60 years ago this month...

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Silent Blade said:
Mick Ash
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That was my first thought, as it looks like him. If that is the pre-season photo, he would not even have been 16, and the programmes even at the end of the 59-60 season don't list him as a player or record him as having played for the 'A'-team. The Utd Who's Who says he later went to Boca Juniors and River Plate, and I see that you put up a question about this several years ago. Did you ever find anything out? On the face of it it seems odd, and he doesn't appear on the lists of players for the 2 clubs (admittedly only Wikipedia). And there is the added interest that the dates given for him at River Plate (72-74) mean that he would have coincided with the young Sabella.
 

HodgysBrokenThumb said:
That was my first thought, as it looks like him. If that is the pre-season photo, he would not even have been 16, and the programmes even at the end of the 59-60 season don't list him as a player or record him as having played for the 'A'-team. The Utd Who's Who says he later went to Boca Juniors and River Plate, and I see that you put up a question about this several years ago. Did you ever find anything out? On the face of it it seems odd, and he doesn't appear on the lists of players for the 2 clubs (admittedly only Wikipedia). And there is the added interest that the dates given for him at River Plate (72-74) mean that he would have coincided with the young Sabella.
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I haven't been able to find out Ash's playing details at River and Boca. Seems strange to me.
 
Silent Blade said:
I haven't been able to find out Ash's playing details at River and Boca. Seems strange to me.
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I also found it strange that I immediately thought that was who the player was in the photo. I probably never saw him in the first team, as he only played 3 times, but presumably I did see him in the reserves. I don't know why I would recognise him, unless it was at the time believed that he was a really good prospect. But that is not a definite memory.
 
HodgysBrokenThumb said:
I also found it strange that I immediately thought that was who the player was in the photo. I probably never saw him in the first team, as he only played 3 times, but presumably I did see him in the reserves. I don't know why I would recognise him, unless it was at the time believed that he was a really good prospect. But that is not a definite memory.
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Do you remember anything about Terry Hillman who is back row extreme right? He never played for the 1st team
 
Silent Blade said:
Do you remember anything about Terry Hillman who is back row extreme right? He never played for the 1st team
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Had a quick look at programmes of the period, and can't see any record of him, even in the A-team. Seems strange that some of these youngsters made it onto the squad photos. I have a juniors programme from Jan 1962 with Mick Ash playing, and in the same year he is also playing reserve matches.
Random fact from a reserve programme of Dec 8, 1962, v Bolton. It reports on a recent Juniors match v Hull, which we won 14-2. Mick Jones and Jack Parks scored 11 of the goals between them; by this stage of the season, both had scored 20 goals. I wonder if anyone sensed that just one of them would go on to have a great career as a striker. It is a tricky business sorting out which youngsters will succeed.
 
Love this thread, cos 1959 was my first season supporting the Blades. Used to get free tickets handed out in school on a Friday afternoon (I went to Upperthorpe) deep in S6 pig land, nobody wanted United tickets. I remember the long treck from the Kelvin, over the top of St Phillips Rd down into the realms of S2. One little kid on his own sojourn through the grey tundra of the late 50's slum clearances, towards a life of supporting a team that in all honesty as brought more tears than joy, but hey, here we are again, back in the top flight, living the dream! Once a Blade.......
 
HodgysBrokenThumb said:
Had a quick look at programmes of the period, and can't see any record of him, even in the A-team. Seems strange that some of these youngsters made it onto the squad photos. I have a juniors programme from Jan 1962 with Mick Ash playing, and in the same year he is also playing reserve matches.
Random fact from a reserve programme of Dec 8, 1962, v Bolton. It reports on a recent Juniors match v Hull, which we won 14-2. Mick Jones and Jack Parks scored 11 of the goals between them; by this stage of the season, both had scored 20 goals. I wonder if anyone sensed that just one of them would go on to have a great career as a striker. It is a tricky business sorting out which youngsters will succeed.
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Fascinating facts gleaned from programmes and invariably true as they are written at the time of happening. Also give the reader at taste of the era they were written. The junior game V Hull 14-2, 11 between Mick Jones & Jack Parks, any idea how many each scored? Couldn't remember Parks, at least not his face, name rang a bell but found this1960 July Jack Parks.jpg
 
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XM657 said:
Fascinating facts gleaned from programmes and invariably true as they are written at the time of happening. Also give the reader at taste of the era they were written. The junior game V Hull 14-2, 11 between Mick Jones & Jack Parks, any idea how many each scored? Couldn't remember Parks, at least not his face, name rang a bell but found thisView attachment 53700
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The report just said they shared 11 goals. Parks was prolific at that level - the programme above has the jottings from the day.
 
