Blades’ “Stoppers like wingers” make front page of Corriere dello Sport

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"And here Sheffield United relies on the Norwood and Lundstram medians, as well as the midfield midfielder Baldock"

Never mind overlapping centre backs, we've got midfield midfielders now
 



Sheffsteel said:
Aldo all the reports are praising Wilder and his revolutionary system, when I believe it’s Alan Knill that is the brains behind this system.
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This reminds me a lot of how some fans said Blackwell was the real brains behind Warnock and then Speed was the real brains behind Blackwell and then Calver was the real brains behind Speed.

I saw an interview on Sheffield live with Knill and he said after those first 4 winless games he said to Wilder that it wasn’t working and we should change it. But Wilder wanted to stick with it

As to who invented it...I don’t think we know but good ideas are rarely the product of one person, it’s usually a combination of things and people. So I’m going to credit Wilder and Knill for this I reckon.
 
rompodebailey said:
If they are marked they can still be searched by airways, given that with their tonnage (190 and 193 centimeters respectively) they win almost all high duels against fullbacks and wings.

How do you beat a quote like that?:)
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Like a Bielsa touchline shout, perhaps one that even Jansson might understand.......
 
It's becoming a bit of a cliché about us but in reality we haven't really done that much of it (at least in the Palace game I saw) and we've played far more conservatively.
Which is sensible management from Wilder.
 
Pedro's Winger said:
It's becoming a bit of a cliché about us but in reality we haven't really done that much of it (at least in the Palace game I saw) and we've played far more conservatively.
Which is sensible management from Wilder.
Click to expand...
I agree, but at this point the cat is out of the bag, so let lazy people focus on that and not all of the other good things that are going on and don't focus on what is supporting it and why our defence is so good.
 
Cerberus Blade said:
This reminds me a lot of how some fans said Blackwell was the real brains behind Warnock and then Speed was the real brains behind Blackwell and then Calver was the real brains behind Speed.

I saw an interview on Sheffield live with Knill and he said after those first 4 winless games he said to Wilder that it wasn’t working and we should change it. But Wilder wanted to stick with it

As to who invented it...I don’t think we know but good ideas are rarely the product of one person, it’s usually a combination of things and people. So I’m going to credit Wilder and Knill for this I reckon.
Click to expand...

Think your recollection is off. We played an old-school 4-4-2 for the first five games in the League One campaign under Wilder.

First three games (Bolton 1-0 United, United 1-1 Rochdale, United 0-3 Southend) we had an unchanged defence: Brayford Wilson O'Connell Hussey
Millwall 2-1 United saw Freeman in for Brayford then the 2-1 win over Oxford saw Wright replace O'Connell who'd given away the last minute penalty against Millwall.

It was against Gillingham in our sixth game that we debuted the now-default 3-4-1-2 with Wilson, Wight and O'Connell as the back three. A last minute Sharp winner from the penalty spot got us what out performance deserved and we haven't looked back since.
 
Balham Blade said:
Think your recollection is off. We played an old-school 4-4-2 for the first five games in the League One campaign under Wilder.

First three games (Bolton 1-0 United, United 1-1 Rochdale, United 0-3 Southend) we had an unchanged defence: Brayford Wilson O'Connell Hussey
Millwall 2-1 United saw Freeman in for Brayford then the 2-1 win over Oxford saw Wright replace O'Connell who'd given away the last minute penalty against Millwall.

It was against Gillingham in our sixth game that we debuted the now-default 3-4-1-2 with Wilson, Wight and O'Connell as the back three. A last minute Sharp winner from the penalty spot got us what out performance deserved and we haven't looked back since.
Click to expand...

