Defending set pieces

[metalblade]

I have noticed we always pull back every player to defend free kicks and corners. This happened with Wilder last season, Sellés had the same tactics too and now we are back with Wilder again cramming every player into the penalty box. Why do we not leave a player on the halfway line like every team did in the past?
I don't have any coaching badges but I can't understand the advantage of all the team being in the penalty box. To me the defending team will always have a numbers advantage because the goal keeper never comes forward for corners unless it is last minute desperation, teams always leave a man on halfway in case of a break away and they also need a man to take the corner kick.
So with the defending team pulling everyone back they have an eleven to eight advantage in the penalty area. If the defending team leave a player on the halfway line the attacking team will usually have two players marking him in case of a break away, this give the defending team a ten against seven advantage in the penalty area.
8 against 11 equals a 1.375 to 1 man advantage, 7 against 10 equals a 1.428 to 1 man advantage so clearly slightly better odds of clearing the ball away from goal. The other advantage of having a player on halfway line when defending is there is a possible out ball to chase with everyone back when the ball is cleared it gives the ball away and it is just recycled back into the danger area. I don't get this tactic, am I missing something?

 

[Houston_Blade]

It’s when we have an attacking set piece that we should just get the other 10 men back in our half for. It would save the inevitable counter attack when we lob a shit ball into the box ever coming to anything.

 

[LBA_Blade]

Most set pieces these days are poor at best, we could easily man mark and have Hamer around 30 yards in from halfway and Ogbene just beyond him near half way ready for the counter/forcing players back. Mee is excellent at simple defending which sometimes seems harsh to say that but its surprising how many players can't get the basics right. He is going to help us massively as shown on Saturday at the back in building a solid base

 

[Edgar Allan Poo]

You always have your best defenders back so why not leave your fastest runner upfield? Don't let the opposition dictate the play.

 

[Uganda Blade]

I have noticed we always pull back every player to defend free kicks and corners. This happened with Wilder last season, Sellés had the same tactics too and now we are back with Wilder again cramming every player into the penalty box. Why do we not leave a player on the halfway line like every team did in the past?
I don't have any coaching badges but I can't understand the advantage of all the team being in the penalty box. To me the defending team will always have a numbers advantage because the goal keeper never comes forward for corners unless it is last minute desperation, teams always leave a man on halfway in case of a break away and they also need a man to take the corner kick.
So with the defending team pulling everyone back they have an eleven to eight advantage in the penalty area. If the defending team leave a player on the halfway line the attacking team will usually have two players marking him in case of a break away, this give the defending team a ten against seven advantage in the penalty area.
8 against 11 equals a 1.375 to 1 man advantage, 7 against 10 equals a 1.428 to 1 man advantage so clearly slightly better odds of clearing the ball away from goal. The other advantage of having a player on halfway line when defending is there is a possible out ball to chase with everyone back when the ball is cleared it gives the ball away and it is just recycled back into the danger area. I don't get this tactic, am I missing something?

Maybe desperate not to concede?
Hopefully as we start to improve, we'll see less of this

 

[Snowflake]

Maybe desperate not to concede?
Hopefully as we start to improve, we'll see less of this

Not judging by last season. We rarely had anyone upfield when defending corners.

 

[Snowflake]

I have noticed we always pull back every player to defend free kicks and corners. This happened with Wilder last season, Sellés had the same tactics too and now we are back with Wilder again cramming every player into the penalty box. Why do we not leave a player on the halfway line like every team did in the past?
I don't have any coaching badges but I can't understand the advantage of all the team being in the penalty box. To me the defending team will always have a numbers advantage because the goal keeper never comes forward for corners unless it is last minute desperation, teams always leave a man on halfway in case of a break away and they also need a man to take the corner kick.
So with the defending team pulling everyone back they have an eleven to eight advantage in the penalty area. If the defending team leave a player on the halfway line the attacking team will usually have two players marking him in case of a break away, this give the defending team a ten against seven advantage in the penalty area.
8 against 11 equals a 1.375 to 1 man advantage, 7 against 10 equals a 1.428 to 1 man advantage so clearly slightly better odds of clearing the ball away from goal. The other advantage of having a player on halfway line when defending is there is a possible out ball to chase with everyone back when the ball is cleared it gives the ball away and it is just recycled back into the danger area. I don't get this tactic, am I missing something?

I agree entirely. I have never understood why we can’t have one upfield.

 

[Pedro Verde]

Was saying this Saturday. Weve not done it for a while. It seems most teams bring everyone back even the likes of Arsenal. I say be brave and leave three up see what the opposition do about that

 

[Geordie Blade]

Quite simply, the more crowded the penalty area, the harder it is to score a goal (the statistics back this up). It's also a myth that leaving one player up front "takes two of the opposition out of the box". They already leave at least one back, and will only need to drop one extra back.

Metalblade is right about the percentage advantage improving if you leave players forward. But that's just in theory and only counts the % chance of a player winning a header - not the chance of a goal (a crowded area makes it harder to get a clean header, and more likely to get blocked). The change of scoring with 7 vs 10 is higher than the chances of scoring with 8 vs 11.

 

[Balham]

I understood it on Saturday to an extent, same as I understood why we dropped to a flat back 5 for the 10 minutes after we scored. We'd lost every other game this season and hadn't scored in six weeks. Getting the three points was vital. I'd hope that we'll see a more expansive approach as the confidence returns.

 

[Snowflake]

Quite simply, the more crowded the penalty area, the harder it is to score a goal (the statistics back this up). It's also a myth that leaving one player up front "takes two of the opposition out of the box". They already leave at least one back, and will only need to drop one extra back.

Metalblade is right about the percentage advantage improving if you leave players forward. But that's just in theory and only counts the % chance of a player winning a header - not the chance of a goal (a crowded area makes it harder to get a clean header, and more likely to get blocked). The change of scoring with 7 vs 10 is higher than the chances of scoring with 8 vs 11.

That depends on how well each players does his job.

 

[Iffy Onuora's Shiny Head]

Ferguson was one of the first to do this as he knew his attackers were very quick so could maximise their pace over a long distance. They scored a lot of goals from van der saar claiming the ball from a corner and then throwing it to the likes of Rooney/Ronaldo/Nani and scoring.

 

[FriethBlade]

We were saying exactly the same thing at Oxford. It just guarantees that the ball comes straight back at us.

Why not leave OHare up front as he won't win anything in the air and it means they have to leave one more man back than they otherwise would

 

[Rufus Smalls]

Most set pieces these days are poor at best, we could easily man mark and have Hamer around 30 yards in from halfway and Ogbene just beyond him near half way ready for the counter/forcing players back. Mee is excellent at simple defending which sometimes seems harsh to say that but its surprising how many players can't get the basics right. He is going to help us massively as shown on Saturday at the back in building a solid base

This always confuses me.

Defending teams pack the box at corners so inviting the whole of the attacking team to also pack the box. Leaving 2 forward at defending corners would mean their team having to keep at least 3 back so making defending corners much simpler.

 

[jono_t2000]

Great defending that corner

 

[bonobo]

Also attacking set pieces is a bit of a problem.

 

[MTBlade]

I am starting to think that with having everyone back, players aren't taking any responsibility anymore.

Most players come back to stand in a zone, with very few players actually responsible for marking/stopping players scoring.

As for our set pieces, put someone tall on the front post and the other 9 players can get ready out of the area, to attack us with a break away