The Lundstram Myth...

[PittsburghBlade]

Firstly I'll say he has massively improved and his conditioning over the summer was nothing short of a remarkable turnaround and has himself turned into a much better player.

Lundstram is still our clear weakest link at the minute and we have to be looking for direct competition/replacement for the January transfer window. Don't believe me? Who else is it? Because its not Deano, Enda, Baldock, Bash, Egan, O'Connell, Norwood (maybe lately), Fleck, Didzy or Mouss.

We are a very good team and play a very efficient and creative system and style of play in which he has found a home in the right of a three as a mobile and efficient midfielder.

Ok, I've got my tin hat on..BUT..

- He kicks the ball out of play under NO pressure at least 3-5 times a game...disagree? Watch every single game back from this year and count. Just outside the 18 yard box yesterday from a throw-in for a goal kick comes to mind. It's unnecessary and wasteful and when we play regular prem games we have to stop doing this our defence isn't always going to bail us out.

- He switches the ball to Enda under no pressure at least twice a game who has to either head it forward or get out of trouble with some remarkable touch or turn...disagree? Watch every single game back he literally does it every single game. Twice yesterday and once not even to Enda.

- He passes "problems" on - where he might be under pressure or even under no pressure and plays a bad ball to a teammate who is forced to either give it away or just clear the ball...disagree? His pass to George Baldock yesterday what left him facing his own goal and managed to clear it despite being outnumbered.

- His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward.

- For his physical size and presence he doesn't win that many aerial duels in either box or in the middle of the pitch..disagree? He got pushed off the ball by Max Aarons yesterday who took a header off him.

He's the only player we don't have direct competition for and Besic, Morrison, Freeman aren't it so I'm not having that either. I'm not saying he's terrible, or hasn't improved massively but put somebody in there better and watch us really flourish. He's looked decent in a very very good team.

Yesterday he pressed the full back without discipline of what was around him and allowed himself to get taken out of the game 2/3 times easily and its not ALWAYS GOOD to press without discipline it can leave us vulnerable and exposed.

I'd go for Connor Hourihane when Villa go down, pricey but if we can stay up we can afford him, gets around the pitch well and is a genuine goal threat who might push Lundstram to greater heights or just onto the bench..would give us a similar and better goal threat and would join our large Irish contingent who are currently recruiting players for us at every camp. I expect Randolph to join us soon too.

 

[I should coco]

Ok, I've got my tin hat on..BUT..

- He kicks the ball out of play under NO pressure at least 3-5 times a game...disagree? Watch every single game back from this year and count. Just outside the 18 yard box yesterday from a throw-in for a goal kick comes to mind. It's unnecessary and wasteful and when we play regular prem games we have to stop doing this our defence isn't always going to bail us out.

- He switches the ball to Enda under no pressure at least twice a game who has to either head it forward or get out of trouble with some remarkable touch or turn...disagree? Watch every single game back he literally does it every single game. Twice yesterday and once not even to Enda.

- He passes "problems" on - where he might be under pressure or even under no pressure and plays a bad ball to a teammate who is forced to either give it away or just clear the ball...disagree? His pass to George Baldock yesterday what left him facing his own goal and managed to clear it despite being outnumbered.

- His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward.

- For his physical size and presence he doesn't win that many aerial duels in either box or in the middle of the pitch..disagree? He got pushed off the ball by Max Aarons yesterday who took a header off him.

Yes, he's rubbish and he's done nothing this season.

Nothing.

Absolutely nothing.


Wilder can't even see it, so he has to go too.

 

[bertieblade]

Much prefer Lundstram to Norwood, but both doing a job in the premiership where they are playing for the first time in their careers, show that they both have ability it is now all about doing it on a consistent basis.

 

[PittsburghBlade]

Yes, he's rubbish and he's done nothing this season.

Nothing.

Absolutely nothing.


Wilder can't even see it, so he has to go too.