May 4th, 1959, and the season finally ends. It was a very quiet final few games, with nothing to match the drama and celebrations of 2019. But on the eve of the FA Cup Final, it seems appropriate to conclude this look back to 1958-59 with a match in which United won the only cup competition I have ever seen them win - the County Cup. And they did it at Hillsborough, winning 4-1 against against the league 2 champions.
The County Cup was a revenue-raiser for the Sheffield and Hallamshire County FA, and while it was not a major competition, a final between United and Wednesday was always a good occasion, with less pressure than other derbies. United dominated the County Cup in the 1950s, and with this victory had won the trophy 6 times in 7 years.
Both clubs fielded strong teams (Utd included the young Pat Laverty, whose death was recently announced), and as was usual at that time, we went on the Kop without any fear that there would be trouble. My brother's report is as follows:

'Attendance: 18,221. United retained the County Cup by beating Wednesday at Hillsborough. After 4 minutes, Lewis twisted his ankle, and for the rest of the game he had to hobble on the wing. But after 12 minutes, Swan went off injured, and did not return. United had most of the play in the first 30 minutes, but there was little excitement. Then after 32 minutes United took the lead. Pace hit the ball through a crowd of players from the left-wing, and Laverty side-footed the ball into the net. 3 minutes later Laverty passed the ball along the edge of the penalty area to Pace, and the 'Doc' sent the defence the wrong way and then hooked the ball into the net. After 53 minutes United made it 3-0. Hoyland passed to Laverty, and the lanky reserve hammered it past McLaren from about 30 yards. Pace had a brilliant header disallowed (76 minutes) for off-side. This decision annoyed him, and a minute later he chased a through ball and scored with a terrific shot.
Hodgkinson made one of his best saves of the season when he tipped a Finney header away. Pace was the outstanding player on the evening .'

No mention is made of Wednesday's goal!

So, although only a minor competition, a win over Wednesday to win a trophy always felt sweet. But this was not enough to make up for missing out on promotion when Wednesday finished top of the league. The programme notes focus on the County Cup, but they could have gloated on Wednesday's promotion. And though United, under John Harris, were promoted 2 years later and did well under his guidance, the stark reality is that Wednesday dominated Sheffield football in the 1960s, coming second to the all-conquering Spurs double-winning team, and getting to the Cup Final in 1966. It reinforces my view that United must take advantage of the 2019 promotion while Wednesday are in the tier below, and become the dominant Sheffield team. Opportunities like this don't come round often.
A couple of final, very different, thoughts. The rivalry was much more low-key between supporters of the 2 clubs, at a level I feel much more comfortable with. We were rivals, but it was a rivalry at the level of football only. My friends when I was growing up were just as likely to be Wednesdayites - the main focal point of friendship was a love of football and sport in general. And this feeling was confirmed in a strange way when Wednesday lost the 1966 Cup Final. I was watching on tv, celebrating as the Everton goals went in, but the people I was watching with (mainly ex-public schoolboys I was at University with), who only knew of rugger and rowing, insisted on mocking me because my team was losing. It clarified in my mind that Wednesdayites are not the enemy - that status belongs to the privileged, self-entitled public-school educated class who view anyone from a northern working-class town or city as worthy of contempt, and know nothing of their culture. They simply 'know' that they are superior, destined to govern, as, regrettably, is still the case with Cameron, Johnson, Farage, etc. Some of them feel the need to claim that they love football, now that it is fashionable (Cameron knows he supports a team in claret and blue, but is confused as to which one it is).
All a long way from the County Cup! Apologies. Pictures of the programme follow.
 
Just reviving this fantastic nostalgic thread of HodgysBrokenThumb

A bit of sad news this past few days with the announcement that our goalkeeper from those great times Johnny Kirkwood passed away aged 87...he was a true Worcester City stalwart and legend donning the old green jersey 265 times..



