Neil Collins.

[Woodwardfan]

Great interview covered by the Yorkshire post today, sorry I don't know how to link it. I must say Collins always interviews well and will probably make a good manager one day.

OK it's not rocket science what he's saying but simple common sense.

He is asked whether clean sheets are just as important as goals and he says they are important but not that important. He says promotion teams always have their fair share of goalscorers and that is a necessity. He doesn't actually say we don't have enough but that is the implication.

The article points out he is the only remaining back 4 player from last season and that obvious challenge is teased out, but he answers it without saying any more than acknowledging his partnership with Maguire, and without truly endorsing his belief in McGahey; that was my interpretation anyway. He hopes the back 4 is settled before long.

The big point to me was that he regards this stage of the season as very much a pre-cursor for what comes at the sharp end. He says that many teams look a lot different in March compared to the super charged versions we see in August and September. This has a lot to do with optimism as compared to reality and the depth of squads in particular. The message from the vice captain is that experience tells you to stay calm and grow into the season. In other words wait to some degree for the early pacesetters to come back to you. Not that we would not wish to have done better, but don't lose sight of the number of new recruits we needed/ didn't choose to add in the summer. Also don't lose sight of the depth of our squad.

I read the article over a coffee in a rushed break this morning. If there is some poetic licence in there please forgive me, but I do respect Neil Collins for what he is: an intelligent, honest person and player, who does his best for the club and us fans 100% of the time.

I think he feels another medal coming along if we get a new striker or two, and perhaps a new defender?!



Neil is spelled Neill, for some reason, sorry.

 

[sitwell]

My one question over this is ,why is he not captain material ?

 

[Woodwardfan]

My one question over this is ,why is he not captain material ?

I think he would make a good captain. What do you think?

 

[Wards]

On that point I found it odd that Mcgahey was the leading defender on Saturday I.e. the one barking out orders, setting the defensive line, pulling the full backs etc.

Reckon we'll see a captain out of him before Collins

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Seen enough of Collins over the last few years to say he should never captain the Blades.
Saw 15 minutes of Wallace to think he may very well captain the Blades.

UTB

 

[sitwell]

I think he would make a good captain. What do you think?

I always thought he would but he is either overlooked or doesn't want it ,with several managers.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Seen enough of Collins over the last few years to say he should never captain the Blades.
Saw 15 minutes of Wallace to think he may very well captain the Blades.

UTB

Sorry mate but that is naive. Looks quality player though.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

naïve? - extremely strange word to use - please explain what you mean, I really don't understand your context.

for me Collins:

does not talk
is not good enough in the team to command a regular place and therefore warrant being captain
if he hasn't been considered captain by x number of different managers then he never will be.

Wallace:

better player than this what this level is - so if fit then guaranteed place
talks/points/tells other players what to do.
is very keen to boss the game - obvious in 15 minutes on Saturday (and for the nearly half game at York)

Clough: Higdon was a strange choice of captain when Doyle didn't play which says NC didn't want any of the normal regulars
Wallace could well be captain therefore when Doyle doesn't play or is replaced by a midfield centre pairing of Wallace and Basham.

and you: pick a captain out of the team - without Doyle - that would be too easy!

UTB

 

[LSF]

I always thought he would but he is either overlooked or doesn't want it ,with several managers.

He's uncomfortable with the captaincy. Some are natural leaders, some aren't. He always has plenty to say on the field but some players use that to release tension and keep focussed.
The more leaders we have on the field the better, only one of the fuckers can lead out and toss up though, hence my theory, the captain is no big deal.

 

[Woodwardfan]

naïve? - extremely strange word to use - please explain what you mean, I really don't understand your context.

for me Collins:

does not talk
is not good enough in the team to command a regular place and therefore warrant being captain
if he hasn't been considered captain by x number of different managers then he never will be.

Wallace:

better player than this what this level is - so if fit then guaranteed place
talks/points/tells other players what to do.
is very keen to boss the game - obvious in 15 minutes on Saturday (and for the nearly half game at York)

Clough: Higdon was a strange choice of captain when Doyle didn't play which says NC didn't want any of the normal regulars
Wallace could well be captain therefore when Doyle doesn't play or is replaced by a midfield centre pairing of Wallace and Basham.

and you: pick a captain out of the team - without Doyle - that would be too easy!

UTB

Apologies Fulwood. If you see that after watching the young lad for one hour then he is exceptional. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Talking about the captaincy, how bizarre that Higdon was captain for the day on his debut.

Fans will read a lot into that Clough decision and he had both Collins and Doyle on the bench. Bizarre.

I always look for positives in Clough, but none of us are in good spirits at present.

 

[alcoblade]

I always look for positives in Clough, but none of us are in good spirits at present.