Exactly the type of response I was hoping to avoid, I've not once said he's rubbish or he has to go but we don't have a replacement for him (something Wilder prides himself on having direct competition to push players) and he's making poor mistakes but now because its fashionable to say how good he is people aren't choosing to see it.

 

[Luke1993]

Left footed hourihane? Playing on the right of a midfield 3 in a CW team. Absolute no chance

 

[BladeTillIDie]

I agree with most of the post. Lunny has done well but ain't a 38 games a season man in the PL. He aint better than Norwood or Fleck so he is replaceable and better is out there.

 

[Tony_Kaufman]

Lundstram hasn't been as influential overall in the last two matches, but he's been more consistent than Norwood all season. If anyone is the weak link in midfield then it's Norwood. Generally he's been okay, sometimes great, other times non-existent. But that may be down to the role he plays, as he sits deeper than Fleck and Lundstram who are box to box midfielders. Lundstram is consistently a theat on goal and he was involved in a goal again yesterday.

 

[PittsburghBlade]

Left footed hourihane? Playing on the right of a midfield 3 in a CW team. Absolute no chance

Fleck, Norwood, Hourihane can easily play in a 3.

 

[SwissBlade]

Firstly I'll say he has massively improved and his conditioning over the summer was nothing short of a remarkable turnaround and has himself turned into a much better player.

Lundstram is still our clear weakest link at the minute and we have to be looking for direct competition/replacement for the January transfer window. Don't believe me? Who else is it? Because its not Deano, Enda, Baldock, Bash, Egan, O'Connell, Norwood (maybe lately), Fleck, Didzy or Mouss.

We are a very good team and play a very efficient and creative system and style of play in which he has found a home in the right of a three as a mobile and efficient midfielder.

Ok, I've got my tin hat on..BUT..

- He kicks the ball out of play under NO pressure at least 3-5 times a game...disagree? Watch every single game back from this year and count. Just outside the 18 yard box yesterday from a throw-in for a goal kick comes to mind. It's unnecessary and wasteful and when we play regular prem games we have to stop doing this our defence isn't always going to bail us out.

- He switches the ball to Enda under no pressure at least twice a game who has to either head it forward or get out of trouble with some remarkable touch or turn...disagree? Watch every single game back he literally does it every single game. Twice yesterday and once not even to Enda.

- He passes "problems" on - where he might be under pressure or even under no pressure and plays a bad ball to a teammate who is forced to either give it away or just clear the ball...disagree? His pass to George Baldock yesterday what left him facing his own goal and managed to clear it despite being outnumbered.

- His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward.

- For his physical size and presence he doesn't win that many aerial duels in either box or in the middle of the pitch..disagree? He got pushed off the ball by Max Aarons yesterday who took a header off him.

He's the only player we don't have direct competition for and Besic, Morrison, Freeman aren't it so I'm not having that either. I'm not saying he's terrible, or hasn't improved massively but put somebody in there better and watch us really flourish. He's looked decent in a very very good team.

Yesterday he pressed the full back without discipline of what was around him and allowed himself to get taken out of the game 2/3 times easily and its not ALWAYS GOOD to press without discipline it can leave us vulnerable and exposed.

I'd go for Connor Hourihane when Villa go down, pricey but if we can stay up we can afford him, gets around the pitch well and is a genuine goal threat who might push Lundstram to greater heights or just onto the bench..would give us a similar and better goal threat and would join our large Irish contingent who are currently recruiting players for us at every camp. I expect Randolph to join us soon too.

I completely disagree with everything you say here.

I'd say that the only game he's faded was against Wolves as he looked knackered.

He puts a hell of a lot of work in, gets forward, supports the wing backs (as he did yesterday by laying the ball on for Baldock to cross for Enda's goal).

He has an excellent passing range, but is intelligent with his passing and keeps things simple where possible.

A huge part of why we've done so well this season is down to Lunny.

To date its between Lunny, Egan and McG for best player so far this season.

 

[Akinbiyi]

I don’t know how anyone can seriously say that having watched him in the flesh for most of the season. He’s been incredible, and was very good again yesterday.