I'd describe Wilder's starting formation as 4-2-3-1, which was what he played at Northampton. Clarke looked out of sorts, being asked to link play behind Sharp. Duffy was a wide man and Done struggled to get on the score sheet. Basham and Fleck didn't dictate play as required. The following changes were key:

  • Formation change, to 3-5-2
  • Brayford sold, replaced by Freeman
  • Hussey dropped, replaced by Lafferty
  • Coutts (originally transfer listed, giving him the kick up his backside that he needed) introduced to midfield alongside Fleck
  • Duffy moved into the no 10 role
  • Basham moved from midfield to defence
  • Jake Wright brought in to the centre of defence
  • Clarke (or Sharp) had to be dropped. Done did a better job supporting Sharp, although his main contribution was work rate, not goals/assists
  • The overlapping of the centre halves happened a bit later
 
BushBlade said:
That’s probably the best analysis of our system I’ve read. If you can get your head round the phrasing, it makes a lot of sense, particularly the bit about how having big lads going forward means we increase our physical prowess and have nippy, quick thinking players to defend against the counter. When they put it like that, it makes perfect sense.
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I don't think anything was lost in translation, rather the explanation was enhanced by Italian verve and passion. Wilder has some Italian blood in him obviously. ;)
 



Cerberus Blade said:
This reminds me a lot of how some fans said Blackwell was the real brains behind Warnock and then Speed was the real brains behind Blackwell and then Calver was the real brains behind Speed.

I saw an interview on Sheffield live with Knill and he said after those first 4 winless games he said to Wilder that it wasn’t working and we should change it. But Wilder wanted to stick with it

As to who invented it...I don’t think we know but good ideas are rarely the product of one person, it’s usually a combination of things and people. So I’m going to credit Wilder and Knill for this I reckon.
Click to expand...

We were using at school in lunchtime games back in '74.
Never once thought it would catch on.
 
Pedro's Winger said:
It's becoming a bit of a cliché about us but in reality we haven't really done that much of it (at least in the Palace game I saw) and we've played far more conservatively.
Which is sensible management from Wilder.
Click to expand...
We may not have been quite so attack minded with centre halves this season but there were plenty of times when JOC and Bash did get forward. Our goal came from JOC getting forward and creating an overload on the left. Great cut inside by LF and the cross. It was noticeable that when their keeper could only palm the ball out there were no Palace defenders there to clear it. The reason? They had all been dragged over to their right hand side to deal with the overload. That left space in the centre which meant Lunny had a pretty much open goal to shoot into.
UTB
 
jt64 said:
"And here Sheffield United relies on the Norwood and Lundstram medians, as well as the midfield midfielder Baldock"

Never mind overlapping centre backs, we've got midfield midfielders now
Click to expand...
False wing back
 
Bergen Blade said:
I'd describe Wilder's starting formation as 4-2-3-1, which was what he played at Northampton. Clarke looked out of sorts, being asked to link play behind Sharp. Duffy was a wide man and Done struggled to get on the score sheet. Basham and Fleck didn't dictate play as required. The following changes were key:

  • Formation change, to 3-5-2
  • Brayford sold, replaced by Freeman
  • Hussey dropped, replaced by Lafferty
  • Coutts (originally transfer listed, giving him the kick up his backside that he needed) introduced to midfield alongside Fleck
  • Duffy moved into the no 10 role
  • Basham moved from midfield to defence
  • Jake Wright brought in to the centre of defence
  • Clarke (or Sharp) had to be dropped. Done did a better job supporting Sharp, although his main contribution was work rate, not goals/assists
  • The overlapping of the centre halves happened a bit later
Click to expand...

“The overlapping of the centre halves happened a bit later”

This point is key and often overlooked. It’s not like we went overnight from a winless team to one that other teams tried to stifle with a ten man defence.

If I had to put a date for the necessity and start of overlapping centre backs, I would say 4-0 v Port Vale at home (15/10/16) after a frustrating 1-1 draw with Fleetwood.

I remember thinking the first time it happened. “Where’s Basham going, has he forgotten where he’s playing”? Then after a few more forays on both sides it became obvious it was a deliberate new tactic.

For opposing defenders and coaches it must have been the equivalent of a caveman seeing a wheeled cart for the first time.

I remember Duffy saying that the opposition used to be looking at each other saying “Who was meant to be marking him?” and “Where are they all coming from?”
 
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