I'm not so sure? I'm a bit disappointed and a bit puzzled with our current situation. But all it takes is a decent loanee, and / or Higdon hitting form, and it will start to look much brighter. And remember, we're unbeaten in 5, have just taken 4 points from the top 2 away from home, and dicked the Shammers on their own turf.

Whilst we're right to demand (relatively) high standards from our club, who aren't quite matching up right now, there's a fair bit to be (relatively) positive about.

UTB

 

[sheffielder]

Apologies Fulwood. If you see that after watching the young lad for one hour then he is exceptional. Nothing wrong with that.

He was captain of Tranmere, and if you were at the game on Saturday you would have seen him directing operations and running the show. He had Baxter running his bollox off for the last 10 minutes, pointing where to go and what to do. Maybe I am naive too.

 

[Woodwardfan]

On reflection this is a poor thread, sorry about that. The OP wasn't about Collins for captain, just an observation about him interviewing well and being articulate and intelligent and possibly making a good manager one day.

I hope Wallace is captaincy material at his young age. I know Moore made him captain and was clearly delighted to have such a quality player on his books. I think he will have to earn the right to be captain of United in the company of good experienced senior pros though. The suggestion above was not naive and I take that back. If the lad establishes himself as one of our main men and brings even more out of Baxter we will all be happy. Certainly the opportunity is there if Wallace can get himself fit. If he becomes captain it will be reward for such an impact and boy do we need it at present.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

It seems quite clear that Collins' days are numbered. McGahey may have stepped up quicker than NC thought but is definitely one to persevere with, he brought in Butler but that's not worked for whatever reason but is actively looking for another CB which suggests he would walk straight into the team. We've already seen Alcock in there ahead of Collins this season and McEveley can also play there so as good a professional he may be, I think his days are numbered.

 

[wizadry]

It seems quite clear that Collins' days are numbered. McGahey may have stepped up quicker than NC thought but is definitely one to persevere with, he brought in Butler but that's not worked for whatever reason but is actively looking for another CB which suggests he would walk straight into the team. We've already seen Alcock in there ahead of Collins this season and McEveley can also play there so as good a professional he may be, I think his days are numbered.

Collins brought Maguire on no end through his early career and he will do the same with McGahey imo.I think as they play more games together this partnership can only get better,the same happened with Collins and Maguire,so i see no reason for Cloughy to drop Collins imo,although i could be proved wrong.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

Collins brought Maguire on no end through his early career and he will do the same with McGahey imo.I think as they play more games together this partnership can only get better,the same happened with Collins and Maguire,so i see no reason for Cloughy to drop Collins imo,although i could be proved wrong.

There's a difference between dropping him and replacing him. Same goes with Doyle IMO.

 

[wizadry]

There's a difference between dropping him and replacing him. Same goes with Doyle IMO.

You said Collins days are numbered,i don't think they are.If you think his days are numbered then that would be seen as dropping him and at this time i see no reason to do that as it is our attacking side of the game that needs sorting out more than the defensive side.Replacing him would be through injury or something along those lines,you aren't saying that though,your saying his days are numbered and that to me inclines not good enough so should be dropped,in which case i think is rather strange considering the run we're on and what Collins did with Maguire.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

You said Collins days are numbered,i don't think they are.If you think his days are numbered then that would be seen as dropping him and at this time i see no reason to do that as it is our attacking side of the game that needs sorting out more than the defensive side.Replacing him would be through injury or something along those lines,you aren't saying that though,your saying his days are numbered and that to me inclines not good enough so should be dropped,in which case i think is rather strange considering the run we're on and what Collins did with Maguire.

Why did Clough bring Butler and McGahey in in the Summer ?
Why did he play Alcock ahead of Collins on the opening day ?
Why have we been bidding for a Chumpionship centre back ?

All these things suggest Collins' days are numbered. I am not suggesting dropping him at this stage, I am saying he will be replaced sooner rather than later IMO.

 

[sitwell]

I heard from an ITK er that Butler came playing the big 'I am' telling everyone what a great captain he was and he would run the team .Doyle and Collins backed him up ,this put Cluffies nose out of joint ,hence Butler being powdered off until or if he tows the line ,and Doyle/Collins being dropped early season. Shows whos in charge and preventing a clique forming amongst the senior players.

 

[wizadry]

Why did Clough bring Butler and McGahey in in the Summer ?
Why did he play Alcock ahead of Collins on the opening day ?
Why have we been bidding for a Chumpionship centre back ?

All these things suggest Collins' days are numbered. I am not suggesting dropping him at this stage, I am saying he will be replaced sooner rather than later IMO.

