Too Much, Too Soon?

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Chezzy_Blade

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What was it? Something like 7 newbies in the starting XI when the season opened? Now don't get me wrong we haven't been totally useless it seems we have had spells in the first half of both of our 2 previous games however we have been far from consistent over 90 minutes and overall things just don't seem to have knitted. Certain players evidently haven't gelled yet and it has all very much been a working process.

I called for the experienced Collins to be brought back into the mix as the make shirt central pairing wasn't up to scratch or if people would prefer they weren't on the same wavelength or hadn't gelled however you prefer to put it, either way they conceded sloppy goals. A few on here called for the level head of Michael Doyle to be thrown back into the mix again, a few knocked him and his captaincy skills midway through last season however in these opening fixtures it became hugely apparent that we lacked the control and composure that a player like Doyle gives in the middle of the park along with his physical presence.

Rome wasn't built in a day as the old saying goes and you would have to be ridiculously lucky to thrown a new back four together and to be frank pretty much a new team and for it to hit the ground running.

So is this what we put it down to? Did Mr Clough do too much, too soon? Does he continue to try and blood all of these new players into regular first team action or does he stick with his "old guard" as the foundations of his team and put in players around them?

To be honest I thought this is what he would considering the success we had last year. I am over the moon that we have signed players of quality and expect them all to play a part however the transition has to be made over time. The back four is the most important part of a team for me because if you don't concede goals, you don't lose games, so let's get this right and get our old boy Collins in there. For me I would throw butler into the mix as opposed to McGahey but a good few reckon he is worth investing a bit of faith in so we shall see. We need that physical presence in the middle of the park and Doyle seems to offer that sooo......You get the picture. Our long term players might not be full of flair and overly prolific but they are experience and know eachother and will get results.
 

OK i can't resist the temptation to elaborate a bit more.

I'm a firm believer in the "earn your shirt" philosophy. I do think our Nige has caused unnecessary problems by seemingly discarding experienced players. I'm not a big fan of Collins and Doyle, but it's not obvious at all that the players coming in are any better or even as good. It would have made much more sense to stick with them and ease the new signings in gently. Especially having lost Maguire, Coady and Brayford anyway. He's made a right mess of it, and tonight's selection shows he knows he has.

I suspect his idea was to bomb them both out of the club, they're no doubt on decent wages and aren't really going to be happy sat on the bench with kids in the first team ahead of them. But now he's put them back in, desperate to get points and we have them, very awkward situation. Does he just keep them in the team like nothing happened? They're all professionals, it happens in football, but it is awkward for any manager to have players in your team who know you don't really want them there. Or does he bring in yet more replacements, then let them go?
 
Big fan of Clough, was incredulous at the discarding of Collins and Doyle but benefit of doubt was given..but its two games, we can win the next 43 with them in place... maybe...
 
Perhaps it is a little less sinister than that?

To me, it may well have been Clough trying to give our players from last season a little more time. It was a long, hard season. Several of our players, Scougal, Flynn, Harris etc have been playing under par thus far and were given a little longer off than the other teams before our pre-season began.

When pre-season started, results and performances from our best players were scratchy

Perhaps this bit us in the bum the first two games, but perhaps over a long, hard season, when we want to be at our best, it will pay dividends.?

Either way, we got our first win, in the League, confidence will return and I'm sure, though there will be bumps along the road, we will prevail.
 
Chezzy_Blade It’s still very early, one league win in three doesn’t mean we’re out of the woods, just like it doesn’t mean that its panic stations or panic buy time. Probably the worst thing we could do is to jump into the market before the transfer window closes, play an overly inflated price for a player that isn’t going to give us anything more than we’ve got just because we lost a couple and played badly.
I think yes, throwing so many new players into the starting line up was a risk, but its given those players experience and an opportunity based on merit. Long term this could be really beneficial to the side, it shows Clough isn’t afraid to drop anyone, it shows that to keep your shirt you have to keep earning that right. Competition for places will be great now. Those that think they have a right to a slot will be rethinking their position at the club or fighting to make their way back in now, hoping for an opportunity. I said after Bristol that I think the back four won’t be settled until end of August, I’d add ‘at least’ to that statement now, but Coventry apart, we’re getting goals and all over the pitch which is encouraging.

Bringing Doyle back is a positive, it certainly keeps people on their toes and yet again it will keep him on his toes. Finished the last season very strongly, he was probably one of the best performers in our excellent run (after he came back from suspension) but he’s not been the first choice so far this season.

I think Clough expected too much from the new side, maybe put too much faith in them, maybe the expectation was warranted based on his own experience and from watching the performances in preseason training and games. Now it’s about getting the side settled, but also bringing in the younger lads.

One thing is for sure, we have plenty of cover, perhaps right back isn’t really covered enough with a direct replacement. You look at the squad and see that we have a side littered with players who could potentially influence the outcome of a game – Flynn, Murphy, JCR, Baxter, Higdon, McNulty and Scoogs all fit this bill. Alongside those we have grafters, I think now we have a very balanced side of match winners and grafters. If we lost one of the players like Murphy for a few games, we have plenty of options in the squad.

Good to get that win under the belts, especially against Peterborough as I think they’ll be up there, but we need to now kick on a little. In many ways its nice to read that the Peterborough fans thought we were physical, we certainly weren’t against Bristol and the commentary v Coventry sounded like we were toothless there too. Its good that we had some bite and fight in there last night
So next step for me is to make ourselves a horrible side to play against, a difficult side to beat, a side with presence. Looking at last night’s bench, we had a potentially a group of players that would be either matching the lad they replaced or bettering them. Higdon and JCR on the bench must be a worry for opposition teams.
Long way to go, but positive that we got that win!
 
