Change is good

[CoatesyBlade]

After listening to post and pre match interviews it seems highly likely that we’re sticking to our 5/3/2 formation. I absolutely thought some sort of tweak would have been implemented this season to progress the team. Alas that tweak hasn’t materialised and it’s more of the same. Unfortunately the key components in this style of play (WB’s and CB’s) are either woefully out of form and worse still... out injured for the rest of the season!

Do we keep trying to fit square pegs into round holes for the sake of the system. Or do we use the best players at our disposal in their preferred roles?

Maybe a 4/3/3 is too drastic and probably won’t be entertained. But I think a number 10 should be greatly considered.
The free flowing football I’ve become accustomed to over the past few years has been replaced with slow over cautious dawdling... and worst still... hoofball up to McB!
Granted every good team is built on a solid defence. But god we need to show more energy and determination further up the pitch!
Our creative players at the club at the minute are Berge, Didzy, Burke and Norwood. These players need to be on the pitch more often than not if we’re gonna get our mojo back.

 

[Gozza]

Totally agree, the wingbacks aren't getting forward anymore so we have no attacking outlet. Like I mentioned in my latest video, I think we should go to a 41212 narrow. Simply down to the fact that we only have one player which has played as a winger previously in his career which is Burke. So having wingers doesn't seem ideal.

Going back to the formation it will give us extra creativity, hopefully! As we will have an extra midfielder. It would also mean having a more solid defence as they are relied on defending as their primary objective, rather than over lapping and creating attacks.

Having McGoldrick or Norwood behind the two strikers seems worth trying as they are, our most creative players. We've proven creativity out wide is pointless this season, the City game being a prime example with people either taking too long to cross the ball in, or crossing it over everyone's head.

 

[CoatesyBlade]

Yeah I watched your video
Personally though I’m not the biggest fan of the diamond. I just don’t like the idea of giving up width. It’s important to drag defenders out and create space.
you don’t need out and out wingers to play 3 up front. It’s the ability to move across as a collective that opens up defences. I don’t think Norwood would be best utilised too far forward. He’s a deep laying creative player. It’s his ability to pick the best option that we have missed.

I imagine the 4-3-3 to look like this:

Baldock Egan Ampadu Stevens
Berge Norwood Osborn
Brewster Didzy Burke

More realistically we could go with this against Chelsea:

Basham Egan Stevens
Baldock Berge Ampadu Osborn
Didzy
Brewster Burke

 

[BettingBlade]

Yeah I watched your video
Personally though I’m not the biggest fan of the diamond. I just don’t like the idea of giving up width. It’s important to drag defenders out and create space.
you don’t need out and out wingers to play 3 up front. It’s the ability to move across as a collective that opens up defences. I don’t think Norwood would be best utilised too far forward. He’s a deep laying creative player. It’s his ability to pick the best option that we have missed.

I imagine the 4-3-3 to look like this:

Baldock Egan Ampadu Stevens
Berge Norwood Osborn
Brewster Didzy Burke

More realistically we could go with this against Chelsea:

Basham Egan Stevens
Baldock Berge Ampadu Osborn
Didzy
Brewster Burke

That Luke Freeman at Forest looks like he’d fit perfectly in the second formation.

 

[Millhousesblade1889]

That Luke Freeman at Forest looks like he’d fit perfectly in the second formation.

The one thats failing to impress in Forests team

 

[CoatesyBlade]

Yeah I’m not to sure either if L Freeman is the answer.
And tbh I don’t think we’re a million miles off as things stand anyway. We looked pretty decent against Liverpool with a lot more intent. Hopefully that first win comes soon and that then gives us the confidence to get going this season.

 

[bongleblade]

I’ve always wondered Could we play a 5-2-3? Didzy/McB as False 9 dropping into the midfield linking play with two wingers/wide forwards bombing in either side? instead of overlapping CB’s, the mobile Ampadu at CB ventures out to DM to support the midfield, as well as Wingbacks in support on either side. I’m thinking something like this:

—————Ramsdale———-
———Bash-Ampadu-Egan—
—Baldock ——————Lowe—
————Berge——--Fleck———
Brewster———Didzy—-——Burke—

 

[Gozza]

Yeah I watched your video
Personally though I’m not the biggest fan of the diamond. I just don’t like the idea of giving up width. It’s important to drag defenders out and create space.
you don’t need out and out wingers to play 3 up front. It’s the ability to move across as a collective that opens up defences. I don’t think Norwood would be best utilised too far forward. He’s a deep laying creative player. It’s his ability to pick the best option that we have missed.

