Why don't we ever bounce back?

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Darlington82

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Why do some team bounce back time and again, over many years. Norwich, WBA, Fulham and even Rotherham too the Championship.

Whereas in 45 years I've been going I only remember Portfield getting us out of the 4th at the 1st attempt, Reg spent big in relative terms and Ian was a competent manager. Bassett did the same from the 3rd by being Bassett. Since then we have made stupid managerial decisions like Robson, or been stuck with over paid naff players.

How the hell do Norwich, WBA and Rotherham do it? Norwich and WBA are similar in size and not in the most attractive places for foreign players to go to. (This is Fulham big advantage over us).

Whereas Rotherham never take 5 years to get out of the third!

Personally, for this year we have to give Slav time and pray he finds the combination, or they fix Jack!
 

Fulham, it's money. WBA, probably sheer luck, Rotherham play lump-it ball to big forrads but aren't going anywhere and Norwich because they kept the manager in place. If we follow the Norwich model, where Slav is backed and supporters are patient, we'll have a good chance next year.
 
West Brom have been doing it for 20 odd years, but their fans see it as being exciting - I suspect Norwich are pretty much the same now, as Burnley were before them.
Some of "us" seem to think we should go up and stay up - It aint gonna work like that, at least not short term.

There is the saying It is better to have loved and lost, than never to have loved at all

I see it like that....enjoy the ride.

It could be a whole lot worse.

You could be a deluded piggy arse owl, who must really have the most boring existence that is possible.
Imagine that kicking lumps out of Hartlepool was the best thing we had achieved in the last 20 years.........
 
It's the attitude of the players and staff..

We don't bounce back because they normally lost the manager after relegation, this time before (good old chest beating Chris eh) Fulham get the cast offs from Chelsea and arsenal as do Palace and Watford, they've got Premier league quality rejects living down the smoke and they're better that what we could get, londons cast offs beat man city this weekend..

Watford had lukaku didn't they..

The bright lights eh..
 
Plenty of clubs come down and struggle though. Look at Stoke and Huddersfield for example, both have been hovering around lower mid-table since they came down. Can see us having a similar fate.
 
JackSUFC said:
Plenty of clubs come down and struggle though. Look at Stoke and Huddersfield for example, both have been hovering around lower mid-table since they came down. Can see us having a similar fate.
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Morning Jack..

Stoke and Huddersfield are not "top division" teams on any stretch of the imagination (like us I gotta say) so it's not a great analogy to make..

Burnley are the same, Norwich too regardless of having a few consecutive seasons (think Coventry) and West brom to boot. Not Premier league stalwarts by any stretch.. But they leave a gap for us occasionally to squeeze up..

And finally you're right.. We also go down and down again.. We're in that bracket.
 
Stegosaurus said:
Hi Stegosaurus

Theres a great book on the subject by this fella who used to be on the BBC. He bounced back. Now works for radio Norwich and hosts Skirmish, a military based general knowledge quiz show on TV channel UK Conquest.
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How come you’re saying ‘Hi’ to yourself? Are you a confused dinosaur today?
 
The last four relegations we’ve sacked three manager from the relegation season and started again:

Bassett/ Kendall
Warnock/ Robson
Adams/ Wilson
Wilder/ Slav

Very brief look at that, we pretty much take a different direction in style of play when we sack the previous manager. It’s like the owners almost panic into getting someone that plays diffently to the last manager.

In itself, fine, but when you’ve got a manager (Bassett, Warnock, Wilder) who’s been in place for a long time, it means that the players are all accustomed to the the previous managers style and tactics.

We’re definitely seeing the team adapt to Slav’s methods but we also have many players that don’t fit or can’t seem to fit in with it.

Slav was definitely brought in too late. We should’ve had him in when Wilder departed to at least get a head start on his rebuilding plan.
 
SwissBlade said:
The last four relegations we’ve sacked three manager from the relegation season and started again:

Bassett/ Kendall
Warnock/ Robson
Adams/ Wilson
Wilder/ Slav

Very brief look at that, we pretty much take a different direction in style of play when we sack the previous manager. It’s like the owners almost panic into getting someone that plays diffently to the last manager.

In itself, fine, but when you’ve got a manager (Bassett, Warnock, Wilder) who’s been in place for a long time, it means that the players are all accustomed to the the previous managers style and tactics.

We’re definitely seeing the team adapt to Slav’s methods but we also have many players that don’t fit or can’t seem to fit in with it.