And a nice tribute to him on our club website (the local paper also did one) ..

https://www.worcestercityfc.org/news/john-kirkwood--rip-2498902.html


Here he is in a couple of action shots from the Blades Cup game of '59


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I guess its fairly poignant that its 3rd Round weekend its fell upon as well....and im sure we will pay tribute to him with a minutes silence before tomorrows home game against AFC Wulfrunians (if there's one thing that Worcester City do well its remembering our proud history and past players!) ,there will be quite a few in the crowd that will have seen and remember him playing in those famous games too.

More poignant is that his funeral will take place on the 15th Jan....which coincides with the date we beat Liverpool on. Nice touch that.
 
JonnyRed(WCFC) said:
Just reviving this fantastic nostalgic thread of HodgysBrokenThumb

A bit of sad news this past few days with the announcement that our goalkeeper from those great times Johnny Kirkwood passed away aged 87...he was a true Worcester City stalwart and legend donning the old green jersey 265 times..



And a nice tribute to him on our club website (the local paper also did one) ..

https://www.worcestercityfc.org/news/john-kirkwood--rip-2498902.html


Here he is in a couple of action shots from the Blades Cup game of '59

View attachment 67875

I guess its fairly poignant that its 3rd Round weekend its fell upon as well....and im sure we will pay tribute to him with a minutes silence before tomorrows home game against AFC Wulfrunians (if there's one thing that Worcester City do well its remembering our proud history and past players!) ,there will be quite a few in the crowd that will have seen and remember him playing in those famous games too.

More poignant is that his funeral will take place on the 15th Jan....which coincides with the date we beat Liverpool on. Nice touch that.
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Thanks for that post. I hope it brings back good memories for Worcester followers. And as you say, there is a poignancy about the timing. It has brought home to me that that was the season I fell in love with the FA Cup - 3rd Round, avoided giant-killing v 3rd Division Palace; 4th Round, avoided giant-killing at Worcester, great sense of occasion there; Round 5, giant-killed the mighty Arsenal after a replay; 6th Round, tables turned as 3rd Division Norwich beat us after a replay. Nothing can beat the romance of the Cup. Except that it has now all but disappeared, for reasons we all know. And I realise I have now completely accepted it - I want none of our first-teamers anywhere near the pitch v Fylde tomorrow. An added reason for a sense of sadness at the passing of time. RIP John Kirkwood.
 
Nigella Lawson was born 60 years ago this week. The ultimate “Posh Totty” Grrrrrrrr
 

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Impeccably observed..everyone stood up in the stand...

RIP Johnny Kirkwood

🙏💜💙💚💛❤
 

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I realise this is about events 60 years ago but I want to refer to the County Cup as mentioned above. As a kid any match that took place at the Lane, first team, reserves, Northern Intermediate, league cup, FA cup and County Cup then I wanted to be there.

At the end of the 1969/70 season we played Doncaster Rovers on April 20th 1970 in the County Cup final for the season 1968/69. We won 2-0. Salmons and Woody scored. Attendance 5612. Not sure the reason why the previous years' final had to be played in April 1970.

Three days later, April 23rd 1970 we played Barnsley at the Lane in County Cup semi final for the season 1969/70.

The game ended 0-0. Attendance 4253. Brian Arblaster Barnsley keeper was MOM.

I've no record of a replay. but we could have been in a position of winning and losing the County Cup within 3 days.

I cannot recall how 5 teams Blades, Wednesday, Rotherham, Barnsley, Doncaster played a knockout competition although I have a feeling that Wednesday didn't participate.
 
bornablade said:
I realise this is about events 60 years ago but I want to refer to the County Cup as mentioned above. As a kid any match that took place at the Lane, first team, reserves, Northern Intermediate, league cup, FA cup and County Cup then I wanted to be there.

At the end of the 1969/70 season we played Doncaster Rovers on April 20th 1970 in the County Cup final for the season 1968/69. We won 2-0. Salmons and Woody scored. Attendance 5612. Not sure the reason why the previous years' final had to be played in April 1970.

Three days later, April 23rd 1970 we played Barnsley at the Lane in County Cup semi final for the season 1969/70.