And I say that knowing full well id have driven him to his next club in the summer

 

[mattbianco1]

Yes the scapegoat is back !!

To be honest, I agree in part about Lundstram. I fear that his form was a bit of a 'purple patch'. He improved in the 2nd half yesterday (as they all did) but against Wolves and Newcastle I thought he was poor for the most part.
Wolves in particular he could've passed the ball through to the strikers on a couple of occasions but held it just a little too long and got intercepted. But all players have off days.

All that said, he's certainly been a very big player for us so far this year.

I would however like to see a number 10 return in certain games - Villa & Watford at home are two where I feel we could do this. Put McGoldrick or Freeman in the 10 with McGoldrick/McBurnie upfront with Mousset.
I feel we have adapted into the division enough now to play with a little less fear.

But then if we go to Man City, Liverpool and Arsenal without Lundstram in the middle and we're asking for trouble.

 

[Captain]

Firstly I'll say he has massively improved and his conditioning over the summer was nothing short of a remarkable turnaround and has himself turned into a much better player.

Lundstram is still our clear weakest link at the minute and we have to be looking for direct competition/replacement for the January transfer window. Don't believe me? Who else is it? Because its not Deano, Enda, Baldock, Bash, Egan, O'Connell, Norwood (maybe lately), Fleck, Didzy or Mouss.

We are a very good team and play a very efficient and creative system and style of play in which he has found a home in the right of a three as a mobile and efficient midfielder.

Ok, I've got my tin hat on..BUT..

- He kicks the ball out of play under NO pressure at least 3-5 times a game...disagree? Watch every single game back from this year and count. Just outside the 18 yard box yesterday from a throw-in for a goal kick comes to mind. It's unnecessary and wasteful and when we play regular prem games we have to stop doing this our defence isn't always going to bail us out.

- He switches the ball to Enda under no pressure at least twice a game who has to either head it forward or get out of trouble with some remarkable touch or turn...disagree? Watch every single game back he literally does it every single game. Twice yesterday and once not even to Enda.

- He passes "problems" on - where he might be under pressure or even under no pressure and plays a bad ball to a teammate who is forced to either give it away or just clear the ball...disagree? His pass to George Baldock yesterday what left him facing his own goal and managed to clear it despite being outnumbered.

- His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward.

- For his physical size and presence he doesn't win that many aerial duels in either box or in the middle of the pitch..disagree? He got pushed off the ball by Max Aarons yesterday who took a header off him.

He's the only player we don't have direct competition for and Besic, Morrison, Freeman aren't it so I'm not having that either. I'm not saying he's terrible, or hasn't improved massively but put somebody in there better and watch us really flourish. He's looked decent in a very very good team.

Yesterday he pressed the full back without discipline of what was around him and allowed himself to get taken out of the game 2/3 times easily and its not ALWAYS GOOD to press without discipline it can leave us vulnerable and exposed.

I'd go for Connor Hourihane when Villa go down, pricey but if we can stay up we can afford him, gets around the pitch well and is a genuine goal threat who might push Lundstram to greater heights or just onto the bench..would give us a similar and better goal threat and would join our large Irish contingent who are currently recruiting players for us at every camp. I expect Randolph to join us soon too.

I have questioned Lundstrams ability in the past!
I was wrong!
He’s been immense
Weighing in with 3 goals!

strange post don’t really get it!

 

[true99blade]

Fans notice players losing the ball more when they intend to look for it. There’s still some that can’t get over the fact they were wrong about him.

 

[SwissBlade]

Lundstram hasn't been as influential overall in the last two matches, but he's been more consistent than Norwood all season. If anyone is the weak link in midfield then it's Norwood. Generally he's been okay, sometimes great, other times non-existent. But that may be down to the role he plays, as he sits deeper than Fleck and Lundstram who are box to box midfielders. Lundstram is consistently a theat on goal and he was involved in a goal again yesterday.