I imagine the 4-3-3 to look like this:

Baldock Egan Ampadu Stevens
Berge Norwood Osborn
Brewster Didzy Burke

More realistically we could go with this against Chelsea:

Basham Egan Stevens
Baldock Berge Ampadu Osborn
Didzy
Brewster Burke

Thanks for watching and yeah, it's hard to argue with that. All I'd say is that for the Chelsea game is that Ampadu is a Chelsea player so I'm guessing he can't play. And I know it's a narrow shape but as we saw in the second half of the city match Berge drifted wide and played more like a RM. So if he can do that on the right and someone like Osborn can do it on the left then we could start to mean business this season.

 

[Gozza]

Yeah I’m not to sure either if L Freeman is the answer.
And tbh I don’t think we’re a million miles off as things stand anyway. We looked pretty decent against Liverpool with a lot more intent. Hopefully that first win comes soon and that then gives us the confidence to get going this season.

It would be good to have him as an option. But sadly it looks like he's not coming back the only clause in the loan is a permanent transfer...

 

[Gozza]

I’ve always wondered Could we play a 5-2-3? Didzy/McB as False 9 dropping into the midfield linking play with two wingers/wide forwards bombing in either side? instead of overlapping CB’s, the mobile Ampadu at CB ventures out to DM to support the midfield, as well as Wingbacks in support on either side. I’m thinking something like this:

—————Ramsdale———-
———Bash-Ampadu-Egan—
—Baldock ——————Lowe—
————Berge——--Fleck———
Brewster———Didzy—-——Burke—

It's a good suggestion mate, one I was considering for the video. In the end though, I just felt that the midfield would be too exposed with only two CMs.

 

[CoatesyBlade]

I’ve always wondered Could we play a 5-2-3? Didzy/McB as False 9 dropping into the midfield linking play with two wingers/wide forwards bombing in either side? instead of overlapping CB’s, the mobile Ampadu at CB ventures out to DM to support the midfield, as well as Wingbacks in support on either side. I’m thinking something like this:

—————Ramsdale———-
———Bash-Ampadu-Egan—
—Baldock ——————Lowe—
————Berge——--Fleck———
Brewster———Didzy—-——Burke—

I do like this thinking a lot. A bit more forward thinking that we’re missing right now!

 

[CoatesyBlade]

Thanks for watching and yeah, it's hard to argue with that. All I'd say is that for the Chelsea game is that Ampadu is a Chelsea player so I'm guessing he can't play. And I know it's a narrow shape but as we saw in the second half of the city match Berge drifted wide and played more like a RM. So if he can do that on the right and someone like Osborn can do it on the left then we could start to mean business this season.

Yeah I forgot about Ampadu not being available for this one. Tbh it was a bit of a toss up between the two for me anyhow. I really rate Ampadu I think he’s a real talent. But we just aren’t the same team without Norwood dictating things.
I don’t think there will be a change in formation against Chelsea in all honesty. Hopefully we just go for it with Bash and Enda getting forward. We need the team to start believing in themselves again.

 

[Yogi]

Yeah I watched your video
Personally though I’m not the biggest fan of the diamond. I just don’t like the idea of giving up width. It’s important to drag defenders out and create space.
you don’t need out and out wingers to play 3 up front. It’s the ability to move across as a collective that opens up defences. I don’t think Norwood would be best utilised too far forward. He’s a deep laying creative player. It’s his ability to pick the best option that we have missed.

I imagine the 4-3-3 to look like this:

Baldock Egan Ampadu Stevens
Berge Norwood Osborn
Brewster Didzy Burke

More realistically we could go with this against Chelsea:

Basham Egan Stevens
Baldock Berge Ampadu Osborn
Didzy
Brewster Burke

With the players you’ve stated for your 4-3-3 that would look like a 4-4–2 diamond with the amount Didzy drops deep

 

[Bennyand the Blades]

Another idea could be to have a fullback come up and have a shot for goal trough a crowded penalty area.

It worked for Man City........

 

[CoatesyBlade]

With the players you’ve stated for your 4-3-3 that would look like a 4-4–2 diamond with the amount Didzy drops deep

Yeah you’re not wrong. The tactics are different though and that would come down to individual discipline.

 

[Yogi]

Yeah you’re not wrong. The tactics are different though and that would come down to individual discipline.

Agreed it would it could be a very fluid formation giving us lots of options and I think we may will see it later in the season. Our plan b in game is actually something quite similar. Right now though there might be a psychological element to wilder sticking to his guns sticking to “our way” and our methods sends a psychological vote of confidence to the players that we’re not at panic stations. If we don’t get a result against West Brom I expect that to change. The only issues for any switch to a back 4 is we don’t currently have a starting LCB and that issue would only be further exposed in a 4.

