Well, the accounts are out....

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bromtom said:
Maybe Egan? There were rumours he didn't cost the £4m at time of sale, but will if conditions are met.

Maybe a promotion payment for Norwood too if we manage it.
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“30. Signing on and transfer fees payable
Commitments in respect of deferred signing-on fees due to players under contract at the year end and not provided in the Financial Statements amounted to £759,029 (2017: £273,333). Such fees are charged to the Consolidated Statement of Comprehensive Income in the period in which there is an obligation.
Under the terms of certain contracts with other football clubs in respect of player transfers, certain additional amounts would be payable by the Company if conditions as to future team selection or performance are met. The maximum that could be repayable is £6,172,184 (2017: £525,000).

This amount is not provided in the Financial Statement as it is not expected to be payable.”

 

Trafford said:
Interesting that there are deferred transfer fees payable of £760k and the possibility of having to pay out a further £6.2m ‘if conditions as to future team selection or performance are met’. Can’t imagine who that could be for!
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Promotion bonus ?
 
Sean Thornton said:
“30. Signing on and transfer fees payable
Commitments in respect of deferred signing-on fees due to players under contract at the year end and not provided in the Financial Statements amounted to £759,029 (2017: £273,333). Such fees are charged to the Consolidated Statement of Comprehensive Income in the period in which there is an obligation.
Under the terms of certain contracts with other football clubs in respect of player transfers, certain additional amounts would be payable by the Company if conditions as to future team selection or performance are met. The maximum that could be repayable is £6,172,184 (2017: £525,000).

This amount is not provided in the Financial Statement as it is not expected to be payable.”
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I don't know why that should worry me, but it does.
 
Trafford said:
Interesting that there are deferred transfer fees payable of £760k and the possibility of having to pay out a further £6.2m ‘if conditions as to future team selection or performance are met’. Can’t imagine who that could be for!
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Woodburn?
 
Sean Thornton said:
It’s called a Post balance sheet event and states that after the year end a player was sold for £11.5m. So no, you’re correct.

No breakdown between players or staff.
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Cheers Sean ! Well where’s the fucking money then ;)

This is a ramble below after a few beers but;

I was thinking about what I’d invest, as say a Euro millions winner, one of the big pots £100m - about what McCabe and the Prince are worth.

I worked out the current wage bill very very liberally at £10k per week for 24 players = £12.5m.

Then if I took into account what we all want - £20m in transfers to buy 3 top (ish) players on £20k a week on 4 year deals = £12.5m. So that’s £45m outlay on what we all want in this window or summer. Plus the £12.5m existing wage bill = £57.5m in year one.

I’d then have to provide the existing wages plus the new ‘top’ players wages totalling £25m a year.

So I concluded within 3 years, if I went for it, I could have spent the lot and if we weren’t in the Premier League I’d be fucked.

Appreciate I haven’t taken income into account but you literally have to have £200m to lose to gamble with promotion.
 
Rob86 said:
Cheers Sean ! Well where’s the fucking money then ;)

This is a ramble below after a few beers but;

I was thinking about what I’d invest, as say a Euro millions winner, one of the big pots £100m - about what McCabe and the Prince are worth.

I worked out the current wage bill very very liberally at £10k per week for 24 players = £12.5m.

Then if I took into account what we all want - £20m in transfers to buy 3 top (ish) players on £20k a week on 4 year deals = £12.5m. So that’s £45m outlay on what we all want in this window or summer. Plus the £12.5m existing wage bill = £57.5m in year one.

I’d then have to provide the existing wages plus the new ‘top’ players wages totalling £25m a year.

So I concluded within 3 years, if I went for it, I could have spent the lot and if we weren’t in the Premier League I’d be fucked.

Appreciate I haven’t taken income into account but you literally have to have £200m to lose to gamble with promotion.
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Sounds about right Mr Chansiri.
 
wizadry said:
Woodburn?
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We've not bought him.

If that was a loan fee or a loan penalty for not playing we'd have never got him.

I'm saying it's between Egan and Norwood as the only players we've paid for, and I'd like to believe the "not expected to be paid" isn't for a promotion bonus, but maybe an appearance and sell on for both.
 
Rob86 said:
Cheers Sean ! Well where’s the fucking money then ;)

This is a ramble below after a few beers but;

I was thinking about what I’d invest, as say a Euro millions winner, one of the big pots £100m - about what McCabe and the Prince are worth.

I worked out the current wage bill very very liberally at £10k per week for 24 players = £12.5m.

Then if I took into account what we all want - £20m in transfers to buy 3 top (ish) players on £20k a week on 4 year deals = £12.5m. So that’s £45m outlay on what we all want in this window or summer. Plus the £12.5m existing wage bill = £57.5m in year one.

I’d then have to provide the existing wages plus the new ‘top’ players wages totalling £25m a year.

So I concluded within 3 years, if I went for it, I could have spent the lot and if we weren’t in the Premier League I’d be fucked.