There isn't a weak link in that midfield.

 

[I should coco]

Exactly the type of response I was hoping to avoid

If you'd actually thought about the type of reply you'd get, that makes your original post even more stupid than I first thought.

I've not once said he's rubbish or he has to go

No, you didn't actually say 'rubbish':-

Lundstram is still our clear weakest link at the minute....

...He kicks the ball out of play under NO pressure at least 3-5 times a game...

...He switches the ball to Enda under no pressure....

....He passes "problems" on - where he might be under pressure or even under no pressure and plays a bad ball to a teammate ...

... His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward....

...For his physical size and presence he doesn't win that many aerial duels....

...he pressed the full back without discipline of what was around him....

#Scapegoat-reborn

 

[Tony_Kaufman]

There isn't a weak link in that midfield.

I wasn't meaning to call Norwood a weak link, I was just highlighting that if you were to single out one of the midfield as the weaker player then for me it would be Norwood, not Lundstram, as he's not been as consistent as the other two. Overall he's been fine.

 

[Beans]

Not to shout down debate, but this seems a strange thing to argue.

I really think he's been one of our best players this season. Not only is he our top-scoring midfielder and second top-scoring player overall, he's had more shots than any player bar McGoldrick from getting into the box at the right time (15 out of 24 shots inside the box so it's not like he's shooting from anywhere). I know some people hate the advanced stats but he has the highest expected goals of any player on our team bar McGoldrick, to go with the highest expected assists

- His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward.

Out of 50 passes attempted yesterday, 23 were forward, 17 were in attacking third (only Fleck had more), he created 2 chances (joint most with McGoldrick) including the 1 "big chance" of the game that McGoldrick put over - which came off a 60-yard sprint with the ball and then a perfect pass.

Honestly if that's our weak link then it's no wonder we're 9th in the table.

 

[LJBlade]

Firstly I'll say he has massively improved and his conditioning over the summer was nothing short of a remarkable turnaround and has himself turned into a much better player.

Lundstram is still our clear weakest link at the minute and we have to be looking for direct competition/replacement for the January transfer window. Don't believe me? Who else is it? Because its not Deano, Enda, Baldock, Bash, Egan, O'Connell, Norwood (maybe lately), Fleck, Didzy or Mouss.

We are a very good team and play a very efficient and creative system and style of play in which he has found a home in the right of a three as a mobile and efficient midfielder.

Ok, I've got my tin hat on..BUT..

- He kicks the ball out of play under NO pressure at least 3-5 times a game...disagree? Watch every single game back from this year and count. Just outside the 18 yard box yesterday from a throw-in for a goal kick comes to mind. It's unnecessary and wasteful and when we play regular prem games we have to stop doing this our defence isn't always going to bail us out.

- He switches the ball to Enda under no pressure at least twice a game who has to either head it forward or get out of trouble with some remarkable touch or turn...disagree? Watch every single game back he literally does it every single game. Twice yesterday and once not even to Enda.

- He passes "problems" on - where he might be under pressure or even under no pressure and plays a bad ball to a teammate who is forced to either give it away or just clear the ball...disagree? His pass to George Baldock yesterday what left him facing his own goal and managed to clear it despite being outnumbered.

- His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward.

- For his physical size and presence he doesn't win that many aerial duels in either box or in the middle of the pitch..disagree? He got pushed off the ball by Max Aarons yesterday who took a header off him.

He's the only player we don't have direct competition for and Besic, Morrison, Freeman aren't it so I'm not having that either. I'm not saying he's terrible, or hasn't improved massively but put somebody in there better and watch us really flourish. He's looked decent in a very very good team.

Yesterday he pressed the full back without discipline of what was around him and allowed himself to get taken out of the game 2/3 times easily and its not ALWAYS GOOD to press without discipline it can leave us vulnerable and exposed.