Slav was definitely brought in too late. We should’ve had him in when Wilder departed to at least get a head start on his rebuilding plan.
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Bassett/Kendall wasn't like that:

1. Bassett was in place 1 and a half seasons after relegation.
2. The Kendall team adopted immediately to the new style of play, as anyone at Ipswich in the first game will attest. The form after Bassett left was promotion/top 6 form - there was just too big a hole.

Adams/Wilson was to a certain extent bad luck. If Ched Evans had been available or Antonio not available, that doesn't happen.

This season it's very simple. The squad isn't very good.
 
Revolution said:
Bassett/Kendall wasn't like that:

1. Bassett was in place 1 and a half seasons after relegation.
2. The Kendall team adopted immediately to the new style of play, as anyone at Ipswich in the first game will attest. The form after Bassett left was promotion/top 6 form - there was just too big a hole.

Adams/Wilson was to a certain extent bad luck. If Ched Evans had been available or Antonio not available, that doesn't happen.

This season it's very simple. The squad isn't very good.
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Yeah that’s true Bassett/ Kendall, but the point was that each time we’ve gone for a big change in style.

Seem to remember that Kendall got money to spend which didn’t happen under Bassett (due I think to Macdonald coming in)

edit or was that later under spackman? Pretty sure Hutchinson was in under Kendall
 
SwissBlade said:
Yeah that’s true Bassett/ Kendall, but the point was that each time we’ve gone for a big change in style.

Seem to remember that Kendall got money to spend which didn’t happen under Bassett (due I think to Macdonald coming in)
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Yes, Kendall got more money, and also used the money from Nathan Blake's sale to good effect.

The style is secondary to the poor quality or form of the players in key positions.
 

Because as a club we never seem to have a long term plan/strategy for whatever direction we want to go in. Even in the Wilder era we've just had, don't get me wrong the aim had always been promotion when we were down there but instead of an actual plan we finally just stumbled upon a manager that achieved more than we could've ever imagined.

An analogy I like to use for United is they are just like how a dysfunctional family lives. Communication not as good as it could be and no cohesion, reactive rather than pro-active, always opting for the cheap option, dramatic events that pop up from time to time that could have been foreseen/mitigated/prevented but aren't and we suffer huge consequences as a result, only bothered about the here and now rather than consider the future, decisions made for the short term and then wonder why they haven't worked in the longer term, behaving and making decisions based on emotion a lot of the time and getting something right but at the wrong time.
 
Tezza1889 said:
Morning Jack..

Stoke and Huddersfield are not "top division" teams on any stretch of the imagination (like us I gotta say) so it's not a great analogy to make..

Burnley are the same, Norwich too regardless of having a few consecutive seasons (think Coventry) and West brom to boot. Not Premier league stalwarts by any stretch.. But they leave a gap for us occasionally to squeeze up..

And finally you're right.. We also go down and down again.. We're in that bracket.
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I see the point you're making but I wouldn't have name dropped Stoke and Burnley TBH. Stoke have recently come out of a 10 year unbroken spell in the top flight whereas you have to go to the early 1930's and back into the 1920's the last time we had an unbroken spell that lasted for a decade or longer. That is getting on for 100 years ago now.

Burnley won the league at the beginning of the 1960's and even though it was about 60 years ago which is a long time there are people who are still alive that will be able to remember it.
 
Danny_Blade said:
Because as a club we never seem to have a long term plan/strategy for whatever direction we want to go in. Even in the Wilder era we've just had, don't get me wrong the aim had always been promotion when we were down there but instead of an actual plan we finally just stumbled upon a manager that achieved more than we could've ever imagined.

An analogy I like to use for United is they are just like how a dysfunctional family lives. Communication not as good as it could be and no cohesion, reactive rather than pro-active, always opting for the cheap option, dramatic events that pop up from time to time that could have been foreseen/mitigated/prevented but aren't and we suffer huge consequences as a result, only bothered about the here and now rather than consider the future, decisions made for the short term and then wonder why they haven't worked in the longer term, behaving and making decisions based on emotion a lot of the time and getting something right but at the wrong time.
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We talked a good game about building the club from the ground up around Wilder's vision, lost a few and binned him off.

We now don't seem to have the same commitment to Slav, he was just expected to come in and motivate the players who played well for periods under Wilder and get us promoted. The long term strategy now seems a bit scattergun and we'll have 10+ years of pissing in the wind as a result.
 
derekacorah said:
We talked a good game about building the club from the ground up around Wilder's vision, lost a few and binned him off.