Appreciate I haven’t taken income into account but you literally have to have £200m to lose to gamble with promotion.
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What about the rest of the team would they be happy being on a lot less pay ? I doubt it ,team spirit would go out the window
 
Rather refreshing to see that Grant Thornton use the same accounting software as my little firm. :)

HH
 

finlaytheblade said:
What about the rest of the team would they be happy being on a lot less pay ? I doubt it ,team spirit would go out the window
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I’m not sure that would or should make a difference. If someone like Harvey Barnes (recent example) came to the team I was playing in and was on twice as much money, providing he wasn’t a cunt, I’d be well happy. The issue is only if you are as good as him.
 
metalblade said:
Sounds about right Mr Chansiri.
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Mate, he’s smashed those figures. £20k per week is a low wage at Wendy. Christ they must have at least 10 players on over that and they will only have a similar income to us. Hence they are in the shit.

I’m not saying it works, but realistically any player we sign that is around 25 and a Championship top player will be around 6/7 mill and want £20k a week.

Mr Chansiri prefers the older gentleman or those with injuries and pays them handsomely for their services.
 
Rob86 said:
I’m not sure that would or should make a difference. If someone like Harvey Barnes (recent example) came to the team I was playing in and was on twice as much money, providing he wasn’t a cunt, I’d be well happy. The issue is only if you are as good as him.
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Loan players are a different thing they are on big wages at there parent club short term deals are costly but as they arnt our players this doesn't have the same effect,having said that his team mates would expect him to bring extra quality to the team.
 
finlaytheblade said:
Loan players are a different thing they are on big wages at there parent club short term deals are costly but as they arnt our players this doesn't have the same effect,having said that his team mates would expect him to bring extra quality to the team.
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I couldn’t think of someone we are likely to sign as an example ! My point still stands, if we could afford a fee and a player came in on ‘big money’ and was quality, the rest can’t and shouldn’t argue. Why would you not want to play with the best players.
 
If we brought people in on £20k contracts I think we've got a squad with enough about them to know it'll benefit them all eventually. It's a team game, if it improves the team and you get promoted, you'll all see the financial benefit, even if you get sold. Say we go up and we sell a player back to the Championship, he's a got "promotion to the Premier League" on his CV so his next contract will be a bit jucier, if you stay and play in the premier League well enough to establish yourself, there's a good chance you'll be in it for the majority of your remaining career, even if it's bouncing from struggler to struggler mostly, or you'll be a 'big name' signing for a top Championship team, like Ashley Williams on loan at Stoke, he's a liability, but he's been at EPL level for ages and is now on a Premier League contract in the Champ with a team that's got a good chance of getting back there anyway, so he's sorted even if Everton don't want him back most likely.
 
Rob86 said:
I couldn’t think of someone we are likely to sign as an example ! My point still stands, if we could afford a fee and a player came in on ‘big money’ and was quality, the rest can’t and shouldn’t argue. Why would you not want to play with the best players.
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Take your point Rob86 but only relegated clubs can pay these massive transfer fees and big wages the rest rely on owners pumping money in,when this dunt work they end up like the pigs and other clubs who have pushed the boat out but failed and get promotion.
Don't believe Wilder wants to do this ( he's said more than once : he wouldn't put the clubs future in jeapody : ).Yes Wilder wants to push on but keep it within the dangerous 39 million loses over 3 years.s
 
finlaytheblade said:
Take your point Rob86 but only relegated clubs can pay these massive transfer fees and big wages the rest rely on owners pumping money in,when this dunt work they end up like the pigs and other clubs who have pushed the boat out but failed and get promotion.
Don't believe Wilder wants to do this ( he's said more than once : he wouldn't put the clubs future in jeapody : ).Yes Wilder wants to push on but keep it within the dangerous 39 million loses over 3 years.s
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Should read failed to get promotion
 
finlaytheblade said:
Should read failed to get promotion
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I agree but the majority want 2 or 3 quality signings and that will come with a wage, which will probably be around the £20k per week mark. Anyway we haven’t got the means for that so I’m not calling for it.

How Derby are sustaining themselves I just don’t know, it must be creative accounting. They have paid a huge wage bill for the last 3 seasons I can remember and they got Waghorn, who is a bit part player, for £20k a week. There wage bill must be huge and you can only lose £39m over 3 years ! It makes no sense

Edit: I have been told that an owner can ‘gift’ money to the club which doesn’t count to FFP. I assume ongoing wages would but they could pay cash for a loan fee so only the wage contribution would count. Not sure if this I true though

Plus if a new owner takes over, the previous losses are discounted. Again could be bollocks
 

Rob86 said:
I agree but the majority want 2 or 3 quality signings and that will come with a wage, which will probably be around the £20k per week mark. Anyway we haven’t got the means for that so I’m not calling for it.

How Derby are sustaining themselves I just don’t know, it must be creative accounting. They have paid a huge wage bill for the last 3 seasons I can remember and they got Waghorn, who is a bit part player, for £20k a week. There wage bill must be huge and you can only lose £39m over 3 years ! It makes no sense

Edit: I have been told that an owner can ‘gift’ money to the club which doesn’t count to FFP. I assume ongoing wages would but they could pay cash for a loan fee so only the wage contribution would count. Not sure if this I true though

Plus if a new owner takes over, the previous losses are discounted. Again could be bollocks
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Up to FLDC 2017 accounts they’re quite away from £3pm losses. Without looking it’s mainly due to player sales. As I understand it after reading the FFP rules rather than listening to messages from my kettle, owners can invest in share capital to cover cash flow losses only. It doesn’t count as income for FFP purposes. Loan fees are treated as wages.

I think you may be correct. It is bollocks. See Aston Villa.
 
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