3-5-2 has to the basis for now.

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Kozzy_is_my_Dad

Kozzy_is_my_Dad

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I'm going to put this out there, and am half expecting pelters for it.

The other night was our best performance, and I know what you are thinking, "chuffing hell, that isn't saying much, Koz!" and you'd be right - I agree. But of what we've seen, that was the best. It had a glimmer of fluidity, a glimmer of composure on the ball and postionally, everyone knew where they needed to be. For that reason, for now, 352 has to the basis of what we're trying to do.

But, to be clear - the Duffy version of 352, that led our success throughout L1 and the Championship into the PL. 352 with a CAM, that sets the tempo, puts us on the front foot. None of that dire flat midfield 3 bollocks.

Too often the current system leads to tidy possession across the defence and midfield 3 but nothing more. Introduce the CAM role and again, we're breaking the lines. Currently, the front two look far too distant from the bank of defenders and midfielders, we know they don't create chances for themselves. The CAM sorts that.

Currently, the CB or WB fart about and fling a hopeful ball into the box. That needs to improve. Recruit a CAM and make him watch Duffy footage religiously. Suddenly, the Bash/JOC overlap and the Baldock/Enda underlap becomes far more potent, everyone knows where they should be. The CFs are around the penalty spot and the CAM is around the edge of the area. It adds a whole other dimension to our triangles, because the WB, CB, CM and CAM are all open.

We still, due to last season and a lack of confidence, look vulnerable to the counter too. Yesterday was proof of that. We're soft and we get sucker punched. So, we need a nasty bastard CDM in there too. That would give us CDM, CAM and one of Berge or Fleck to do their thing. Realistically a GK too. Carlton Blade and I were chatting about this yesterday, and whilst I appreciate a shopping list of CDM, CAM, GK ties us to 352 for the foreseeable, Slav always said this was evolution not revolution. To try and change the system is change for changes sake, and when we don't have the time or the money to make wholesale changes its unrealistic to change the system and be effective. We have to go with what we are stocked for, anything else would be gross mismanagement of resources. And as YorkBlade said recently: the Duffy 352 worked for far longer than the 352 flat midfield didn't. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.

It's time to get back to playing proper football, the Sheff United way. ⚔️
 

Won’t play 3-5-2 post international break when Slav has his own players.
 
I actually thought that it was the best performance ive seen in a year. I reckon if slav gets the 5 players then he moves to a winger formation if he can get the wingers in but if not, 3-5-2 most likely
 
I'm sorry but Slav needs to play the formation and style he wants, the squad needs to adapt to that. There's no point in appointing a new manager if they're hamstrung by only being able to play with the previous managers tactics.

My biggest criticism of Slav so far has been the constant changing of formation and tactics. Look at West Brom and what they did to us, all by playing the new managers tactics and syle.
 
Foody said:
I'm sorry but Slav needs to play the formation and style he wants, the squad needs to adapt to that. There's no point in appointing a new manager if they're hamstrung by only being able to play with the previous managers tactics.

My biggest criticism of Slav so far has been the constant changing of formation and tactics. Look at West Brom and what they did to us, all by playing the new managers tactics and syle.
Click to expand...

The constant changes of patterns and line ups for me is a signal that he can't work the way he wants with the current players.

3-5-2 is great when it works, but Slav should be able to shift or tweak formations to gain an edge or dig us out of a rut, and he doesn't have that available to him at the moment.
 
Scarebus said:
The constant changes of patterns and line ups for me is a signal that he can't work the way he wants with the current players.

3-5-2 is great when it works, but Slav should be able to shift or tweak formations to gain an edge or dig us out of a rut, and he doesn't have that available to him at the moment.
Click to expand...

I agree with that, but the problem is the longer we persist with playing a formation/style that isn't our intended future, the further away we are from finding our identity and players learning their roles. The midfield in particular don't seem to know whether they're coming or going just now.
 
Kozzy_is_my_Dad said:
I'm going to put this out there, and am half expecting pelters for it.

The other night was our best performance, and I know what you are thinking, "chuffing hell, that isn't saying much, Koz!" and you'd be right - I agree. But of what we've seen, that was the best. It had a glimmer of fluidity, a glimmer of composure on the ball and postionally, everyone knew where they needed to be. For that reason, for now, 352 has to the basis of what we're trying to do.

But, to be clear - the Duffy version of 352, that led our success throughout L1 and the Championship into the PL. 352 with a CAM, that sets the tempo, puts us on the front foot. None of that dire flat midfield 3 bollocks.

Too often the current system leads to tidy possession across the defence and midfield 3 but nothing more. Introduce the CAM role and again, we're breaking the lines. Currently, the front two look far too distant from the bank of defenders and midfielders, we know they don't create chances for themselves. The CAM sorts that.

Currently, the CB or WB fart about and fling a hopeful ball into the box. That needs to improve. Recruit a CAM and make him watch Duffy footage religiously. Suddenly, the Bash/JOC overlap and the Baldock/Enda underlap becomes far more potent, everyone knows where they should be. The CFs are around the penalty spot and the CAM is around the edge of the area. It adds a whole other dimension to our triangles, because the WB, CB, CM and CAM are all open.