I'd go for Connor Hourihane when Villa go down, pricey but if we can stay up we can afford him, gets around the pitch well and is a genuine goal threat who might push Lundstram to greater heights or just onto the bench..would give us a similar and better goal threat and would join our large Irish contingent who are currently recruiting players for us at every camp. I expect Randolph to join us soon too.

Who is our 'clear weakest link' if it isn't Lundstram? Have you ever considered that maybe we don't have one? Do we need to have a clear weakest link?

All of those comments you make about how Lundstram isn't good enough could also be made about just about all of our players during some part of this season.

 

[SwissBlade]

I wasn't meaning to call Norwood a weak link, I was just highlighting that if you were to single out one of the midfield as the weaker player then for me it would be Norwood, not Lundstram, as he's not been as consistent as the other two. Overall he's been fine.

No, i appreciate that you weren't calling him a weak link, but i think as a three, Norwood, Fleck and Lunny provide a fabulous midfield which has hardly been overrun this season. Norwood sits deep, which is partly why the whole system works. His passing is exceptional. Without him, the rest of the midfield wouldn't work

 

[I should coco]

Not to shout down debate, but this seems a strange thing to argue.

There's 'debate' and there's arrant nonsense verging on WUM territory.

Out of 50 passes attempted yesterday, 23 were forward, 17 were in attacking third (only Fleck had more), he created 2 chances (joint most with McGoldrick) including the 1 "big chance" of the game that McGoldrick put over - which came off a 60-yard sprint with the ball and then a perfect pass.

Coming on here with yer' facts......

 

[madeinsheffield]

He's made a massive step up, and I think he's doing well, he's not going to win every header and tackle, no player is in this division, such is the quality of the oppenents every week. His fitness and desire has had a huge influence on the imapact he has on games.

I would say he just needs to work a bit work on his composure in front of goal, the ability is there as he's shown a few times as a result of his anticipation and slotted the ball home, he just has a tendency to sky one when he should be hitting the target, Billy could help him here.

 

[Woodys Thunderbolt]

Lundstram has been IMMENSE so far this season. Said to my mate at Wolves that if Ross Barkley was good enough for England then Lunny definetely was.

 

[Millhousesblade1889]

Lundstrum has been a complete revelation this season.....however if we manage to stay in this division and continue to build our squad I don't seem him in the starting 11 in 2/3 seasons time, but the biggest compliment I can give is I do still see him in the squad.

 

[1970firstmatch]

Yesterday he carried the ball twice around 50m and laid it off to McGoldrick for excellent chances. There were Norwich players around him but they just didn't have the energy to get near him. Whole else can do that in our midfield in the last 15 mins of a game. He is our energy and drive.

 

[SwissBlade]

Lundstrum has been a complete revelation this season.....however if we manage to stay in this division and continue to build our squad I don't seem him in the starting 11 in 2/3 seasons time, but the biggest compliment I can give is I do still see him in the squad.

No, i think you're right, we will still have to accept that players like Lunny will command a big fee. But hopefully we can keep hold of him

 

[Addison]

I was never a fan of Lundstram last season or the season before. I saw a player top heavy who needed to work on his conditioning, slow in thought with the occasional hollywood ball that people dwelt on too much. IMO there was possibly a player in there but he needed to go out on loan to play regularly as he wasn't benefiting from being in and out of the team. He also had some very poor games at the start of last season when he was preferred to Duffy. It didn't help his cause when Duffy returned to the team at his expense and we started flying.

Fast forward to this season I was one who of those who groaned when he started in the team as the flat 3 formation hadn't worked before. Yet we began to see a much fitter Lundstram, down to his extra work in the summer. The flat three began to play more of a V formation with Lundstrams energy getting him into more forward positions and it worked because he does have a shot on him.

Yes he has his limitations and there are times when he does makes ricks with the ball in possession because he is looking for the spectacular pass when a more simpler one is needed but no one can doubt he has been an integral part of the team this season.

