last few games of 2006 to get promotion.

So, in total we can give 16 examples over the last 20 years of where we messed up when the pressure was on:

6 play off defeats
4 failures to make the play offs
4 semi-final defeats
2 relegation decider defeats

( you can potentially add in the Palace game in 2009 and the Stevenage game in 2012 when we failed to get the resul we needed to give us the best chance of automatic though, of course, in the former case it would not have made a difference in the end).

compared to 2 definite examples when we didn't mess up (1993 and 2006) and 2 more dubious examples where we did just enough to avoid messing up (1998 and 2013 play off qualifications).

No wonder we are all so miserable....
Weren't we also 10 points above the relegation zone after we beat Spurs at home in the Prem relegation season? I seem to think that was in April aswell.
 
Weren't we also 10 points above the relegation zone after we beat Spurs at home in the Prem relegation season? I seem to think that was in April aswell.

We were 10 points above relegation after we beat Spurs, but that was on 10 Feb. At the time though, people were saying that gap would inevitably be eroded as we had a hard run of games coming up - Liverpool A, Everton H, Chelsea A and Bolton A were our next four. As expected, we only got 1 point from those games and the gap had dissolved to 1 point by the time we met Newcastle at the Lane on 7th April. Losing that game really put us in the shit, but the follwing 4 games - a 3-0 home win over WHU, a good performance in the 0-2 defeat at Man Utd, a battling draw at Charlton and a 1-0 home win over Watford, made us all think we would do it - I think the bookies were giving odds at around 10-1 against us being relegated at that point....
 
Just seen the goal, its the type of goal that you want to win a cup final. Cracking header in the pouring rain

Although why the final is at 5:15 is beyond me

Wasn't Ben Watson the lad that put a flying kick on a Man City player a few years ago? I'm sure I remember something
 



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