We now don't seem to have the same commitment to Slav, he was just expected to come in and motivate the players who played well for periods under Wilder and get us promoted. The long term strategy now seems a bit scattergun and we'll have 10+ years of pissing in the wind as a result.
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Yes this is like I alluded to, getting something right (we've appointed a very good manager) but at the wrong time (our existing players from the Wilder era just don't suit Slav's style).
 
Tezza1889 said:
Morning Jack..

Stoke and Huddersfield are not "top division" teams on any stretch of the imagination (like us I gotta say) so it's not a great analogy to make..

Burnley are the same, Norwich too regardless of having a few consecutive seasons (think Coventry) and West brom to boot. Not Premier league stalwarts by any stretch.. But they leave a gap for us occasionally to squeeze up..

And finally you're right.. We also go down and down again.. We're in that bracket.
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Very true although I’m sure Stoke had about 10 years in the Premier League. Guess you can look at Villa as an example of a big club who came down and took a couple of years to get back up.
 
Danny_Blade said:
Because as a club we never seem to have a long term plan/strategy for whatever direction we want to go in. Even in the Wilder era we've just had, don't get me wrong the aim had always been promotion when we were down there but instead of an actual plan we finally just stumbled upon a manager that achieved more than we could've ever imagined.

An analogy I like to use for United is they are just like how a dysfunctional family lives. Communication not as good as it could be and no cohesion, reactive rather than pro-active, always opting for the cheap option, dramatic events that pop up from time to time that could have been foreseen/mitigated/prevented but aren't and we suffer huge consequences as a result, only bothered about the here and now rather than consider the future, decisions made for the short term and then wonder why they haven't worked in the longer term, behaving and making decisions based on emotion a lot of the time and getting something right but at the wrong time.
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This. We’ve not been run very well for as long as I’ve been going. Occasionally an exceptional manager pulls something out the bag, but whenever he leaves we return to SNAFU.
 
Jon Bon II said:
Fulham, it's money. WBA, probably sheer luck, Rotherham play lump-it ball to big forrads but aren't going anywhere and Norwich because they kept the manager in place. If we follow the Norwich model, where Slav is backed and supporters are patient, we'll have a good chance next year.
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I dunno WBA have been a yo-yo club for donkeys years.
 
Some interesting points made above, Both Kendal and Wilson had money and were unlucky (play off failures) Kendal if he had come in earlier, what could have.... and with Wilson if Ched! Robson was just a nightmare and rank bad decision.
Slav as stated by many, started way too slow, mainly not his fault and the way we came down was awful, whereas under Bassett and Warnock were last games, last minute jobs. So Slav has got an even bigger job to do, with possibly worse resources relatively, and a late start.

I honestly have no idea how WBA and Norwich do it, though Norwich this time had a policy of not spending and basically have the same side as three years ago, but playing the same tactics, whereas we have changed it.

Fuck it, I don't know the answer and have to agree 'ITS THE BLADES WAY' and it how it is and always will be.
 
Very interesting subject this.By the way do any of you think a yoyo club is the best the blades can hope for ?
 
Simple, they have
"Bouncebackability"

It's like football super powers...

Why do Arsenal NEVER get relegated?
 
ShropsBlade said:
Very interesting subject this.By the way do any of you think a yoyo club is the best the blades can hope for ?
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Yes I do, and I dont think it is a bad thing....
As long as the Ups kinda match the Downs on the bloody yo-yo.

Football isn't really about winning (or no one would ever bother about most teams or matches) but it is about a sense of excitement.
 
3-GBlade said:
West Brom have been doing it for 20 odd years, but their fans see it as being exciting - I suspect Norwich are pretty much the same now, as Burnley were before them.
Some of "us" seem to think we should go up and stay up - It aint gonna work like that, at least not short term.

There is the saying Tis better to have loved and lost, than spend your whole life wanking

I see it like that....enjoy the ride.

It could be a whole lot worse.

You could be a deluded piggy arse owl, who must really have the most boring existence that is possible.
Imagine that kicking lumps out of Hartlepool was the best thing we had achieved in the last 20 years.........
Click to expand...

Fixed it for ya 😉
 
We do bounce about, but just from side to side, like throwing a superball as hard as you can in your kitchen, eventually, after about 15 years the ball might go upwards.
 

I hate to be the one to break it to you, but we did bounce back, at the end of last season.

We are a mediocre-level club with occasional good spells of varying length, not the other way round.


 
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