If there is a concern it is whether he will last the season because of the amount of work he is having to do in the middle of the park. I agree we need a replacement for injury, suspension, tiredness or loss of form but don't agree there isn't one in the squad. Yesterday we saw a lung busting run from Lundstram late in the game to set up Mcg. As short while earlier another player had done the same Besic. For me we need to see more of Besic before January in the hope we can convince him to stay the season.

As for Lundstram his form has been an unexpected bonus that very few could have predicted. Credit to Alan Knill for pushing his cause and the conditioning team for getting him ready.

 

[Stevo]

Firstly I'll say he has massively improved and his conditioning over the summer was nothing short of a remarkable turnaround and has himself turned into a much better player.

Lundstram is still our clear weakest link at the minute and we have to be looking for direct competition/replacement for the January transfer window. Don't believe me? Who else is it? Because its not Deano, Enda, Baldock, Bash, Egan, O'Connell, Norwood (maybe lately), Fleck, Didzy or Mouss.

We are a very good team and play a very efficient and creative system and style of play in which he has found a home in the right of a three as a mobile and efficient midfielder.

Ok, I've got my tin hat on..BUT..

- He kicks the ball out of play under NO pressure at least 3-5 times a game...disagree? Watch every single game back from this year and count. Just outside the 18 yard box yesterday from a throw-in for a goal kick comes to mind. It's unnecessary and wasteful and when we play regular prem games we have to stop doing this our defence isn't always going to bail us out.

- He switches the ball to Enda under no pressure at least twice a game who has to either head it forward or get out of trouble with some remarkable touch or turn...disagree? Watch every single game back he literally does it every single game. Twice yesterday and once not even to Enda.

- He passes "problems" on - where he might be under pressure or even under no pressure and plays a bad ball to a teammate who is forced to either give it away or just clear the ball...disagree? His pass to George Baldock yesterday what left him facing his own goal and managed to clear it despite being outnumbered.

- His passing isn't incisive or postive at the minute and is going increasingly backward.

- For his physical size and presence he doesn't win that many aerial duels in either box or in the middle of the pitch..disagree? He got pushed off the ball by Max Aarons yesterday who took a header off him.

He's the only player we don't have direct competition for and Besic, Morrison, Freeman aren't it so I'm not having that either. I'm not saying he's terrible, or hasn't improved massively but put somebody in there better and watch us really flourish. He's looked decent in a very very good team.

Yesterday he pressed the full back without discipline of what was around him and allowed himself to get taken out of the game 2/3 times easily and its not ALWAYS GOOD to press without discipline it can leave us vulnerable and exposed.

I'd go for Connor Hourihane when Villa go down, pricey but if we can stay up we can afford him, gets around the pitch well and is a genuine goal threat who might push Lundstram to greater heights or just onto the bench..would give us a similar and better goal threat and would join our large Irish contingent who are currently recruiting players for us at every camp. I expect Randolph to join us soon too.

What's Leroy fer up to?

 

[Blade for Sale]

The OP is getting some uncalled for pelters here. It's a well reasoned and thought out post with a great deal of analysis behind it. They also go out of their way to pre-emptively respond to (correctly) predicted negative feedback.

Logically in any team of 11, or matchday 18, or squad of 24, however you want to analyse it, there will, even in the best teams such as Liverpool, be areas for improvement and players inferior to others.

Lunny has indeed improved, almost beyond all recognition, this season and has made extremely valuable contributions, and the OP acknowleged this. But that does not make him (or anyone) irreplaceable, and if all criticism is immediately shouted down then we get nowhere, especially when the criticism is so well thought out and presented.

My personal thoughts are that the guy has made such a massive improvement in such a short space of time, maybe the odd step back is inevitable, and he's still worth his place in the team by some distance. But you rest on your laurels at your peril, and well thought out criticism is a very good way of avoiding that.

 

[Caseh]

I don't think Lundstram is as good as Norwood or Fleck technically, but the amount of work he get's through means he isn't a weak link - He's just a different cog to the machine that is our team. It all works because they all compliment each other so well.

 

[Ricky]

I'll come back to this thread when I've thought of my own offended, sensitive, childish response