I should also add that i think the loan market will be used again to good effect like it was last season. We've had success with the likes of Harris (initially loan), Davies, Freeman, Brayford and Coady, I expect the same this year. I guess this is where the right back/ Centre half will come from and possibly another striker.

On top of that, its encouraging that Clough also wants to use the likes of Reed, Diego et al but i think they'll start to play more of a role once the season is under way. Perhaps from Oct to December and then again February to March and beyond if they've done well.
 
Sorry Chezzy but you really must do better if you are to out cliché swizzler. Plus marks for Rome wasn't built in a day but surely there could have been a boy done good or game of two halves and 90 minutes chucked in.
 
Sorry Chezzy but you really must do better if you are to out cliché swizzler. Plus marks for Rome wasn't built in a day but surely there could have been a boy done good or game of two halves and 90 minutes chucked in.

At the end of the day, all things considered, you have to say it's a noble effort. He didn't put all his eggs in one basket, didn't try to pull the wool over peoples eyes, played it with a straight bat, wasn't caught with his pants down and he didn't cut off his nose to spite his face. But, despite giving 110% and I have no bones about that, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. It's early days and it's not over until the fat lady sings, keep your nose to the grindstone and good things come to those who wait. Break a leg!
 
Sorry Chezzy but you really must do better if you are to out cliché swizzler. Plus marks for Rome wasn't built in a day but surely there could have been a boy done good or game of two halves and 90 minutes chucked in.

Its football isn't it, jumpers for goalposts....
 
Chezzy_Blade It’s still very early, one league win in three doesn’t mean we’re out of the woods, just like it doesn’t mean that its panic stations or panic buy time. Probably the worst thing we could do is to jump into the market before the transfer window closes, play an overly inflated price for a player that isn’t going to give us anything more than we’ve got just because we lost a couple and played badly.
I think yes, throwing so many new players into the starting line up was a risk, but its given those players experience and an opportunity based on merit. Long term this could be really beneficial to the side, it shows Clough isn’t afraid to drop anyone, it shows that to keep your shirt you have to keep earning that right. Competition for places will be great now. Those that think they have a right to a slot will be rethinking their position at the club or fighting to make their way back in now, hoping for an opportunity. I said after Bristol that I think the back four won’t be settled until end of August, I’d add ‘at least’ to that statement now, but Coventry apart, we’re getting goals and all over the pitch which is encouraging.

Bringing Doyle back is a positive, it certainly keeps people on their toes and yet again it will keep him on his toes. Finished the last season very strongly, he was probably one of the best performers in our excellent run (after he came back from suspension) but he’s not been the first choice so far this season.

I think Clough expected too much from the new side, maybe put too much faith in them, maybe the expectation was warranted based on his own experience and from watching the performances in preseason training and games. Now it’s about getting the side settled, but also bringing in the younger lads.

One thing is for sure, we have plenty of cover, perhaps right back isn’t really covered enough with a direct replacement. You look at the squad and see that we have a side littered with players who could potentially influence the outcome of a game – Flynn, Murphy, JCR, Baxter, Higdon, McNulty and Scoogs all fit this bill. Alongside those we have grafters, I think now we have a very balanced side of match winners and grafters. If we lost one of the players like Murphy for a few games, we have plenty of options in the squad.

Good to get that win under the belts, especially against Peterborough as I think they’ll be up there, but we need to now kick on a little. In many ways its nice to read that the Peterborough fans thought we were physical, we certainly weren’t against Bristol and the commentary v Coventry sounded like we were toothless there too. Its good that we had some bite and fight in there last night
So next step for me is to make ourselves a horrible side to play against, a difficult side to beat, a side with presence. Looking at last night’s bench, we had a potentially a group of players that would be either matching the lad they replaced or bettering them. Higdon and JCR on the bench must be a worry for opposition teams.
Long way to go, but positive that we got that win!
Good post swizzler,the only gripe i have with it is if Murphy was to get injured,we would miss him no end.He's so direct and he showed glimpses of his best last night and for me we don't have anyone of his calibre in our side.JCR fanny's around with it too much,Flynny doesn't take his man on enough and i just don't think we have anyone near Murphy's standard,apart from that were in decent shape to kick on.Its amazing what happens when we go back to basics.Well done blades.
 
A few cliches missing:
What no "it's been a roller coaster ride" on a "journey" that was a "learning curve"?
 

I think Doyle might have to give way to Wallace when the latter is fully match fit.
 
I agree that it's likely they'll use the loan market, hopefully to good effect, but I still think it's poor from the club that they haven't given Clough the money that's come into the club (£3m+) to secure decent permanent signings at centre half, right back and midfield.

The cheap option over the last few seasons has sent the club backwards.
 
At the end of the day, all things considered, you have to say it's a noble effort. He didn't put all his eggs in one basket, didn't try to pull the wool over peoples eyes, played it with a straight bat, wasn't caught with his pants down and he didn't cut off his nose to spite his face. But, despite giving 110% and I have no bones about that, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. It's early days and it's not over until the fat lady sings, keep your nose to the grindstone and good things come to those who wait. Break a leg!
But we're they " over the moon " as a result .
 

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