 

[Stevo]

Yeah I watched your video
Personally though I’m not the biggest fan of the diamond. I just don’t like the idea of giving up width. It’s important to drag defenders out and create space.
you don’t need out and out wingers to play 3 up front. It’s the ability to move across as a collective that opens up defences. I don’t think Norwood would be best utilised too far forward. He’s a deep laying creative player. It’s his ability to pick the best option that we have missed.

I imagine the 4-3-3 to look like this:

Baldock Egan Ampadu Stevens
Berge Norwood Osborn
Brewster Didzy Burke

More realistically we could go with this against Chelsea:

Basham Egan Stevens
Baldock Berge Ampadu Osborn
Didzy
Brewster Burke

Width is great if you actually do something with it, we are shite at crossing a ball, we should be whipping it in at every opportunity with mcburnie in the box,instead we dick about with the ball and either lose it or pass it backwards

 

[CoatesyBlade]

Agreed it would it could be a very fluid formation giving us lots of options and I think we may will see it later in the season. Our plan b in game is actually something quite similar. Right now though there might be a psychological element to wilder sticking to his guns sticking to “our way” and our methods sends a psychological vote of confidence to the players that we’re not at panic stations. If we don’t get a result against West Brom I expect that to change. The only issues for any switch to a back 4 is we don’t currently have a starting LCB and that issue would only be further exposed in a 4.

I actually think the need for a left footed central defender in a back 4 isn’t paramount. You just need 2 good centre halves. Egan and one of Jags, Bash, Amps works for me.

Totally agree with your post though. The psychological aspect of team and formation selection is a fine balancing act and I’m sure a solution will be found.

 

[CoatesyBlade]

Width is great if you actually do something with it, we are shite at crossing a ball, we should be whipping it in at every opportunity with mcburnie in the box,instead we dick about with the ball and either lose it or pass it backwards

I’d change that to ‘so far this season’ Stevo. Again that comes down to the individuals mental attitude. We can do it and we just need that bit of self confidence to come through.

 

[Upton_Blade]

I still think we'll stay up this season but CW needs to stop being stubborn and realise the formation just isn't working atm.

Based on who we've got available this is probably what I would go for as would give leave us still quite solid but should increase us potential in the final 3rd.

.....................Rammers......................
...............Bash Egan Stevens..........
.....Bogle Berge Ampadu Lowe..
............Burke..........Didzy.................
..............Brewster/McB....................

 

[varkanoid]

Another idea could be to have a fullback come up and have a shot for goal trough a crowded penalty area.

It worked for Man City........

A shot on target would be good from anywhere right about now.

 

[Stevo]

I’d change that to ‘so far this season’ Stevo. Again that comes down to the individuals mental attitude. We can do it and we just need that bit of self confidence to come through.

I've not seen us have a great crossing game for months

 

[Stevo]

A shot on target would be good from anywhere right about now.

I've not seen us have a shot for months

 

[davidblade]

Yeah I watched your video
Personally though I’m not the biggest fan of the diamond. I just don’t like the idea of giving up width. It’s important to drag defenders out and create space.
you don’t need out and out wingers to play 3 up front. It’s the ability to move across as a collective that opens up defences. I don’t think Norwood would be best utilised too far forward. He’s a deep laying creative player. It’s his ability to pick the best option that we have missed.

I imagine the 4-3-3 to look like this:

Baldock Egan Ampadu Stevens
Berge Norwood Osborn
Brewster Didzy Burke

More realistically we could go with this against Chelsea:

Basham Egan Stevens
Baldock Berge Ampadu Osborn
Didzy
Brewster Burke

Ampadu can’t play against Chelsea

 

[I'll tell me dad.]

Ampadu can’t play against Chelsea

Hang on, do they know he's had his hair cut?

 

[Houston_Blade]

 

[tincan]

A 352,433 or 442 doesn't work as our players are technically worse than the opposition. Our overload system depends on the pivots of Egan, Norwood and Didsy crossing to the late runners into the box. Berge and Ampadu don't have that discipline yet. The PL defences are overwhelming our lone strikers , hence no shots on target. Also oppositions set up for more attacking turnovers resulting in the 1 -0 losses.
The new players are technically better and so could come through and save us, but it is not going to be easy. Assuming Chelsea's form means another loss, Wilder might be wiser going all out for our system to develop Berge, Burke, Bogle and Lowe's understanding of our system.