Can't really debate anything there jim,what i will say though is i think we have moved on from the summer and those first couple of games,where we certainly needed things changing.I think Cloughy has realised this aswell,and this was one of the reasons behind what i said regarding Collins,but i do see where you're coming from now.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

Can't really debate anything there jim,what i will say though is i think we have moved on from the summer and those first couple of games,where we certainly needed things changing, and i think Cloughy has realised this aswell,and this was one of the reasons behind what i said regarding Collins,but i do see where you're coming from now.

I agree and in Clough's defence (as he hinted at in his recent interview), his plans have been scuppered on several fronts, Butler hasn't worked out, Reed and McGahey surprised him pre-season, Wallace's injuries, not to mention 3 key players in Murphy/Flynn/Scougal not turning up yet this season.

I don't think he's played anything like the team he had in mind at the beginning of August and as you say, the personnel has changed significantly already since then. The fact he's still saying we need 3 players suggests to me that Collins and Doyle to name 2 are probably replaceable in his eyes but at the moment, they are, and probably should be, playing.

 

[Hodgyman]

I don't believe that Collins is the best centre half we've had but please don't underestimate his value to our upturn in results since his return.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

I don't believe that Collins is the best centre half we've had but please don't underestimate his value to our upturn in results since his return.

No problems with Collins (or Doyle) being in the team at the moment and doubtless they have played a part but as discussed previously, if we are to step up from being top 8 to top 2, improvements have to be made. Those 2 have been the consistent spine in the team for the past 4 seasons where we have consistently finished in a worse position season on season and that is also not a coincidence. Cast your mind back to the relegation season and these were the two who probably received the most criticism, Monty aside of course

 

[Balham Blade]

There's a difference between dropping him and replacing [Collins]. Same goes with Doyle IMO.

If the rumours about their relative salaries are correct then there's also probably an element of future planning there - those two are the only remaining players from the Championship days. I believe that their contracts are up at the end of this season too: it'll be interesting to see whether we retain either (or both).

Cast your mind back to the relegation season and these were the two who probably received the most criticism, Monty aside of course

Quinn? Evans? Nosworthy...and pretty much every loan signing made by Adams?!

 

[alcoblade]

Why did Clough bring Butler and McGahey in in the Summer ?
Why did he play Alcock ahead of Collins on the opening day ?
Why have we been bidding for a Chumpionship centre back ?

All these things suggest Collins' days are numbered. I am not suggesting dropping him at this stage, I am saying he will be replaced sooner rather than later IMO.

We needed a CH before Maguire left, and it was obvious that he'd be gone - so we were always going to need at least 2.

I'm sure he'd like to improve that position, just as any other, But I suspect the pre season performance of Butler, and the never ending issue of lack of goals, would have turned his head elsewhere.

I think we'll see lots more of Collins yet, though as with any footballer, their days are numbered.

UTB

 

[alcoblade]

No problems with Collins (or Doyle) being in the team at the moment and doubtless they have played a part but as discussed previously, if we are to step up from being top 8 to top 2, improvements have to be made. Those 2 have been the consistent spine in the team for the past 4 seasons where we have consistently finished in a worse position season on season and that is also not a coincidence. Cast your mind back to the relegation season and these were the two who probably received the most criticism, Monty aside of course

We were relegated, and then missed out on promotion, more as a result of Ched Evans' lack of performance, in more ways than one. And we'll be bringing him back very shortly - so I'm not sure what you say follows.

I have to say though that Collins, along with Evans, was truly awful in the Championship. To be fair to Collins, that was for a much shorter period than Evans.

UTB

 

[sheffielder]

We tried to replace Doyle and Collins on the cheap (can't believe anyone would think that is possible) and it didn't work. I know Doyle has improved, however I can't believe that anyone thinks they have improved that much that Collins is even spoke about as a captain. I think it's more that our own standards have dropped.

 

[Esablade]

On reflection this is a poor thread, sorry about that. The OP wasn't about Collins for captain, just an observation about him interviewing well and being articulate and intelligent and possibly making a good manager one day.

I hope Wallace is captaincy material at his young age. I know Moore made him captain and was clearly delighted to have such a quality player on his books. I think he will have to earn the right to be captain of United in the company of good experienced senior pros though. The suggestion above was not naive and I take that back. If the lad establishes himself as one of our main men and brings even more out of Baxter we will all be happy. Certainly the opportunity is there if Wallace can get himself fit. If he becomes captain it will be reward for such an impact and boy do we need it at present.

Good OP IMO!

Got people talking about Collins' strength's and weaknesses...which is good, because he's often overlooked.

 

[LSF]

We tried to replace Doyle and Collins on the cheap (can't believe anyone would think that is possible) and it didn't work. I know Doyle has improved, however I can't believe that anyone thinks they have improved that much that Collins is even spoke about as a captain. I think it's more that our own standards have dropped.

I'm trying to understand the correlation between 'improving that much' and being made captain??