The game ended 0-0. Attendance 4253. Brian Arblaster Barnsley keeper was MOM.

I've no record of a replay. but we could have been in a position of winning and losing the County Cup within 3 days.

I cannot recall how 5 teams Blades, Wednesday, Rotherham, Barnsley, Doncaster played a knockout competition although I have a feeling that Wednesday didn't participate.
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The replay was on Tuesday 3rd November 1970. Barnsley won 3-2
 
Harry Knowles RIP


Too soon after Johnny Kirkwoods passing we are now mourning the loss of one of our true legends Harry Knowles who was laid to rest this week near his home in Cornwall..

148 goals in 200 games and the only player in our history who had a part of our (old) ground named after him 'The Harry Knowles Lounge' above the dressing rooms in the old white cottage building.


Our match last Saturday was dedicated to him (along with Jordan Sinnott)
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Another excerpt from an interview done with Harry when the 50th anniversary of our famous win vs Liverpool was celebrated...


'Players, too, recall vividly the events of January 15, 1959, when City felled the mighty Anfield men.

While compiling my research I had the privilege of speaking to Lane legend Harry Knowles. It was like a window into the past, and a fascinating one at that.

In Knowles’ day, you could shoulder barge, tackle from behind and get away with borderline physical violence and no-one batted an eyelid.

Goalkeepers were fair game and accepted it — after all, just three years before City’s heroics German Bert Trautmann suffered a broken neck in an FA Cup final and played on.



Now, you have managers like Sir Alex Ferguson moaning that Ronaldo’s trickery doesn’t get enough protection from referees and woe betide anyone standing near a keeper at corners.

Knowles said: “All the managers I played under used to stand by the dressing room door when we were going out to play and would have a word with every player.

“When I went to go past him he used to say, ‘Harry, hit this bloody keeper, don’t bother with the ball’. The first cross that came over I had to run into the keeper and hit him into the back of the net. The next ball that came across he would be looking for you. I would get sent off in every match now.

“I went into the keeper against Liverpool just as I did every match but I never got sent off in my career. I was a hard player but I wasn’t a dirty player.


“I was never a clever footballer but put the ball in between myself and the keeper and we would all finish in the back of the net.”

Speaking to the 76-year-old, who plans to visit the Lane for Saturday’s match against Havant and Waterlooville, also throws into sharp perspective the current events surrounding Kaka and Manchester City.

By the end of this month we could have the first £100million player in the Premiership earning a quite obscene £500,000 a week if the Eastlands club get their way.

Knowles said: “I played one more match (after the cup game.....must've been the Blades Cup one!) for Worcester and Bill Jones came and took me down to Cardiff for £3,000. I was playing Second Division football and I was on £14 a week. (He returned back to Worcester 18 months later after not really enjoying his time at Cardiff, they tried turning him into a different player than he already was).

“I used to earn what little money I got because I am paying for it now. I have got arthritis in both knees.

“I would play for nothing if I could have my time over again, money didn’t come into it.”

Worcester City's players got a bonus for the biggest win in the club's history, and Harry had his own particular arrangement with a local fish and chip shop.

"I was getting £7 a week and we had a £5 bonus for beating Liverpool – mind you, we’d have played for nothing in those days.

"And every goal I scored, I had free fish and chips, and for the couple of weeks before the Sheffield United game we had two or three farmers come in on training nights and they brought us chickens and bags of potatoes and swedes and cabbages.

No money, but plenty of goods."



How different will the game be 50 years from now?'


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He ran through brick walls for us literally..

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Only fitting to leave the last words to Harry himself in another interview found in our archives..




RIP Harry...there won't be another like you 🙏
 
JonnyRed(WCFC) said:
Harry Knowles RIP


Too soon after Johnny Kirkwoods passing we are now mourning the loss of one of our true legends Harry Knowles who was laid to rest this week near his home in Cornwall..

148 goals in 200 games and the only player in our history who had a part of our (old) ground named after him 'The Harry Knowles Lounge' above the dressing rooms in the old white cottage building.


Our match last Saturday was dedicated to him (along with Jordan Sinnott)
index.php


index.php


Another excerpt from an interview done with Harry when the 50th anniversary of our famous win vs Liverpool was celebrated...