We still, due to last season and a lack of confidence, look vulnerable to the counter too. Yesterday was proof of that. We're soft and we get sucker punched. So, we need a nasty bastard CDM in there too. That would give us CDM, CAM and one of Berge or Fleck to do their thing. Realistically a GK too. Carlton Blade and I were chatting about this yesterday, and whilst I appreciate a shopping list of CDM, CAM, GK ties us to 352 for the foreseeable, Slav always said this was evolution not revolution. To try and change the system is change for changes sake, and when we don't have the time or the money to make wholesale changes its unrealistic to change the system and be effective. We have to go with what we are stocked for, anything else would be gross mismanagement of resources. And as YorkBlade said recently: the Duffy 352 worked for far longer than the 352 flat midfield didn't. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.

It's time to get back to playing proper football, the Sheff United way. ⚔️
Click to expand...
It's a well thought out argument Koz. I just think the players who made 3412 so successful are either on the downside of their peaks or in full decline. The next 'great' team needs to be built around the strengths of the players we have who could still improve.

Problem is, who are they?

433 gives you an extra player in the attacking part of the pitch. Just for pure "more attackers means more attacking" I'd go with that
 
Scarebus said:
The constant changes of patterns and line ups for me is a signal that he can't work the way he wants with the current players.

3-5-2 is great when it works, but Slav should be able to shift or tweak formations to gain an edge or dig us out of a rut, and he doesn't have that available to him at the moment.
Click to expand...
Our players lack versatility and adaptability. We are a meat and 2 veg group
 

Carlton Blade said:
It's a well thought out argument Koz. I just think the players who made 3412 so successful are either on the downside of their peaks or in full decline. The next 'great' team needs to be built around the strengths of the players we have who could still improve.

Problem is, who are they?

433 gives you an extra player in the attacking part of the pitch. Just for pure "more attackers means more attacking" I'd go with that
Click to expand...
good points slav obviously wants to play a back 4 for a start and i dont see him going back to a 3 now the players have had 4 games now to adapt to a new system but have failed miserably its as if theyve been brainwashed in to only knowing how to play 352 and i would also prefer to see another player higher up the pitch think however at least 5 new players have to come in for the 433 to work
 
BrianBadonde said:
5-2-1-2, as it would be on fifa, would be it for me. The 1 being Luke Freeman or a.n.other.
Click to expand...
This is on the button for me, then if he wants to change to a back four bring some wide forwards in and go 343 (like Chelsea) over 1 transfer window and then go 433 after another.
Going straight from where we are to 433 or 4231 is too drastic in one window, in my opinion anyway.
 
3-5-3 for me.

Get shut of the keeper all together and lump another striker on.
 
ancientblade said:
good points slav obviously wants to play a back 4 for a start and i dont see him going back to a 3 now the players have had 4 games now to adapt to a new system but have failed miserably its as if theyve been brainwashed in to only knowing how to play 352 and i would also prefer to see another player higher up the pitch think however at least 5 new players have to come in for the 433 to work
Click to expand...
Agree on 5 minimum. To get a top 3 challenging squad I'd want

GK
CB to allow switching between 3 and 4 at the back
2 athletic CMs
1 forward thinking CM
2 wide forwards
An actual focal point centre forward (think Deane, Hulse etc)
 
adamawdhali said:
I actually thought that it was the best performance ive seen in a year. I reckon if slav gets the 5 players then he moves to a winger formation if he can get the wingers in but if not, 3-5-2 most likely
Click to expand...
I'd say it was more assured and comfortable in possession and that RND and Davies were such an improvement. Davies such a classy upgrade on what we've had there, RND positive, combative, trying to get forward. He has to be first choice.

We were still frail though, when faced with a counter attack - we were at 6s and 7s - even against a very poor Huddersfield side. We need to shore up the midfield big time. And the gaps between the midfield possession and the forwards, and the overlaps/triangles and the forwards in the box are ridiculous.
 
BrianBadonde said:
5-2-1-2, as it would be on fifa, would be it for me. The 1 being Luke Freeman or a.n.other.
Click to expand...
That's the one mate, Freeman, Ndiaye, signing. Whoever. But that's the system.

Foody said:
I agree with that, but the problem is the longer we persist with playing a formation/style that isn't our intended future, the further away we are from finding our identity and players learning their roles. The midfield in particular don't seem to know whether they're coming or going just now.
Click to expand...

Whilst I agree with you mate, the issue is the lack of recruits and the type of players he needs to play his preferred style. It's looking more and more likely that he's going to need at least one more window to reach that point.
 
Foody said:
I'm sorry but Slav needs to play the formation and style he wants, the squad needs to adapt to that. There's no point in appointing a new manager if they're hamstrung by only being able to play with the previous managers tactics.

My biggest criticism of Slav so far has been the constant changing of formation and tactics. Look at West Brom and what they did to us, all by playing the new managers tactics and syle.
Click to expand...
This, Darwinism states you either adapt or die. If these players can't adapt to more than one style of playing their football careers are as good as dead.
 
Unpopular opinion alert.

I didn't think we were that bad on Saturday, we controlled the majority of the game, played good football, RND & Davies particularly looked really good considering their lack of match time.

But yet again, the issue was creativity of clear cut chances in the final third - if we get some fresh attacking blood in, wide players particularly, then we turn performances like Saturday into victories.
 
the question here is do we stick with 352 with the players weve got or do we change to 433 but have to bring at least 5 new players in to play that system plenty on here wanting to stick with 352 but i just dont see it happening with slav in charge he will go with the system hes had success with before so this season will be a transition one try for mid table and get the players in he wants in the january window and next summers window
 

I realise that I'm in prime FMBlade1 bumping your own thread territory here, but blade67 just liked my OP and it prompted me to go back and reread my post.

Well said, August me. I completely agree.
 
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