'Players, too, recall vividly the events of January 15, 1959, when City felled the mighty Anfield men.

While compiling my research I had the privilege of speaking to Lane legend Harry Knowles. It was like a window into the past, and a fascinating one at that.

In Knowles’ day, you could shoulder barge, tackle from behind and get away with borderline physical violence and no-one batted an eyelid.

Goalkeepers were fair game and accepted it — after all, just three years before City’s heroics German Bert Trautmann suffered a broken neck in an FA Cup final and played on.



Now, you have managers like Sir Alex Ferguson moaning that Ronaldo’s trickery doesn’t get enough protection from referees and woe betide anyone standing near a keeper at corners.

Knowles said: “All the managers I played under used to stand by the dressing room door when we were going out to play and would have a word with every player.

“When I went to go past him he used to say, ‘Harry, hit this bloody keeper, don’t bother with the ball’. The first cross that came over I had to run into the keeper and hit him into the back of the net. The next ball that came across he would be looking for you. I would get sent off in every match now.

“I went into the keeper against Liverpool just as I did every match but I never got sent off in my career. I was a hard player but I wasn’t a dirty player.


“I was never a clever footballer but put the ball in between myself and the keeper and we would all finish in the back of the net.”

Speaking to the 76-year-old, who plans to visit the Lane for Saturday’s match against Havant and Waterlooville, also throws into sharp perspective the current events surrounding Kaka and Manchester City.

By the end of this month we could have the first £100million player in the Premiership earning a quite obscene £500,000 a week if the Eastlands club get their way.

Knowles said: “I played one more match (after the cup game.....must've been the Blades Cup one!) for Worcester and Bill Jones came and took me down to Cardiff for £3,000. I was playing Second Division football and I was on £14 a week. (He returned back to Worcester 18 months later after not really enjoying his time at Cardiff, they tried turning him into a different player than he already was).

“I used to earn what little money I got because I am paying for it now. I have got arthritis in both knees.

“I would play for nothing if I could have my time over again, money didn’t come into it.”

Worcester City's players got a bonus for the biggest win in the club's history, and Harry had his own particular arrangement with a local fish and chip shop.

"I was getting £7 a week and we had a £5 bonus for beating Liverpool – mind you, we’d have played for nothing in those days.

"And every goal I scored, I had free fish and chips, and for the couple of weeks before the Sheffield United game we had two or three farmers come in on training nights and they brought us chickens and bags of potatoes and swedes and cabbages.

No money, but plenty of goods."



How different will the game be 50 years from now?'


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He ran through brick walls for us literally..

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Only fitting to leave the last words to Harry himself in another interview found in our archives..




RIP Harry...there won't be another like you 🙏
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Thanks for the great archive material. Utd must have won the 4th round match because of all the free fish and chips your lads had been eating! Perhaps a tactic for Bielsa to try...?
 
As the first pre-season friendly of 1960-61 was played on August 11, 1960, it is time for me to start the recollections of what is for me still my favourite season of all time. I am not claiming that it was United's greatest season, though it was a great success, but I was 13 at the time, lived and breathed football and United, and had the freedom (when not playing school football on a Saturday morning) to travel around the country watching the Blades. What was not to like?
Strangely (perhaps others felt the same), I rather forgot about United in the summer. I was into playing and watching cricket, transfers were not the obsession they have become, and it used to be only as the league matches started that the enthusiasm fully returned. Pre-season Friendlies tended not to grab my attention; again, I suspect others felt the same.
So I would like to begin with a thought prompted by the squad picture posted by Silent Blade (post 202 above). The squad was big, although most of those pictured were unlikely to appear much in the first team. What is remarkable, and says a great deal about football at the time, is that in the picture are 3 right-backs, all of whom were with United for more than 10 years. All 3 came from around Sheffield, and played almost all their football with United.
1 Cec Coldwell (captain)
The word stalwart could have been invented for him. He came through the hard way, via Norton Woodseats, and established himself at right-back at the Lane for many years. He did what right-backs did then - tried to stop the opposing left-winger creating chances for the centre-forward. Just as we now are annoyed at how often opposition fans claim their team played badly in losing to us, so it seemed that feared left-wingers often had an off-day against us, until it became clear that it was Coldwell’s defending that was the reason. He basically defended a triangle drawn from the goal to the corner flag and up to the half-way line, and was expert in tackling, positional play, etc. He rarely went over the half-way line, and if he did,there was a buzz of mock excitement. He scored just 2 goals, one of which was in 60-61.He was also a gentleman, and much-respected.
2 Roy Ridge (back row, partially hidden)
Was with United for over 10 years, yet most people have never heard of him. Was Coldwell’s understudy, and played just 11 league games. No substitutes were allowed then, so he played for years in the reserves. He seemed a reasonable player, and eventually went to Rochdale, where he played regularly for 2 years. Hard to imagine anyone doing anything remotely similar now.
3 Len Badger (front row, left)
Len Badger was a kid at the time, but went on to be an outstanding player, unlucky not to be capped for England.Times were changing. He was a good footballer, having played in midfield as a youth, and he occasionally played there in the seventies. He was encouraged to attack as well as defend, and had much wider responsibility as a result. The evolution to wing-back was beginning.
3 players in 1 photo, same position, very different careers and contributions, great professionals, all part of United’s history, and revealing of the way football was, and how it was developing.
 
HodgysBrokenThumb said:
As the first pre-season friendly of 1960-61 was played on August 11, 1960, it is time for me to start the recollections of what is for me still my favourite season of all time. I am not claiming that it was United's greatest season, though it was a great success, but I was 13 at the time, lived and breathed football and United, and had the freedom (when not playing school football on a Saturday morning) to travel around the country watching the Blades. What was not to like?
Strangely (perhaps others felt the same), I rather forgot about United in the summer. I was into playing and watching cricket, transfers were not the obsession they have become, and it used to be only as the league matches started that the enthusiasm fully returned. Pre-season Friendlies tended not to grab my attention; again, I suspect others felt the same.
So I would like to begin with a thought prompted by the squad picture posted by Silent Blade (post 202 above). The squad was big, although most of those pictured were unlikely to appear much in the first team. What is remarkable, and says a great deal about football at the time, is that in the picture are 3 right-backs, all of whom were with United for more than 10 years. All 3 came from around Sheffield, and played almost all their football with United.
1 Cec Coldwell (captain)
The word stalwart could have been invented for him. He came through the hard way, via Norton Woodseats, and established himself at right-back at the Lane for many years. He did what right-backs did then - tried to stop the opposing left-winger creating chances for the centre-forward. Just as we now are annoyed at how often opposition fans claim their team played badly in losing to us, so it seemed that feared left-wingers often had an off-day against us, until it became clear that it was Coldwell’s defending that was the reason. He basically defended a triangle drawn from the goal to the corner flag and up to the half-way line, and was expert in tackling, positional play, etc. He rarely went over the half-way line, and if he did,there was a buzz of mock excitement. He scored just 2 goals, one of which was in 60-61.He was also a gentleman, and much-respected.
2 Roy Ridge (back row, partially hidden)
Was with United for over 10 years, yet most people have never heard of him. Was Coldwell’s understudy, and played just 11 league games. No substitutes were allowed then, so he played for years in the reserves. He seemed a reasonable player, and eventually went to Rochdale, where he played regularly for 2 years. Hard to imagine anyone doing anything remotely similar now.
3 Len Badger (front row, left)
Len Badger was a kid at the time, but went on to be an outstanding player, unlucky not to be capped for England.Times were changing. He was a good footballer, having played in midfield as a youth, and he occasionally played there in the seventies. He was encouraged to attack as well as defend, and had much wider responsibility as a result. The evolution to wing-back was beginning.
3 players in 1 photo, same position, very different careers and contributions, great professionals, all part of United’s history, and revealing of the way football was, and how it was developing.
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As I didn't get into watching the Blades until 6 years later than you was it usual to follow your club away from home regularly, were their designated coaches etc ? I'd got it into my head that following your team away was a mid to late 1960s phenomenon.

And you're right about cricket, it was as all consuming in summer as football was in autumn and winter. It just seemed natural and life seemed clearly demarcated into seasons. I was as mad Yorkshire as I was United.

I'm not sure what happened to my interest in cricket ?
 

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